That's not how genuine belief works. It's not something you can mount above your mantle until the person that bought it for you wants to see you use it. You either do believe or you don't.

But see, about 70% of the population of America, is straddiling between believeing it or not. I am one of those people although I am Bias towards christains 8D

That 70% is a group of mindless sheep. They go where the herd goes, do as the herd does, eat what the herd eats, and die as the herd dies. But do any of them actually have anywhere to go when they're dead? They don't know. They think that believing in God is an "I'll see what happens when I get there" kind of thing. But it's not.

And believing that god doesnt exist is the same thing to what you people do, like you believe that god doesnt exist and you will get to no where when you die, which is to us the 70% of the population a laugh, because your saying that there will be nowhere to go. Since when is there a law that a person cannot believe in what they want to believe in? There isnt, is there? My point is you people should shut your mouths because your bringing up the topic of "Oh you go nowhere when you die." Which makes us say "Hah, so what are you going to do when your staring god in the face and he sends you to your own special hell?" and you would quickly reply "But what if you dont get there?" making us say "What if you do?" and that is all it is, what if?

Yet another gross misinterpretation of what I said. I never said that people didn't have the right to choose what they want to believe. I said that a belief of convenience may as well be no belief at all. What are YOU going to do if you end up staring God in the face and He asks you what you've done in your life that makes you a Christian? The Bible states that God can see your heart and knows your thoughts, so you can't say "I've always been a devout Christian!" because you'll be lying. The only true thing you could say is "I've always maybe sometimes believed in you kind of."

And that just doesn't cut it. You'll get to come live with me in my 'own special Hell'

datdenniskid said he's Agnostic, not Atheistic. And the thing you're talking about is one of the things that made me stray from Christianity. If God wants all his children to go to Heaven, why did he give us free will to choose a path that goes anywhere else? He's all knowing, all powerful, and in total control, right? Then why can't he just make me believe what he wants me to?

Because He would receive absolutely zero pleasure from you pleasing Him by force.

Then what was the point of creating us at all? And what DOES he get pleasure from? Watching us burn? Because according to what it takes to get to Heaven, he's going to get a lot of that.

God is pleased when we use our free will to praise and serve him. It says in the Bible that we were created for his pleasure!

That ones a killer issue and the only thing I can say to argue that is that God made free will and He knew what we were gonna do with it not what He was gonna make us do with it He knows all of what's gonna happen but He didn't make it that way He made us He gave us free will and let us run wild...eve used the free will to go against God and Adam followed so God punished them...its the same concept as with parents...they want you to be a certain way, they can't force it though

It still doesn't add up. Why give us free will if using it isn't what He wants us to do?

He DOES want us to use our free will, our free will is to be used to serve and praise Him, and that's where He is most pleased with our lives and blesses us.

I am a deist. According to Christianity, God is omnibenevolent, all loving or infinitely compassionate, which led him to giving free will to his creations. With the gift of free will God lost total control as you referred to. If one tries to argue omnibenevolence is not a characteristic of God, or a Supreme Being, then they are running a course of logic that leads to paranoia of their very existence because if God is capable of anything, but kindness with his capabilities of omnipotence and omnipotence then he could easily be deceiving us and toying with us much like a modern-day, mad scientist with the specimens in his experiment. If anything, the most logical conclusion we can make about the existence of a God is that he's omnibenevolent.

So...he wants us to use our free will...so long as it is used within the predefined guidelines? That's like your parents buying you a computer and saying you can only use it on Wednesdays at 3:37 pm when it's sunny and raining and you have a pet heffalump wearing an argyle sweater made of pudding. It's not realistic. You give people free will and they're going to do whatever they want. If it's a gift, you can't specify when and how it can be used.

It's more like, your parents give you a computer, and you get a cookie for every time you use it between the hours of 12pm and 5 pm. Any other time you use it, is frowned upon, but no harsh action will be taken. If you use it to plot murder (for instance) you will be punished.

So I can't go to Hell since I've never done anything terrible, even though I don't go to church or even believe in God?

But the only way to get the cookie is if you know the password. Believing that you can be saved by God's grace through faith, that Jesus paid the ultimate sacrifice. Jesus is God in the flesh, born of a virgin to escape man's sin nature, and by dying on the cross, He paid for yours, mine, and everyone else's sins, even those who will be born, until he returns and we are "caught up" with him in the sky and takes us to heaven. That's when the book of Revelation comes into play.

Do you believe its correct to make a set path for a person? And if they disobey the will recieve a punishment, or even death? Do you think god is so cruel that he would make us into mindless drones? How are you speaking now? Of free will correct? So the thing I dont understand is, why question? We could spend our time doing something more productive as a whole species then fight over, God, politics, belief, Money. If the world was a whole, as in everyone could believe in what they want without persicution, why question them? They could easily do the same to you. That is how I veiw this, as people being naturally free willed. Free will is what is allowing you to deny god, so go ahead deny yourself of free will

Sadly the world is not yet stable enough to be at one, but if it could that would be the best possible world. Religion is a major stumblig block in the development of the world, even though it unites some it disrupts others.

Thats mine point, people begin to question other's beilfs, making the world a worse place, but it is all an example of free will. I could blandly say everyone is wrong and Im right because of free will correct? Making anything that anyone says incorrect, I see it as, show me proof that god doesnt exist and I will believe you. Anything other is you displaying the free will he gave you.

I believe two and only two truths exist in this universe and I had mentioned them all over this thread.
1) All living will eventually be dead
2) All things constantly change.

Problem :D

And don't ride this guy off as a Christian because he cursed because if you actually read the bible you would know it never says cussing is a sin

Awwww is our vulgar language too strong for this obedient christian? Well if I wrote a book a claimed it was written by your God, and that book said you have to jump off of a bridge to get to heaven would you listen to "God's word"?

With the tongue we praise our Lord and Father, and with it we curse men, who have been made in God's likeness. Out of the same mouth come praise and cursing. My brothers, this should not be. Can both fresh water and salt water flow from the same spring? My brothers, can a fig tree bear olives, or a grapevine bear figs? Neither can a salt spring produce fresh water

James 3:9-12

Oh and, Yeah Im no bible thumping christian, but I stand by christianity, because if heavan and hell exist, I want the shot at a better afterlife

That's not how genuine belief works. It's not something you can mount above your mantle until the person that bought it for you wants to see you use it. You either do believe or you don't.

But see, about 70% of the population of America, is straddiling between believeing it or not. I am one of those people although I am Bias towards christains 8D

That 70% is a group of mindless sheep. They go where the herd goes, do as the herd does, eat what the herd eats, and die as the herd dies. But do any of them actually have anywhere to go when they're dead? They don't know. They think that believing in God is an "I'll see what happens when I get there" kind of thing. But it's not.

And believing that god doesnt exist is the same thing to what you people do, like you believe that god doesnt exist and you will get to no where when you die, which is to us the 70% of the population a laugh, because your saying that there will be nowhere to go. Since when is there a law that a person cannot believe in what they want to believe in? There isnt, is there? My point is you people should shut your mouths because your bringing up the topic of "Oh you go nowhere when you die." Which makes us say "Hah, so what are you going to do when your staring god in the face and he sends you to your own special hell?" and you would quickly reply "But what if you dont get there?" making us say "What if you do?" and that is all it is, what if?

Yet another gross misinterpretation of what I said. I never said that people didn't have the right to choose what they want to believe. I said that a belief of convenience may as well be no belief at all. What are YOU going to do if you end up staring God in the face and He asks you what you've done in your life that makes you a Christian? The Bible states that God can see your heart and knows your thoughts, so you can't say "I've always been a devout Christian!" because you'll be lying. The only true thing you could say is "I've always maybe sometimes believed in you kind of."

And that just doesn't cut it. You'll get to come live with me in my 'own special Hell'

Huh? So God did not create everything? And why did god even need a hell, if what he created was pure?

Because as he made man, he created free will, like you "atheists" have the free will to deny god, Lucifer had the free will to taint what god made pure, therefore god HAD to make a place to put those people, oh and BTW im not fully christian, I believe god created the big bang, and therefore created your "modern science", so in a way if you try to disprove god with science, Aren't you disproving Science with Science?

datdenniskid said he's Agnostic, not Atheistic. And the thing you're talking about is one of the things that made me stray from Christianity. If God wants all his children to go to Heaven, why did he give us free will to choose a path that goes anywhere else? He's all knowing, all powerful, and in total control, right? Then why can't he just make me believe what he wants me to?

Because He would receive absolutely zero pleasure from you pleasing Him by force.

Then what was the point of creating us at all? And what DOES he get pleasure from? Watching us burn? Because according to what it takes to get to Heaven, he's going to get a lot of that.

God is pleased when we use our free will to praise and serve him. It says in the Bible that we were created for his pleasure!

That ones a killer issue and the only thing I can say to argue that is that God made free will and He knew what we were gonna do with it not what He was gonna make us do with it He knows all of what's gonna happen but He didn't make it that way He made us He gave us free will and let us run wild...eve used the free will to go against God and Adam followed so God punished them...its the same concept as with parents...they want you to be a certain way, they can't force it though

It still doesn't add up. Why give us free will if using it isn't what He wants us to do?

He DOES want us to use our free will, our free will is to be used to serve and praise Him, and that's where He is most pleased with our lives and blesses us.

I am a deist. According to Christianity, God is omnibenevolent, all loving or infinitely compassionate, which led him to giving free will to his creations. With the gift of free will God lost total control as you referred to. If one tries to argue omnibenevolence is not a characteristic of God, or a Supreme Being, then they are running a course of logic that leads to paranoia of their very existence because if God is capable of anything, but kindness with his capabilities of omnipotence and omnipotence then he could easily be deceiving us and toying with us much like a modern-day, mad scientist with the specimens in his experiment. If anything, the most logical conclusion we can make about the existence of a God is that he's omnibenevolent.

So...he wants us to use our free will...so long as it is used within the predefined guidelines? That's like your parents buying you a computer and saying you can only use it on Wednesdays at 3:37 pm when it's sunny and raining and you have a pet heffalump wearing an argyle sweater made of pudding. It's not realistic. You give people free will and they're going to do whatever they want. If it's a gift, you can't specify when and how it can be used.

It's more like, your parents give you a computer, and you get a cookie for every time you use it between the hours of 12pm and 5 pm. Any other time you use it, is frowned upon, but no harsh action will be taken. If you use it to plot murder (for instance) you will be punished.

So I can't go to Hell since I've never done anything terrible, even though I don't go to church or even believe in God?

But the only way to get the cookie is if you know the password. Believing that you can be saved by God's grace through faith, that Jesus paid the ultimate sacrifice. Jesus is God in the flesh, born of a virgin to escape man's sin nature, and by dying on the cross, He paid for yours, mine, and everyone else's sins, even those who will be born, until he returns and we are "caught up" with him in the sky and takes us to heaven. That's when the book of Revelation comes into play.

Do you believe its correct to make a set path for a person? And if they disobey the will recieve a punishment, or even death? Do you think god is so cruel that he would make us into mindless drones? How are you speaking now? Of free will correct? So the thing I dont understand is, why question? We could spend our time doing something more productive as a whole species then fight over, God, politics, belief, Money. If the world was a whole, as in everyone could believe in what they want without persicution, why question them? They could easily do the same to you. That is how I veiw this, as people being naturally free willed. Free will is what is allowing you to deny god, so go ahead deny yourself of free will

Sadly the world is not yet stable enough to be at one, but if it could that would be the best possible world. Religion is a major stumblig block in the development of the world, even though it unites some it disrupts others.

Thats mine point, people begin to question other's beilfs, making the world a worse place, but it is all an example of free will. I could blandly say everyone is wrong and Im right because of free will correct? Making anything that anyone says incorrect, I see it as, show me proof that god doesnt exist and I will believe you. Anything other is you displaying the free will he gave you.

I believe two and only two truths exist in this universe and I had mentioned them all over this thread.
1) All living will eventually be dead
2) All things constantly change.

Problem :D

He needed a place where he could send all the evil in the world...don't worry you're gonna know all about it soon enough

Judge not, that ye be not judged. For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again. And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye? Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye? Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye.

Matthew 7:1-5

Why would he/she/it need such a place, if everything is supposed to be as "good" as himself? Please explain...

HE CREATED FREE WILL, thus letting people think past him, which will lead people to disaster, the point being, no one person embodies a image of god, only parts

Everything is SUPPOSED to be but HE gave free will to everyone and Satan used it the wrong way and God banished him because he wasn't being the way he was SUPPOSED to be...God is the only one who is perfect we are SUPPOSED to be but were not

To give us the chance to strive towards it and prepare us for heaven

So, he knew we would turn rotten so he made us a torture bin for choosing the wrong path...? That's cruel as fuck.

No what's cruel as fuck is the way society treats Him and He made us all...you would exist if it weren't for Him we all deserve to go there but we have the opportunity to redeem ourselves

Haha you funny :D

Are we not cruel as fuck, look at the facts man. We do however embody only parts of god

FACTS?!

The facts. Really? The only two FACTS in this universe are that living things eventually die, and that everything constantly changes. anything other than those two facts is only a probablility.

So gravity is a probability? Measurements don't change....really bro?

i go to a Christian school so my science teachers teach science like what will happen when calcium is put in fire not "science" like there is no God...that's not science its darwinism

If there's one thing you're good at, it's misinterpretation.

Your avatar only reinforces your arguments and makes you so much more badass.

I'm catholic btw, and I agree with most of what you are saying.

You, sir, gots a thumb.

Nobody knows what gravity is but theory exist on it. Newton's laws are discoveries based on observation, which are basically glorified theories.

Ill be more specific then if you picked up a ball and released it from your grip is it not a 100% chance that it will begin to fall? If you jump in the air that you will come back down?...that's a fact isn't it?
Also (and I could be wrong on this cause its been a while since I heard this) I remember a video as a kid about gravity saying that there was some kind of magnetic pull in the core pulling everything towards the center? Thus gravity?

It is not a fact, but a glorified theory. You have caused yet another logical lapse. You explained gravity using magnetism which is also unexplained but thought to exist. Don't confuse fact with theory.

And also - refer to Popsickel's comment "If there's one thing you're good at, it's misinterpretation." I smell a very butt-hurt theist.

Magnatism exists in electrons and protons attracting to one another....now you can't be serious if your gonna say atoms don't exist but are "just a theory"

Actually I am going to stop arguing with someone who states boldly that atoms are ont a theory. NOBODY KNOW WHAT ATOMS ARE. NOR DO WE KNOW HOW THEY WORK. YOU DID NOT JUST EXPLAIN WHAT MAGNETISM IS. YOUR EXPLANATION IS EQUIVALENT TO SAYING GOD EXISTS BECAUSE HE DOES >.<

....Screw this im going to NSFW