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Level 229 Comments: Mind Blower
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I know quite a few anti gun people and they're almost all against the militarization of police as well. A police state isn't defined by the people not having guns, it's about the police having tanks and unchecked power
among other things
You guys always characterize anyone you disagree with as being some whiny hipster douchebag. Some people just don't like guns. Some people think the government's role is to provide opportunity and services not to kill people
unless it's necessary
. These are legitimate views, they've been around before plaid shirts ad they'll be around after.
That's the thing, those aren't completely legitimate views. It may be that way for a little bit, but as common troll said, power corrupts and if you can't fight oppression and tyranny physically, how can you fight it? The answer is, that you can't. There is nothing wrong with disliking guns, but there is something wrong with this fantasy of thinking that your rights wont slowly be diluted if you can't somehow stand up for it. And physically standing up for it is a full-proof way(if they actually stand up for it)Its already slowly happening all over the world and its even happening in America. But the difference is (I would like to believe) that there would finally be a breaking point and the Americans would finally stand up for themselves.
Ok well then let me ask you: how have rights been acquired in the US?
For the most part it's been through my way, peaceful protests, voting and the witholding of labour. Guns were pretty key in the civil war for establishing the rights of black people to not be property, but other than that they have not in fact worked well.
If you make a point like "Cops shouldn't kill people" but you make that while waving a gun around, you are in fact demonstrating their point that the job is dangerous and the people are a lethal threat.
The more radical and militarized the people are, the more radical and militarized the government is.
Please stop fantasising. You could arm tens of millions of American citizens and the army military would crush any insurrection within a couple of weeks.
You wouldn't believe how many service members would straight up side with an armed uprising, or at the very least, refuse to fight it. As a rule, they tend to believe that what they do is for the people, not for the government. You are right in one regard though, only arming tens of millions of average civilians with firearms and giving them vague instructions that the government needs to be fought would be a disaster, but if you take even 1 million competent people, give them basic firearms and guerrilla training, and help them work together, there's not a force in the world that could stop them on their home turf, I.E. Afghanistan, Vietnam.
tl;dr yes, but only because training is more important than being armed
in reality, Americans are not nearly as willing to fight their government as your average Afghan or Vietnamese person. I don't think anyone can argue that Americans are coddled to the extreme compared to those countries you've just listed and most would have no idea how to survive on the land without stores or have the skill/morale to wage an effective insurrection.
plus the government would maintain control of most media and inevitably paint any rebellion as unjust or psychotically violent, and chances are they'd receive international aid.
plus, many soldiers unwilling to fight would be guilty of treason/disobeying direct orders/et cetera and be imprisoned or executed quite quickly.
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They don't need tanks to be unchecked if the people don't have guns. Power corrupts, and when the people can't fight oppression physically, what's going to stop the government from going further and further?
And no, cops wouldn't ever be disarmed, because we'd still have criminals.
Do you really think the best way to demilitarize the police is to have a gun? You live in the United States (I assume), why not try legitimate channels instead of violence. These channels have vastly expanded rights for average Americans, violent uprisings have done little
For example, if marijuana became legal then the police would lose a lot of their power and 1 % of the American population wouldn't be in prison. If other drugs were met with treatment instead of property seizure and lengthy jail-time then this would further the cause.
I know an armed uprising sounds nice but it would be absolutely terrible. The great thing about America is not the bullet but the ballot, that is how you've won rights and regulated power in the past
Very few gun owners actually want an uprising, because they don't want to go through that or get to the point where it's needed. But having an armed population is a great deterrent against tyranny. So to have your rights, specifically the right to bear arms slowly stripped from you until there is a massive difference in power between government and civilians means you're going to have a bad time in the future.
As for legalizing drugs and such, that will only make a portion of drug dealers turn to more violent and harming crimes, and will cause cartels and such to be more violent and aggressive. For sure when only marijuana is legalized, as evidence has shown. No matter what, America still has to deal with a continent and a half of utter shit below us that comes right up to a sparsely populated land border. Our police will be armed for the foreseeable future. Even Europe has armed police, French police carry a FAMAS on street patrols. Liberty and the protection of the rights of the people comes before even a false sense of security.
I'm not advocating for unarmed police, I've literally never said that anywhere. And there is no evidence that legalizing drugs increases violence, anywhere. I've looked for it it does not exist.
And nobody is restricting gun rights in the US, that's a republican fantasy. People have more weapons, with larger caliber and magazines than ever before. Still, not once has something been changed in the last 50 years because of these guns.
Stop being so paranoid and assuming the government only functions because they're afraid you'll shoot them. They've got bigger guns anyway if that's your argument
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Just like with everything else.
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