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makonendrak
Rank #208 on Comments
Level 316 Comments: Wizard
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What people say about makonendrak
latest user's comments
#81
- I guarantee you things can be designed to stop their forward m…
[+]
(7 replies)
06/17/2017 on
Advice for Villains
0
#82
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
But not instantly.
#83
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
If you have any idea how forces work then you'd know that yes, it can be done instantly. Apply enough force in the opposite direction, object stops. It's actually pretty basic physics dude.
#84
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
You know what else happens when you apply enough force in the opposite direction? The object gets squished, because of the massive forces that are acting on it on opposite sides. Applying that much force to something that's accelerated is like ramming it into a fucking brick wall - the front of the object stops, but the rest of it is still being driven forward by inertia, so it just collapses in on itself. In order to prevent that, you have to apply less force, so the object gradually slows down, rather than fucking exploding.
So don't "It's basic physics" me, ya little shit. I was an engineering student................. for, like a year. Still, physics were a massive part of that year and if it taught me anything, it's that there's never anything simple about physics. Any interaction that seems simple at first is actually several dozen different forces interacting with eachother. Applying forces to objects going at absurd speed without making them veer out of control or explode may as well be a goddamn art.
#85
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
You're implying that the structure of an object can't take the strain. That's not necessarily true. Furthermore, as you stated it doesn't drop instantly, there's around 0.3 seconds in which it changes course. "Engineering student for a year" I am an engineer you dip.
#86
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Really? Are we doing this already? Is this the part where you go "Well, this universe is full of Bullshittium, which is a material with the structural properties of God's ass hair, so you can't question it.". God, I hate that aspect of arguing about made up shit. It's pretty much the point where all thinking and argumentation stop and it devolves into "Well, you don't know that. It's possible, because the author says so". It's the fictional equivalent of going "I've got a magic shield, you can't touch me". Hate that shit.
#87
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Okay, so your argument is that because you don't know if it could it can't? If you throw a marble at a wall does it smash? No. Because its structure can stand the strain of the opposite force acting against it. You're talking shit and now you're clutching at straws, and you know it.
#88
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
If you throw it hard enough, yes, and I'd argue there's a bit of a difference between an object made of a homogeneous material and a torpedo, which has to house the propulsion, detonator and some kind of explosive.
My argument is that you never see that shit until it's convenient. All the ships and trooper armor seem to be made of goddamn plastic, but apparently photon torpedoes are made of vibranium, because we've got enough of the stuff lying around to make torpedoes, but not enough to make some armor or cover a small ship in it. It's one of those things that get brought up once and never mentioned again, hoping people forget all about it and don't think about it too hard. It always sounds like a cop-out. "No, no, no. Luke didn't fuck with the laws of physics, it's just that photon torpedoes are specifically designed to do the very, very, VERY specific and impractical maneuver required to do what he did and are made of an extremely durable material that can withstand those forces. No, I don't know why we don't just use this material to make space gauss rifles for ships, which could probably just blast a hole through that exhaust port and half the death star."
#78
- Sigh. Again, it doesn't defy the laws of physics. It flies for…
[+]
(9 replies)
06/17/2017 on
Advice for Villains
0
#79
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
It killed its momentum almost instantly before dropping down in a perfect 90 degree turn. Things don't do that in real life. Inertia is a thing, especially in space, where there's no air resistance. And I admit, my knowledge of ship weapons in Star Wars come entirely from videogames, but I'm pretty sure ships have photon torpedoes. What exactly was stopping the ships from bombing the everloving fuck out of that exhaust port? The dinky little cover it had, which mandated the 90 degree turn? You could easily blast through that, so the torpedoes that follow just go straight down.
And please don't tell me you buy that "it makes sure it's far away before dropping" crap. That is one of the most obvious plot contrivances I've ever heard of. It was CLEARLY made up to explain how the torpedo did its impossible maneuver.
#81
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
I guarantee you things can be designed to stop their forward momentum and drop at a 90 degree angle.
#82
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
But not instantly.
#83
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
If you have any idea how forces work then you'd know that yes, it can be done instantly. Apply enough force in the opposite direction, object stops. It's actually pretty basic physics dude.
#84
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
You know what else happens when you apply enough force in the opposite direction? The object gets squished, because of the massive forces that are acting on it on opposite sides. Applying that much force to something that's accelerated is like ramming it into a fucking brick wall - the front of the object stops, but the rest of it is still being driven forward by inertia, so it just collapses in on itself. In order to prevent that, you have to apply less force, so the object gradually slows down, rather than fucking exploding.
So don't "It's basic physics" me, ya little shit. I was an engineering student................. for, like a year. Still, physics were a massive part of that year and if it taught me anything, it's that there's never anything simple about physics. Any interaction that seems simple at first is actually several dozen different forces interacting with eachother. Applying forces to objects going at absurd speed without making them veer out of control or explode may as well be a goddamn art.
#85
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
You're implying that the structure of an object can't take the strain. That's not necessarily true. Furthermore, as you stated it doesn't drop instantly, there's around 0.3 seconds in which it changes course. "Engineering student for a year" I am an engineer you dip.
#86
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Really? Are we doing this already? Is this the part where you go "Well, this universe is full of Bullshittium, which is a material with the structural properties of God's ass hair, so you can't question it.". God, I hate that aspect of arguing about made up shit. It's pretty much the point where all thinking and argumentation stop and it devolves into "Well, you don't know that. It's possible, because the author says so". It's the fictional equivalent of going "I've got a magic shield, you can't touch me". Hate that shit.
#87
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Okay, so your argument is that because you don't know if it could it can't? If you throw a marble at a wall does it smash? No. Because its structure can stand the strain of the opposite force acting against it. You're talking shit and now you're clutching at straws, and you know it.
#88
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
If you throw it hard enough, yes, and I'd argue there's a bit of a difference between an object made of a homogeneous material and a torpedo, which has to house the propulsion, detonator and some kind of explosive.
My argument is that you never see that shit until it's convenient. All the ships and trooper armor seem to be made of goddamn plastic, but apparently photon torpedoes are made of vibranium, because we've got enough of the stuff lying around to make torpedoes, but not enough to make some armor or cover a small ship in it. It's one of those things that get brought up once and never mentioned again, hoping people forget all about it and don't think about it too hard. It always sounds like a cop-out. "No, no, no. Luke didn't fuck with the laws of physics, it's just that photon torpedoes are specifically designed to do the very, very, VERY specific and impractical maneuver required to do what he did and are made of an extremely durable material that can withstand those forces. No, I don't know why we don't just use this material to make space gauss rifles for ships, which could probably just blast a hole through that exhaust port and half the death star."
#75
- We're all wrong, they only state who brought the information i…
[+]
(2 replies)
06/17/2017 on
Advice for Villains
+3
#110
-
anon
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Like kiljoyus said, bothan spies - those lion like creatures - they just changed it like when greedo shot first
#115
-
thevioletlightning
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Except the bothans were never mentioned until episode 6. They stole the plans for the second Death Star. They never said what species stole the plans for the first one.
#71
- It's cute, thechosentroll, you really think you're listening…
[+]
(11 replies)
06/17/2017 on
Advice for Villains
0
#74
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Because I'm not suggestion that the shields on the whole thing just go down randomly, I'm suggesting a very small and specific flaw in them, which you have to know about in order to exploit. The logic being that it's a massive fucking area to search for weaknesses and thus likely to be overlooked, because people'll just assume the entire hull is equally indestructible.
Also, the whole thing sounds contrived as fuck. Like it's just a series of excuses as to why the only possible weakness had to be something that has to be exploited by a lone man in an x wing. As in, Luke. And not just blasted with a big-ass ship. Cause, once again, if a photon torpedo can just zig-zag around and defy the laws of physics at a whim, you'd think firing a couple hundred of the fucking things down the exhaust port would work. Cause even if they fuck up and the torpedo doesn't make it to the core, that's still a blocked exhaust, which means the station'll overheat and either be put out of commission or blow up. Because exhausts are fucking important. That's my biggest gripe with this - no one's gonna look at the plans for the exhaust system and go "Eh, who cares? They'll never shoot anything down that hole", they're gonna go "Wait, holy shit. We only have one exhaust? What happens if it gets clogged? We'll be crippled. Someone fix that shit immediately.". It's by no means a better weakness that the shit I mentioned, it's just the weakness that allows Luke to personally blow up the death star, rather than some admiral on a ship.
#78
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Sigh. Again, it doesn't defy the laws of physics. It flies forward to ensure it's away from the firing ship before it explicitly drops.
#79
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
It killed its momentum almost instantly before dropping down in a perfect 90 degree turn. Things don't do that in real life. Inertia is a thing, especially in space, where there's no air resistance. And I admit, my knowledge of ship weapons in Star Wars come entirely from videogames, but I'm pretty sure ships have photon torpedoes. What exactly was stopping the ships from bombing the everloving fuck out of that exhaust port? The dinky little cover it had, which mandated the 90 degree turn? You could easily blast through that, so the torpedoes that follow just go straight down.
And please don't tell me you buy that "it makes sure it's far away before dropping" crap. That is one of the most obvious plot contrivances I've ever heard of. It was CLEARLY made up to explain how the torpedo did its impossible maneuver.
#81
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
I guarantee you things can be designed to stop their forward momentum and drop at a 90 degree angle.
#82
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
But not instantly.
#83
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
If you have any idea how forces work then you'd know that yes, it can be done instantly. Apply enough force in the opposite direction, object stops. It's actually pretty basic physics dude.
#84
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
You know what else happens when you apply enough force in the opposite direction? The object gets squished, because of the massive forces that are acting on it on opposite sides. Applying that much force to something that's accelerated is like ramming it into a fucking brick wall - the front of the object stops, but the rest of it is still being driven forward by inertia, so it just collapses in on itself. In order to prevent that, you have to apply less force, so the object gradually slows down, rather than fucking exploding.
So don't "It's basic physics" me, ya little shit. I was an engineering student................. for, like a year. Still, physics were a massive part of that year and if it taught me anything, it's that there's never anything simple about physics. Any interaction that seems simple at first is actually several dozen different forces interacting with eachother. Applying forces to objects going at absurd speed without making them veer out of control or explode may as well be a goddamn art.
#85
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
You're implying that the structure of an object can't take the strain. That's not necessarily true. Furthermore, as you stated it doesn't drop instantly, there's around 0.3 seconds in which it changes course. "Engineering student for a year" I am an engineer you dip.
#86
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Really? Are we doing this already? Is this the part where you go "Well, this universe is full of Bullshittium, which is a material with the structural properties of God's ass hair, so you can't question it.". God, I hate that aspect of arguing about made up shit. It's pretty much the point where all thinking and argumentation stop and it devolves into "Well, you don't know that. It's possible, because the author says so". It's the fictional equivalent of going "I've got a magic shield, you can't touch me". Hate that shit.
#87
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Okay, so your argument is that because you don't know if it could it can't? If you throw a marble at a wall does it smash? No. Because its structure can stand the strain of the opposite force acting against it. You're talking shit and now you're clutching at straws, and you know it.
#88
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
If you throw it hard enough, yes, and I'd argue there's a bit of a difference between an object made of a homogeneous material and a torpedo, which has to house the propulsion, detonator and some kind of explosive.
My argument is that you never see that shit until it's convenient. All the ships and trooper armor seem to be made of goddamn plastic, but apparently photon torpedoes are made of vibranium, because we've got enough of the stuff lying around to make torpedoes, but not enough to make some armor or cover a small ship in it. It's one of those things that get brought up once and never mentioned again, hoping people forget all about it and don't think about it too hard. It always sounds like a cop-out. "No, no, no. Luke didn't fuck with the laws of physics, it's just that photon torpedoes are specifically designed to do the very, very, VERY specific and impractical maneuver required to do what he did and are made of an extremely durable material that can withstand those forces. No, I don't know why we don't just use this material to make space gauss rifles for ships, which could probably just blast a hole through that exhaust port and half the death star."
#68
- The Death Star was designed to be able to withstand an attack …
[+]
(12 replies)
06/17/2017 on
Advice for Villains
0
#71
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
It's cute, thechosentroll, you really
think
you're listening. But you're not. Failing shields aren't hard to find in a design, a weakness that can be exploited by something far,
far
weaker than you're anticipating fighting against is not something you routinely look for.
#74
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Because I'm not suggestion that the shields on the whole thing just go down randomly, I'm suggesting a very small and specific flaw in them, which you have to know about in order to exploit. The logic being that it's a massive fucking area to search for weaknesses and thus likely to be overlooked, because people'll just assume the entire hull is equally indestructible.
Also, the whole thing sounds contrived as fuck. Like it's just a series of excuses as to why the only possible weakness had to be something that has to be exploited by a lone man in an x wing. As in, Luke. And not just blasted with a big-ass ship. Cause, once again, if a photon torpedo can just zig-zag around and defy the laws of physics at a whim, you'd think firing a couple hundred of the fucking things down the exhaust port would work. Cause even if they fuck up and the torpedo doesn't make it to the core, that's still a blocked exhaust, which means the station'll overheat and either be put out of commission or blow up. Because exhausts are fucking important. That's my biggest gripe with this - no one's gonna look at the plans for the exhaust system and go "Eh, who cares? They'll never shoot anything down that hole", they're gonna go "Wait, holy shit. We only have one exhaust? What happens if it gets clogged? We'll be crippled. Someone fix that shit immediately.". It's by no means a better weakness that the shit I mentioned, it's just the weakness that allows Luke to personally blow up the death star, rather than some admiral on a ship.
#78
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Sigh. Again, it doesn't defy the laws of physics. It flies forward to ensure it's away from the firing ship before it explicitly drops.
#79
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
It killed its momentum almost instantly before dropping down in a perfect 90 degree turn. Things don't do that in real life. Inertia is a thing, especially in space, where there's no air resistance. And I admit, my knowledge of ship weapons in Star Wars come entirely from videogames, but I'm pretty sure ships have photon torpedoes. What exactly was stopping the ships from bombing the everloving fuck out of that exhaust port? The dinky little cover it had, which mandated the 90 degree turn? You could easily blast through that, so the torpedoes that follow just go straight down.
And please don't tell me you buy that "it makes sure it's far away before dropping" crap. That is one of the most obvious plot contrivances I've ever heard of. It was CLEARLY made up to explain how the torpedo did its impossible maneuver.
#81
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
I guarantee you things can be designed to stop their forward momentum and drop at a 90 degree angle.
#82
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
But not instantly.
#83
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
If you have any idea how forces work then you'd know that yes, it can be done instantly. Apply enough force in the opposite direction, object stops. It's actually pretty basic physics dude.
#84
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
You know what else happens when you apply enough force in the opposite direction? The object gets squished, because of the massive forces that are acting on it on opposite sides. Applying that much force to something that's accelerated is like ramming it into a fucking brick wall - the front of the object stops, but the rest of it is still being driven forward by inertia, so it just collapses in on itself. In order to prevent that, you have to apply less force, so the object gradually slows down, rather than fucking exploding.
So don't "It's basic physics" me, ya little shit. I was an engineering student................. for, like a year. Still, physics were a massive part of that year and if it taught me anything, it's that there's never anything simple about physics. Any interaction that seems simple at first is actually several dozen different forces interacting with eachother. Applying forces to objects going at absurd speed without making them veer out of control or explode may as well be a goddamn art.
#85
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
You're implying that the structure of an object can't take the strain. That's not necessarily true. Furthermore, as you stated it doesn't drop instantly, there's around 0.3 seconds in which it changes course. "Engineering student for a year" I am an engineer you dip.
#86
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Really? Are we doing this already? Is this the part where you go "Well, this universe is full of Bullshittium, which is a material with the structural properties of God's ass hair, so you can't question it.". God, I hate that aspect of arguing about made up shit. It's pretty much the point where all thinking and argumentation stop and it devolves into "Well, you don't know that. It's possible, because the author says so". It's the fictional equivalent of going "I've got a magic shield, you can't touch me". Hate that shit.
#87
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Okay, so your argument is that because you don't know if it could it can't? If you throw a marble at a wall does it smash? No. Because its structure can stand the strain of the opposite force acting against it. You're talking shit and now you're clutching at straws, and you know it.
#88
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
If you throw it hard enough, yes, and I'd argue there's a bit of a difference between an object made of a homogeneous material and a torpedo, which has to house the propulsion, detonator and some kind of explosive.
My argument is that you never see that shit until it's convenient. All the ships and trooper armor seem to be made of goddamn plastic, but apparently photon torpedoes are made of vibranium, because we've got enough of the stuff lying around to make torpedoes, but not enough to make some armor or cover a small ship in it. It's one of those things that get brought up once and never mentioned again, hoping people forget all about it and don't think about it too hard. It always sounds like a cop-out. "No, no, no. Luke didn't fuck with the laws of physics, it's just that photon torpedoes are specifically designed to do the very, very, VERY specific and impractical maneuver required to do what he did and are made of an extremely durable material that can withstand those forces. No, I don't know why we don't just use this material to make space gauss rifles for ships, which could probably just blast a hole through that exhaust port and half the death star."
#67
- What they said in SW4 was "A lot of people lost their liv…
[+]
(4 replies)
06/17/2017 on
Advice for Villains
0
#73
-
killjoyus
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Bothan spies. a lot of Bothan spies died to get that information
#75
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
We're all wrong, they only state who brought the information in Episode 6 when referring to the Death Star II
#110
-
anon
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Like kiljoyus said, bothan spies - those lion like creatures - they just changed it like when greedo shot first
#115
-
thevioletlightning
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Except the bothans were never mentioned until episode 6. They stole the plans for the second Death Star. They never said what species stole the plans for the first one.
#61
- Sigh, again. The architect of the Death Star explicitly put it…
[+]
(15 replies)
06/17/2017 on
Advice for Villains
0
#63
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Cause it's a station the size of a moon. There's a LOT of places on the hull you could put a weak spot. Far fewer exhaust ports.
#68
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
The Death Star was designed to be able to withstand an attack from any number of capital-class ships. No, you couldn't find a weakness in the hull. Even if the shields failed the hull could withstand the impact long after the assaulting vessel(s) were destroyed. It was specifically designed so no such weakness existed - as requested.
Given that it was designed to be able to fight, and beat, an entire fleet of capital-class ships, the bureaucrats weren't looking for a weakness that could be exploited by a fighter squadron, just that the exhaust ports could deal with the waste energy - which is exactly what the architect was counting on - which is exactly what is explained in the original novel.
#71
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
It's cute, thechosentroll, you really
think
you're listening. But you're not. Failing shields aren't hard to find in a design, a weakness that can be exploited by something far,
far
weaker than you're anticipating fighting against is not something you routinely look for.
#74
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Because I'm not suggestion that the shields on the whole thing just go down randomly, I'm suggesting a very small and specific flaw in them, which you have to know about in order to exploit. The logic being that it's a massive fucking area to search for weaknesses and thus likely to be overlooked, because people'll just assume the entire hull is equally indestructible.
Also, the whole thing sounds contrived as fuck. Like it's just a series of excuses as to why the only possible weakness had to be something that has to be exploited by a lone man in an x wing. As in, Luke. And not just blasted with a big-ass ship. Cause, once again, if a photon torpedo can just zig-zag around and defy the laws of physics at a whim, you'd think firing a couple hundred of the fucking things down the exhaust port would work. Cause even if they fuck up and the torpedo doesn't make it to the core, that's still a blocked exhaust, which means the station'll overheat and either be put out of commission or blow up. Because exhausts are fucking important. That's my biggest gripe with this - no one's gonna look at the plans for the exhaust system and go "Eh, who cares? They'll never shoot anything down that hole", they're gonna go "Wait, holy shit. We only have one exhaust? What happens if it gets clogged? We'll be crippled. Someone fix that shit immediately.". It's by no means a better weakness that the shit I mentioned, it's just the weakness that allows Luke to personally blow up the death star, rather than some admiral on a ship.
#78
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Sigh. Again, it doesn't defy the laws of physics. It flies forward to ensure it's away from the firing ship before it explicitly drops.
#79
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
It killed its momentum almost instantly before dropping down in a perfect 90 degree turn. Things don't do that in real life. Inertia is a thing, especially in space, where there's no air resistance. And I admit, my knowledge of ship weapons in Star Wars come entirely from videogames, but I'm pretty sure ships have photon torpedoes. What exactly was stopping the ships from bombing the everloving fuck out of that exhaust port? The dinky little cover it had, which mandated the 90 degree turn? You could easily blast through that, so the torpedoes that follow just go straight down.
And please don't tell me you buy that "it makes sure it's far away before dropping" crap. That is one of the most obvious plot contrivances I've ever heard of. It was CLEARLY made up to explain how the torpedo did its impossible maneuver.
#81
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
I guarantee you things can be designed to stop their forward momentum and drop at a 90 degree angle.
#82
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
But not instantly.
#83
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
If you have any idea how forces work then you'd know that yes, it can be done instantly. Apply enough force in the opposite direction, object stops. It's actually pretty basic physics dude.
#84
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
You know what else happens when you apply enough force in the opposite direction? The object gets squished, because of the massive forces that are acting on it on opposite sides. Applying that much force to something that's accelerated is like ramming it into a fucking brick wall - the front of the object stops, but the rest of it is still being driven forward by inertia, so it just collapses in on itself. In order to prevent that, you have to apply less force, so the object gradually slows down, rather than fucking exploding.
So don't "It's basic physics" me, ya little shit. I was an engineering student................. for, like a year. Still, physics were a massive part of that year and if it taught me anything, it's that there's never anything simple about physics. Any interaction that seems simple at first is actually several dozen different forces interacting with eachother. Applying forces to objects going at absurd speed without making them veer out of control or explode may as well be a goddamn art.
#85
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
You're implying that the structure of an object can't take the strain. That's not necessarily true. Furthermore, as you stated it doesn't drop instantly, there's around 0.3 seconds in which it changes course. "Engineering student for a year" I am an engineer you dip.
#86
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Really? Are we doing this already? Is this the part where you go "Well, this universe is full of Bullshittium, which is a material with the structural properties of God's ass hair, so you can't question it.". God, I hate that aspect of arguing about made up shit. It's pretty much the point where all thinking and argumentation stop and it devolves into "Well, you don't know that. It's possible, because the author says so". It's the fictional equivalent of going "I've got a magic shield, you can't touch me". Hate that shit.
#87
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Okay, so your argument is that because you don't know if it could it can't? If you throw a marble at a wall does it smash? No. Because its structure can stand the strain of the opposite force acting against it. You're talking shit and now you're clutching at straws, and you know it.
#88
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
If you throw it hard enough, yes, and I'd argue there's a bit of a difference between an object made of a homogeneous material and a torpedo, which has to house the propulsion, detonator and some kind of explosive.
My argument is that you never see that shit until it's convenient. All the ships and trooper armor seem to be made of goddamn plastic, but apparently photon torpedoes are made of vibranium, because we've got enough of the stuff lying around to make torpedoes, but not enough to make some armor or cover a small ship in it. It's one of those things that get brought up once and never mentioned again, hoping people forget all about it and don't think about it too hard. It always sounds like a cop-out. "No, no, no. Luke didn't fuck with the laws of physics, it's just that photon torpedoes are specifically designed to do the very, very, VERY specific and impractical maneuver required to do what he did and are made of an extremely durable material that can withstand those forces. No, I don't know why we don't just use this material to make space gauss rifles for ships, which could probably just blast a hole through that exhaust port and half the death star."
#62
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
No, you're not fucking listening, because I just pointed out that ANY weakness has to be found by someone who knows how to look for it. That's the whole fucking point - hard to find, easy to exploit. Not hard to find, nearly impossible to exploit. If it were something like "The shields over this really tiny part of the ship get shut down for a second every week for maintenance", it would have been just as hard to find, but actually reasonable to exploit.
And you'd think the bureaucrats would be paying pretty close attention to the death star's exhaust ports, given how they're a key element, which it needs in order to function properly and not just overheat and blow up. Seems like something that would attract a lot more attention than the shields being a bit fucky on section 37 416-C of the hull.
#55
- To clarify, thechosentroll, Rogue One establishes why they kne…
[+]
(17 replies)
06/17/2017 on
Advice for Villains
+1
#59
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
I'm not saying they needed a jedi to FIND it, after all, they had the plans for the death star, which showed the weakness, that shit was mentioned all the way in the original trilogy. I'm saying they need a jedi to exploit the weakness, because of what an absurdly hard shot it was. Not to mention the fact that the empire could have prevented it if they'd just went "Wait, isn't it dangerous to just have an open exhaust like that? Why don't we put a grate over the hole or something?"
Normally, weak spots are the opposite of what the death star had - something that's nearly impossible to find, but easy to exploit if you know about it, like a blind spot, a certain frequency of laser, which the shields don't protect against, every 3 weeks, the shields have to go down for about 3 seconds while doing system maintenance. That sort of thing - something where you have to be at the right place at the right time to actually exploit the weakness, but if you are, it's fairly easy. Cause something like that is so specific and rare that it'd be just as hard to find as the exhaust port. The difference being that it doesn't require you to get into contact with the galaxy's deadliest space station, fight your way through its defenses, go down a narrow trench, which has turrets and fuckers in tie fighters and fire a photon torpedo in an extremely specific way, which makes it fly in a perfectly straight line down the shaft, defying the laws of physics.
It's a 1 in a million shot, but when you consider how fucking hard it is to get that shot, it goes up to 1 in billions.
#61
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Sigh, again. The architect of the Death Star explicitly put it there to
be found by someone who knew to look for it.
He
had
to make it seem almost impossible because then the bureaucrats wouldn't be looking for it. Take a moment, and actually read that explanation before you post again because you're clearly not listening.
#63
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Cause it's a station the size of a moon. There's a LOT of places on the hull you could put a weak spot. Far fewer exhaust ports.
#68
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
The Death Star was designed to be able to withstand an attack from any number of capital-class ships. No, you couldn't find a weakness in the hull. Even if the shields failed the hull could withstand the impact long after the assaulting vessel(s) were destroyed. It was specifically designed so no such weakness existed - as requested.
Given that it was designed to be able to fight, and beat, an entire fleet of capital-class ships, the bureaucrats weren't looking for a weakness that could be exploited by a fighter squadron, just that the exhaust ports could deal with the waste energy - which is exactly what the architect was counting on - which is exactly what is explained in the original novel.
#71
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
It's cute, thechosentroll, you really
think
you're listening. But you're not. Failing shields aren't hard to find in a design, a weakness that can be exploited by something far,
far
weaker than you're anticipating fighting against is not something you routinely look for.
#74
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Because I'm not suggestion that the shields on the whole thing just go down randomly, I'm suggesting a very small and specific flaw in them, which you have to know about in order to exploit. The logic being that it's a massive fucking area to search for weaknesses and thus likely to be overlooked, because people'll just assume the entire hull is equally indestructible.
Also, the whole thing sounds contrived as fuck. Like it's just a series of excuses as to why the only possible weakness had to be something that has to be exploited by a lone man in an x wing. As in, Luke. And not just blasted with a big-ass ship. Cause, once again, if a photon torpedo can just zig-zag around and defy the laws of physics at a whim, you'd think firing a couple hundred of the fucking things down the exhaust port would work. Cause even if they fuck up and the torpedo doesn't make it to the core, that's still a blocked exhaust, which means the station'll overheat and either be put out of commission or blow up. Because exhausts are fucking important. That's my biggest gripe with this - no one's gonna look at the plans for the exhaust system and go "Eh, who cares? They'll never shoot anything down that hole", they're gonna go "Wait, holy shit. We only have one exhaust? What happens if it gets clogged? We'll be crippled. Someone fix that shit immediately.". It's by no means a better weakness that the shit I mentioned, it's just the weakness that allows Luke to personally blow up the death star, rather than some admiral on a ship.
#78
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Sigh. Again, it doesn't defy the laws of physics. It flies forward to ensure it's away from the firing ship before it explicitly drops.
#79
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
It killed its momentum almost instantly before dropping down in a perfect 90 degree turn. Things don't do that in real life. Inertia is a thing, especially in space, where there's no air resistance. And I admit, my knowledge of ship weapons in Star Wars come entirely from videogames, but I'm pretty sure ships have photon torpedoes. What exactly was stopping the ships from bombing the everloving fuck out of that exhaust port? The dinky little cover it had, which mandated the 90 degree turn? You could easily blast through that, so the torpedoes that follow just go straight down.
And please don't tell me you buy that "it makes sure it's far away before dropping" crap. That is one of the most obvious plot contrivances I've ever heard of. It was CLEARLY made up to explain how the torpedo did its impossible maneuver.
#81
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
I guarantee you things can be designed to stop their forward momentum and drop at a 90 degree angle.
#82
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
But not instantly.
#83
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
If you have any idea how forces work then you'd know that yes, it can be done instantly. Apply enough force in the opposite direction, object stops. It's actually pretty basic physics dude.
#84
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
You know what else happens when you apply enough force in the opposite direction? The object gets squished, because of the massive forces that are acting on it on opposite sides. Applying that much force to something that's accelerated is like ramming it into a fucking brick wall - the front of the object stops, but the rest of it is still being driven forward by inertia, so it just collapses in on itself. In order to prevent that, you have to apply less force, so the object gradually slows down, rather than fucking exploding.
So don't "It's basic physics" me, ya little shit. I was an engineering student................. for, like a year. Still, physics were a massive part of that year and if it taught me anything, it's that there's never anything simple about physics. Any interaction that seems simple at first is actually several dozen different forces interacting with eachother. Applying forces to objects going at absurd speed without making them veer out of control or explode may as well be a goddamn art.
#85
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
You're implying that the structure of an object can't take the strain. That's not necessarily true. Furthermore, as you stated it doesn't drop instantly, there's around 0.3 seconds in which it changes course. "Engineering student for a year" I am an engineer you dip.
#86
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Really? Are we doing this already? Is this the part where you go "Well, this universe is full of Bullshittium, which is a material with the structural properties of God's ass hair, so you can't question it.". God, I hate that aspect of arguing about made up shit. It's pretty much the point where all thinking and argumentation stop and it devolves into "Well, you don't know that. It's possible, because the author says so". It's the fictional equivalent of going "I've got a magic shield, you can't touch me". Hate that shit.
#87
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Okay, so your argument is that because you don't know if it could it can't? If you throw a marble at a wall does it smash? No. Because its structure can stand the strain of the opposite force acting against it. You're talking shit and now you're clutching at straws, and you know it.
#88
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
If you throw it hard enough, yes, and I'd argue there's a bit of a difference between an object made of a homogeneous material and a torpedo, which has to house the propulsion, detonator and some kind of explosive.
My argument is that you never see that shit until it's convenient. All the ships and trooper armor seem to be made of goddamn plastic, but apparently photon torpedoes are made of vibranium, because we've got enough of the stuff lying around to make torpedoes, but not enough to make some armor or cover a small ship in it. It's one of those things that get brought up once and never mentioned again, hoping people forget all about it and don't think about it too hard. It always sounds like a cop-out. "No, no, no. Luke didn't fuck with the laws of physics, it's just that photon torpedoes are specifically designed to do the very, very, VERY specific and impractical maneuver required to do what he did and are made of an extremely durable material that can withstand those forces. No, I don't know why we don't just use this material to make space gauss rifles for ships, which could probably just blast a hole through that exhaust port and half the death star."
#62
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
No, you're not fucking listening, because I just pointed out that ANY weakness has to be found by someone who knows how to look for it. That's the whole fucking point - hard to find, easy to exploit. Not hard to find, nearly impossible to exploit. If it were something like "The shields over this really tiny part of the ship get shut down for a second every week for maintenance", it would have been just as hard to find, but actually reasonable to exploit.
And you'd think the bureaucrats would be paying pretty close attention to the death star's exhaust ports, given how they're a key element, which it needs in order to function properly and not just overheat and blow up. Seems like something that would attract a lot more attention than the shields being a bit fucky on section 37 416-C of the hull.
#52
- Rogue One was a book long before episode 7, long before the Ro…
[+]
(19 replies)
06/17/2017 on
Advice for Villains
0
#53
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
That's still defying the fucking laws of physics. And it still has to go down a narrow tunnel for several kilometers. That shit would have to be aimed PERFECTLY or have some sort of AI intelligent enough to guide it, in which case, why the fuck did it take a jedi to hit with that shit, it should have been able to guide itself?
And even if we overlook all that, that's still a VERY tiny and specific weakness. Couldn't the fucker make it something a bit easier to exploit? You know, something you could hit with a spaceship?
#55
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
To clarify, thechosentroll, Rogue One establishes why they knew to look for the exhaust port. The architect designed it to be a straight hole so that it was a weakness. They didn't
need
a Jedi to look for it, but it was however a 1-in-a-million shot because that was the
only
the way the architect could hide it from the thousands of other people that had access to the plans. Fucking think for a second.
#59
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
I'm not saying they needed a jedi to FIND it, after all, they had the plans for the death star, which showed the weakness, that shit was mentioned all the way in the original trilogy. I'm saying they need a jedi to exploit the weakness, because of what an absurdly hard shot it was. Not to mention the fact that the empire could have prevented it if they'd just went "Wait, isn't it dangerous to just have an open exhaust like that? Why don't we put a grate over the hole or something?"
Normally, weak spots are the opposite of what the death star had - something that's nearly impossible to find, but easy to exploit if you know about it, like a blind spot, a certain frequency of laser, which the shields don't protect against, every 3 weeks, the shields have to go down for about 3 seconds while doing system maintenance. That sort of thing - something where you have to be at the right place at the right time to actually exploit the weakness, but if you are, it's fairly easy. Cause something like that is so specific and rare that it'd be just as hard to find as the exhaust port. The difference being that it doesn't require you to get into contact with the galaxy's deadliest space station, fight your way through its defenses, go down a narrow trench, which has turrets and fuckers in tie fighters and fire a photon torpedo in an extremely specific way, which makes it fly in a perfectly straight line down the shaft, defying the laws of physics.
It's a 1 in a million shot, but when you consider how fucking hard it is to get that shot, it goes up to 1 in billions.
#61
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Sigh, again. The architect of the Death Star explicitly put it there to
be found by someone who knew to look for it.
He
had
to make it seem almost impossible because then the bureaucrats wouldn't be looking for it. Take a moment, and actually read that explanation before you post again because you're clearly not listening.
#63
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Cause it's a station the size of a moon. There's a LOT of places on the hull you could put a weak spot. Far fewer exhaust ports.
#68
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
The Death Star was designed to be able to withstand an attack from any number of capital-class ships. No, you couldn't find a weakness in the hull. Even if the shields failed the hull could withstand the impact long after the assaulting vessel(s) were destroyed. It was specifically designed so no such weakness existed - as requested.
Given that it was designed to be able to fight, and beat, an entire fleet of capital-class ships, the bureaucrats weren't looking for a weakness that could be exploited by a fighter squadron, just that the exhaust ports could deal with the waste energy - which is exactly what the architect was counting on - which is exactly what is explained in the original novel.
#71
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
It's cute, thechosentroll, you really
think
you're listening. But you're not. Failing shields aren't hard to find in a design, a weakness that can be exploited by something far,
far
weaker than you're anticipating fighting against is not something you routinely look for.
#74
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Because I'm not suggestion that the shields on the whole thing just go down randomly, I'm suggesting a very small and specific flaw in them, which you have to know about in order to exploit. The logic being that it's a massive fucking area to search for weaknesses and thus likely to be overlooked, because people'll just assume the entire hull is equally indestructible.
Also, the whole thing sounds contrived as fuck. Like it's just a series of excuses as to why the only possible weakness had to be something that has to be exploited by a lone man in an x wing. As in, Luke. And not just blasted with a big-ass ship. Cause, once again, if a photon torpedo can just zig-zag around and defy the laws of physics at a whim, you'd think firing a couple hundred of the fucking things down the exhaust port would work. Cause even if they fuck up and the torpedo doesn't make it to the core, that's still a blocked exhaust, which means the station'll overheat and either be put out of commission or blow up. Because exhausts are fucking important. That's my biggest gripe with this - no one's gonna look at the plans for the exhaust system and go "Eh, who cares? They'll never shoot anything down that hole", they're gonna go "Wait, holy shit. We only have one exhaust? What happens if it gets clogged? We'll be crippled. Someone fix that shit immediately.". It's by no means a better weakness that the shit I mentioned, it's just the weakness that allows Luke to personally blow up the death star, rather than some admiral on a ship.
#78
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Sigh. Again, it doesn't defy the laws of physics. It flies forward to ensure it's away from the firing ship before it explicitly drops.
#79
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
It killed its momentum almost instantly before dropping down in a perfect 90 degree turn. Things don't do that in real life. Inertia is a thing, especially in space, where there's no air resistance. And I admit, my knowledge of ship weapons in Star Wars come entirely from videogames, but I'm pretty sure ships have photon torpedoes. What exactly was stopping the ships from bombing the everloving fuck out of that exhaust port? The dinky little cover it had, which mandated the 90 degree turn? You could easily blast through that, so the torpedoes that follow just go straight down.
And please don't tell me you buy that "it makes sure it's far away before dropping" crap. That is one of the most obvious plot contrivances I've ever heard of. It was CLEARLY made up to explain how the torpedo did its impossible maneuver.
#81
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
I guarantee you things can be designed to stop their forward momentum and drop at a 90 degree angle.
#82
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
But not instantly.
#83
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
If you have any idea how forces work then you'd know that yes, it can be done instantly. Apply enough force in the opposite direction, object stops. It's actually pretty basic physics dude.
#84
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
You know what else happens when you apply enough force in the opposite direction? The object gets squished, because of the massive forces that are acting on it on opposite sides. Applying that much force to something that's accelerated is like ramming it into a fucking brick wall - the front of the object stops, but the rest of it is still being driven forward by inertia, so it just collapses in on itself. In order to prevent that, you have to apply less force, so the object gradually slows down, rather than fucking exploding.
So don't "It's basic physics" me, ya little shit. I was an engineering student................. for, like a year. Still, physics were a massive part of that year and if it taught me anything, it's that there's never anything simple about physics. Any interaction that seems simple at first is actually several dozen different forces interacting with eachother. Applying forces to objects going at absurd speed without making them veer out of control or explode may as well be a goddamn art.
#85
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
You're implying that the structure of an object can't take the strain. That's not necessarily true. Furthermore, as you stated it doesn't drop instantly, there's around 0.3 seconds in which it changes course. "Engineering student for a year" I am an engineer you dip.
#86
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Really? Are we doing this already? Is this the part where you go "Well, this universe is full of Bullshittium, which is a material with the structural properties of God's ass hair, so you can't question it.". God, I hate that aspect of arguing about made up shit. It's pretty much the point where all thinking and argumentation stop and it devolves into "Well, you don't know that. It's possible, because the author says so". It's the fictional equivalent of going "I've got a magic shield, you can't touch me". Hate that shit.
#87
-
makonendrak
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Okay, so your argument is that because you don't know if it could it can't? If you throw a marble at a wall does it smash? No. Because its structure can stand the strain of the opposite force acting against it. You're talking shit and now you're clutching at straws, and you know it.
#88
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
If you throw it hard enough, yes, and I'd argue there's a bit of a difference between an object made of a homogeneous material and a torpedo, which has to house the propulsion, detonator and some kind of explosive.
My argument is that you never see that shit until it's convenient. All the ships and trooper armor seem to be made of goddamn plastic, but apparently photon torpedoes are made of vibranium, because we've got enough of the stuff lying around to make torpedoes, but not enough to make some armor or cover a small ship in it. It's one of those things that get brought up once and never mentioned again, hoping people forget all about it and don't think about it too hard. It always sounds like a cop-out. "No, no, no. Luke didn't fuck with the laws of physics, it's just that photon torpedoes are specifically designed to do the very, very, VERY specific and impractical maneuver required to do what he did and are made of an extremely durable material that can withstand those forces. No, I don't know why we don't just use this material to make space gauss rifles for ships, which could probably just blast a hole through that exhaust port and half the death star."
#62
-
thechosentroll
(06/17/2017)
[-]
No, you're not fucking listening, because I just pointed out that ANY weakness has to be found by someone who knows how to look for it. That's the whole fucking point - hard to find, easy to exploit. Not hard to find, nearly impossible to exploit. If it were something like "The shields over this really tiny part of the ship get shut down for a second every week for maintenance", it would have been just as hard to find, but actually reasonable to exploit.
And you'd think the bureaucrats would be paying pretty close attention to the death star's exhaust ports, given how they're a key element, which it needs in order to function properly and not just overheat and blow up. Seems like something that would attract a lot more attention than the shields being a bit fucky on section 37 416-C of the hull.
#16
- I can legitimately imagine him trying to say "Chris"…
[+]
(1 reply)
06/17/2017 on
Game of Thrones Actors
+1
#33
-
anon
(06/17/2017)
[-]
Bigger and better
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