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kjoni

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Date Signed Up:8/29/2013
Last Login:12/01/2016
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latest user's comments

#30 - >Ensure that the poor cannot sink to rock bottom Throug…  [+] (9 replies) 08/22/2016 on AnCap Comp, p6 0
#31 - kamion (08/22/2016) [-]
How old are you?
User avatar
#33 - kjoni (08/23/2016) [-]
Oh, and I forgot: if you are still only of the mind that private law would only result in chaos, consider the opposite hypothesis: mises.org/library/wouldnt-warlords-take-over But am I wasting my time or not. I don't know.
User avatar
#32 - kjoni (08/22/2016) [-]
Had I been acting in a composed manner until that last comment? My age? Sorry for trying to level with you in a way that was intended to be humorous and inviting but instead completely distracts you from my points and links and makes you attack people based on things like age... How old are YOU?? Saying people should be forced into silence... Jeez bowl cut, cut it down a notch. I don't want to give in into what you think you're doing. All I wanted was to share a viewpoint with and try to give some insights to someone who disagrees with me. You can look at the links and the arguments for what they're worth, but I sense a personal streak coming from your aim at the characters of the people you've talked to (well, and also from your direct admission to that sort of conduct in your own personal life). I bet that for every second of this you're waiting to gather some piece of personal information, on the basis of which you could just reject every point your opponent (you've roped me now into this mindset) is trying to make. I don't need to just stand here and take this. I was willing to try to give some info out and put my beliefs to the test, but you've thrown it into my face. I'm sorry if me trying to make it a little fun too distracted you from your course. Or did it? I mean, like, even if you were to achieve that goal, would you carefully explain the logical relationship of how that invalidates each specific point, or would you just use it to reinforce your prejudices? You probably think you're pretty hot shit, getting me all defensive about a personal detail only important to you, just so everything I've said to you doesn't become invalidated in your mind. You "win" on that regard. Honestly, I think it's pretty sick, initially using arguments only to inevitably reduce a dispute to something like that. You really hold true to your personal values on that one. I really walked right into this one anyway, trying to talk it through with someone who wants to coerce people into not bringing up valid potentially helpful points. I guess you could say that that kind of thing wouldn't matter to a militarist dictator anyway since their subjects don't have a lot of choice. That's the kind of value system you represent, narc.
#34 - kamion (08/24/2016) [-]
At first I thought you didn't take the bait, but then I read that wall of spoiler text...
You need to work on making your thoughts more concise bitchboy, all those arguments ain't worth shit if you drown them in a sea of blabbing nonsense.

And how old is ME?
I'm a 19 year old guy from Croatia, still a kid just like you. A kid with half a brain unlike you. Just enrolled in law school, and it doesn't start until next month so I might read and watch some of that wisdom you linked me, might not, fuck knows.



OK, now, aside from all that ideological bullshit, you seem to be a reasonably intelligent guy. Impressively researched arguments, a methodical approach to the subject you're discussing, a nice use of some fancy vocabulary, so on and so forth. Aside from that concision thing I mentioned, what you need is an edge, even the most civil of arguments require some edge to win, something that plays on people's lizard brain, not logical reasoning, a style, charisma. I like to mix a little psychotic in there too (it used to win me every class debate in high school, people love that shit), but you don't need to do that.

What I'd like you to do is start going out a bit more, go to a nightclub (or whatever the fuck you call them where you're from) with your friends, supposing you actually have those. Wait until 1 or 2 in the morning, but don't drink. Stay completely sober, and just start watching people around you. Watch them carefully and think about what you're seeing, I did it a year ago a few times when I was a designated driver (try never to be the only one in your group of friends with a car) and found it to be really insightful. Maybe then you'll see why my aggression, assertiveness and dirty arguments tend to work pretty well.
After that you can get shitfaced with your friends and forget all about this nonsense while making out with some girl.


User avatar
#38 - kjoni (08/26/2016) [-]
The very thing I'd argue for would be to reason logically instead of playing on people's lizard brains, because in stressful situations you need to be cold, calculated and alert, that's why I want to empathize with the people that make up this society and dignify their concerns so as to communicate clearly. That seems contradictory, but people are good to work as societies, and societies are good to form trade networks, and for that to work realistically, you must spread understanding. Rivalry is a volatile thing best reserved for the markets. If that doesn't work for a bunch of drunk people at a bar, then I'm sorry, brutha.
#39 - kamion (08/26/2016) [-]
Yes you absolutely need to remain cold, calculated and alert; but only on the inside. Thin line between dignified and weak, even thinner between aloof and being seen as arrogant. You think this world will adapt to you and your two-bit standards of professional conduct. It's not just the drunk people at a bar who will dismiss you, it's most of the human population. My advice remains the same: try to see people as they really are.

P.S. I'd really like to know this time, and I promise nothing you say will be used against you. How old are you and where are you from?
User avatar
#40 - kjoni (08/27/2016) [-]
I'm here to spread ideas and ideas are timeless, enough with this personal information shit. You're just waiting for me to "take the bait". The majority of the world isn't so pathetically dependent on the welfare state that they couldn't understand economic opportunity and rationality. Don't tell people WHOM to dismiss or not, try to see the FACTS as they really are. The difference that makes is like the difference between feudalism and the industrial revolution, you cynical shill. I'm a little ass faggot from Finland talking out of my ass for life, and I'm about to use a kitchen knife against myself. Lizards did 9/11
#41 - kamion (08/27/2016) [-]
"I'm here to spread ideas and ideas are timeless."
Okay little Messiah, good luck with your life.

Btw Harambe did 9/11 and was assassinated for it.
#35 - kamion (08/25/2016) [-]
Oh and another thing. When you really do get down to good old logical reasoning, try to approach it a little colder, more detached. You seem really passionate about this subject, have an air of idealism around you. It's charming, but it doesn't help your case, if what you want is to get down to cold hard truth. You can dismiss me as a regular run-of-the-mill asshole, but sometimes even assholes have something smart to say, when they're not poking fun at you. If I only managed to shove one piece of advice into that thick, volatile head of yours, it would be this: try to see people as they really are.
#4 - In my defense market anarchist, close to anarcho-capitali…  [+] (4 replies) 08/22/2016 on A Day in the Life of an... +1
#8 - anon (08/22/2016) [-]
Lived with/around them my whole life.

Aside from full on maoist socialists/commies, they're the most delusional fucks that have ever walked this Earth. They live the life of a mental gymnast only SJW /pol/tard style people can.

Somehow we're too stupid to govern ourselves as a society, but we'll magically get along with our non-government and our NAP. Don't forget, somehow police, medicine and goods won't turn into horrifying monopolies controlled by quasi warlords.

Naw, everyone would look out for everyone else, even though you fundamentally believe that people don't do that [hence why you hate commies/socialist ideals so much] you is general, not you-you here they'll just get along now!

Never mind all that alone, even giving humanity in all our boundless stupidity the benefit of the doubt, even assuming it wouldn't break into shogun/lord, samurai/knight militia monopolies, let's assume, somehow, that doesn't happen.

Who controls medicine, police? What stops a Martin Shkreli from making it impossible to obtain? Who tells that guy "no"? People? By force? Would he not retaliate?

Oh wait, the magical power of AnCap prevents this. Because reasons.
#9 - anon (08/22/2016) [-]
Also I suppose there's a difference between how they present themselves IRL compared to random guys who've never been around such people.

You two don't seem so bad, so, forgive my autistic fury.
#10 - kjoni (08/22/2016) [-]
D'aww. My presonal thoughts to your previous comment: the process of price hiking, from what I've gathered, requires patents, and it's not certain that intellectual property would exist in a stateless society. IP is like a way of hindering the spread of information for the sake of profit, so I would say there's a continuum between fining people for saying certain words (coercive monopoly), and wanting to keep your own credit card number a secret (private property). Where exactly you draw the line then I think is similar to how you would determine ownership of physical property, through free market consensus. Although in the case of medicine, it would also involve keeping scientific research results a hidden secret too so that no one could try to develop a similar medicine and thence initiate price competition. I don't know how exactly things went down with the Shkreli guy though. Another perspective is that information is not scarce, so it shouldn't be property. But on the other hand, new market-upper-hand-giving ideas are scarce. Maybe you should only disclose important trade secrets to people who aren't in direct competition with your business. Maybe only give out that stuff to bidders? Kinda like Scientology, requiring ever more commitment to get more information about the true beliefs. You'd then have to keep a close eye on corporate cultism like that, with stuff like the media and protection, forensics & arbitration firms and science or smth. Competitive research teams? idk. I like talking to you. U still there?
User avatar
#11 - kjoni (08/22/2016) [-]
My gif might've fucked up a little. We can't all be winners in the gif rendering market
#28 - Few eating the many? That's the exact thing I would claim of a…  [+] (11 replies) 08/20/2016 on AnCap Comp, p6 0
#29 - kamion (08/21/2016) [-]
Yeah, kinda.
Dude, I only want to protect people from themselves. Ensure that the poor cannot sink to rock bottom, ensure that those who have don't forget about those who haven't, ensure that humanity doesn't run rampant because there is no one to control the growth. That the environment is not completely destroyed because fossil fuels are cheapest and most effective, that the lower class is not forced into modern slavery because they have to feed their children and the factory they work in wants to make more money, that every person can count on having a doctor when they need one instead of good health care only being available to middle and upper class, having a credible news source when they want one instead of mainstream media turning into glorified commercials for insanely powerful globalized companies and cartels, having good education for their children when they send them to school, instead of all the good teachers working at private schools where they're paid more and where they have good school infrastructure because the ghettos can't pay for that shit. I only want peace and prosperity, for everyone.

I'm sure you want the same thing, but your insanely positive and optimistic outlook on human nature makes you think that all that would be possible if people were just left alone. Who knows, you might even be right.
User avatar
#30 - kjoni (08/22/2016) [-]
>Ensure that the poor cannot sink to rock bottom
Through welfare?
www.youtube.com/watch?v=XooUY4p4RaY
>the environment is not completely destroyed because fossil fuels are cheapest and most effective
Either we stay, like, hunter-gatherers until the sun burns out and go out with a whimper, or we indulge and go out with a bang. Allegedly. Even besides oil we've got nuclear.
> that the lower class is not forced into modern slavery because they have to feed their children and the factory they work in wants to make more money
What whaaaat?
www.youtube.com/watch?v=J_Qg5xDnNiw
>every person can count on having a doctor when they need one instead of good health care only being available to middle and upper class
R u sure?
www.youtube.com/watch?v=fFoXyFmmGBQ
>insanely powerful globalized companies and cartels
Unlikely to exist under market competition.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=hcZvTcpsuLY&index=8
> if people were just left alone.
Yeah, by government. Wubba lubba dub duuuub
#31 - kamion (08/22/2016) [-]
How old are you?
User avatar
#33 - kjoni (08/23/2016) [-]
Oh, and I forgot: if you are still only of the mind that private law would only result in chaos, consider the opposite hypothesis: mises.org/library/wouldnt-warlords-take-over But am I wasting my time or not. I don't know.
User avatar
#32 - kjoni (08/22/2016) [-]
Had I been acting in a composed manner until that last comment? My age? Sorry for trying to level with you in a way that was intended to be humorous and inviting but instead completely distracts you from my points and links and makes you attack people based on things like age... How old are YOU?? Saying people should be forced into silence... Jeez bowl cut, cut it down a notch. I don't want to give in into what you think you're doing. All I wanted was to share a viewpoint with and try to give some insights to someone who disagrees with me. You can look at the links and the arguments for what they're worth, but I sense a personal streak coming from your aim at the characters of the people you've talked to (well, and also from your direct admission to that sort of conduct in your own personal life). I bet that for every second of this you're waiting to gather some piece of personal information, on the basis of which you could just reject every point your opponent (you've roped me now into this mindset) is trying to make. I don't need to just stand here and take this. I was willing to try to give some info out and put my beliefs to the test, but you've thrown it into my face. I'm sorry if me trying to make it a little fun too distracted you from your course. Or did it? I mean, like, even if you were to achieve that goal, would you carefully explain the logical relationship of how that invalidates each specific point, or would you just use it to reinforce your prejudices? You probably think you're pretty hot shit, getting me all defensive about a personal detail only important to you, just so everything I've said to you doesn't become invalidated in your mind. You "win" on that regard. Honestly, I think it's pretty sick, initially using arguments only to inevitably reduce a dispute to something like that. You really hold true to your personal values on that one. I really walked right into this one anyway, trying to talk it through with someone who wants to coerce people into not bringing up valid potentially helpful points. I guess you could say that that kind of thing wouldn't matter to a militarist dictator anyway since their subjects don't have a lot of choice. That's the kind of value system you represent, narc.
#34 - kamion (08/24/2016) [-]
At first I thought you didn't take the bait, but then I read that wall of spoiler text...
You need to work on making your thoughts more concise bitchboy, all those arguments ain't worth shit if you drown them in a sea of blabbing nonsense.

And how old is ME?
I'm a 19 year old guy from Croatia, still a kid just like you. A kid with half a brain unlike you. Just enrolled in law school, and it doesn't start until next month so I might read and watch some of that wisdom you linked me, might not, fuck knows.



OK, now, aside from all that ideological bullshit, you seem to be a reasonably intelligent guy. Impressively researched arguments, a methodical approach to the subject you're discussing, a nice use of some fancy vocabulary, so on and so forth. Aside from that concision thing I mentioned, what you need is an edge, even the most civil of arguments require some edge to win, something that plays on people's lizard brain, not logical reasoning, a style, charisma. I like to mix a little psychotic in there too (it used to win me every class debate in high school, people love that shit), but you don't need to do that.

What I'd like you to do is start going out a bit more, go to a nightclub (or whatever the fuck you call them where you're from) with your friends, supposing you actually have those. Wait until 1 or 2 in the morning, but don't drink. Stay completely sober, and just start watching people around you. Watch them carefully and think about what you're seeing, I did it a year ago a few times when I was a designated driver (try never to be the only one in your group of friends with a car) and found it to be really insightful. Maybe then you'll see why my aggression, assertiveness and dirty arguments tend to work pretty well.
After that you can get shitfaced with your friends and forget all about this nonsense while making out with some girl.


User avatar
#38 - kjoni (08/26/2016) [-]
The very thing I'd argue for would be to reason logically instead of playing on people's lizard brains, because in stressful situations you need to be cold, calculated and alert, that's why I want to empathize with the people that make up this society and dignify their concerns so as to communicate clearly. That seems contradictory, but people are good to work as societies, and societies are good to form trade networks, and for that to work realistically, you must spread understanding. Rivalry is a volatile thing best reserved for the markets. If that doesn't work for a bunch of drunk people at a bar, then I'm sorry, brutha.
#39 - kamion (08/26/2016) [-]
Yes you absolutely need to remain cold, calculated and alert; but only on the inside. Thin line between dignified and weak, even thinner between aloof and being seen as arrogant. You think this world will adapt to you and your two-bit standards of professional conduct. It's not just the drunk people at a bar who will dismiss you, it's most of the human population. My advice remains the same: try to see people as they really are.

P.S. I'd really like to know this time, and I promise nothing you say will be used against you. How old are you and where are you from?
User avatar
#40 - kjoni (08/27/2016) [-]
I'm here to spread ideas and ideas are timeless, enough with this personal information shit. You're just waiting for me to "take the bait". The majority of the world isn't so pathetically dependent on the welfare state that they couldn't understand economic opportunity and rationality. Don't tell people WHOM to dismiss or not, try to see the FACTS as they really are. The difference that makes is like the difference between feudalism and the industrial revolution, you cynical shill. I'm a little ass faggot from Finland talking out of my ass for life, and I'm about to use a kitchen knife against myself. Lizards did 9/11
#41 - kamion (08/27/2016) [-]
"I'm here to spread ideas and ideas are timeless."
Okay little Messiah, good luck with your life.

Btw Harambe did 9/11 and was assassinated for it.
#35 - kamion (08/25/2016) [-]
Oh and another thing. When you really do get down to good old logical reasoning, try to approach it a little colder, more detached. You seem really passionate about this subject, have an air of idealism around you. It's charming, but it doesn't help your case, if what you want is to get down to cold hard truth. You can dismiss me as a regular run-of-the-mill asshole, but sometimes even assholes have something smart to say, when they're not poking fun at you. If I only managed to shove one piece of advice into that thick, volatile head of yours, it would be this: try to see people as they really are.
#26 - Hey, you can make fun of me all you want, but all I'm asking y…  [+] (13 replies) 08/19/2016 on AnCap Comp, p6 +1
#27 - kamion (08/19/2016) [-]
I wanna ridicule them into silence, or better yet, force them into silence. Because it's a lost cause trying to explain yourself to people in general, they won't listen. I could try to explain myself to you, you wouldn't listen, because you will always value your opinion over mine, no matter which one is more valid. The only real freedom is power. I know I sound a bit ridiculous, but that's the way I view things, and it's worked pretty well in my life so far.

Anyways, bottom-up cooperation works quite well in a tribe of 10 people, not so much in a complex society. Police, military and the legal system absolutely need to be a state monopoly. They have to be entities beyond reproach. I completely agree with competitive market, healthy competition is essential for a stable economy. But a society where market is completely free, capital reigns supreme and everything can be bought and sold is a society that wouldn't result in healthy bottom up cooperation, it would result in a few eating the many. It's just the way of things, those powerful would seek to become more powerful without the police or legal system as a higher entity to stop them. I'm not against freedom of people or the market, I am against true freedom, the one without boundaries.
User avatar
#28 - kjoni (08/20/2016) [-]
Few eating the many? That's the exact thing I would claim of a state system. Those who want more power wouldn't have the infrastructure of the state for them to seize. They'd have to start from scratch, first by succeeding in the free market, and then what? Violent conquest? They'd be weeded out by protection firms and the media quicker than they accumulated enough wherewithal to buy their weapons. Religious personality cults? Anarchism makes no pretenses towards such things. Money manipulation? There'd be no taxes to give to a central bank. The cultural perception of the necessity of government monopolies is precisely why the few get to eat the many. If abuse is preferable to peaceful negotiation for you personally, then I see why dictatorial censorship would help upholding society in your mind, but you also say that things need "higher entities" to stop them. I'd say that then creating a state that's higher than anything else whatsoever is committing suicide. But then again, you don't want to discuss, you want to shut me up, amirite?
#29 - kamion (08/21/2016) [-]
Yeah, kinda.
Dude, I only want to protect people from themselves. Ensure that the poor cannot sink to rock bottom, ensure that those who have don't forget about those who haven't, ensure that humanity doesn't run rampant because there is no one to control the growth. That the environment is not completely destroyed because fossil fuels are cheapest and most effective, that the lower class is not forced into modern slavery because they have to feed their children and the factory they work in wants to make more money, that every person can count on having a doctor when they need one instead of good health care only being available to middle and upper class, having a credible news source when they want one instead of mainstream media turning into glorified commercials for insanely powerful globalized companies and cartels, having good education for their children when they send them to school, instead of all the good teachers working at private schools where they're paid more and where they have good school infrastructure because the ghettos can't pay for that shit. I only want peace and prosperity, for everyone.

I'm sure you want the same thing, but your insanely positive and optimistic outlook on human nature makes you think that all that would be possible if people were just left alone. Who knows, you might even be right.
User avatar
#30 - kjoni (08/22/2016) [-]
>Ensure that the poor cannot sink to rock bottom
Through welfare?
www.youtube.com/watch?v=XooUY4p4RaY
>the environment is not completely destroyed because fossil fuels are cheapest and most effective
Either we stay, like, hunter-gatherers until the sun burns out and go out with a whimper, or we indulge and go out with a bang. Allegedly. Even besides oil we've got nuclear.
> that the lower class is not forced into modern slavery because they have to feed their children and the factory they work in wants to make more money
What whaaaat?
www.youtube.com/watch?v=J_Qg5xDnNiw
>every person can count on having a doctor when they need one instead of good health care only being available to middle and upper class
R u sure?
www.youtube.com/watch?v=fFoXyFmmGBQ
>insanely powerful globalized companies and cartels
Unlikely to exist under market competition.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=hcZvTcpsuLY&index=8
> if people were just left alone.
Yeah, by government. Wubba lubba dub duuuub
#31 - kamion (08/22/2016) [-]
How old are you?
User avatar
#33 - kjoni (08/23/2016) [-]
Oh, and I forgot: if you are still only of the mind that private law would only result in chaos, consider the opposite hypothesis: mises.org/library/wouldnt-warlords-take-over But am I wasting my time or not. I don't know.
User avatar
#32 - kjoni (08/22/2016) [-]
Had I been acting in a composed manner until that last comment? My age? Sorry for trying to level with you in a way that was intended to be humorous and inviting but instead completely distracts you from my points and links and makes you attack people based on things like age... How old are YOU?? Saying people should be forced into silence... Jeez bowl cut, cut it down a notch. I don't want to give in into what you think you're doing. All I wanted was to share a viewpoint with and try to give some insights to someone who disagrees with me. You can look at the links and the arguments for what they're worth, but I sense a personal streak coming from your aim at the characters of the people you've talked to (well, and also from your direct admission to that sort of conduct in your own personal life). I bet that for every second of this you're waiting to gather some piece of personal information, on the basis of which you could just reject every point your opponent (you've roped me now into this mindset) is trying to make. I don't need to just stand here and take this. I was willing to try to give some info out and put my beliefs to the test, but you've thrown it into my face. I'm sorry if me trying to make it a little fun too distracted you from your course. Or did it? I mean, like, even if you were to achieve that goal, would you carefully explain the logical relationship of how that invalidates each specific point, or would you just use it to reinforce your prejudices? You probably think you're pretty hot shit, getting me all defensive about a personal detail only important to you, just so everything I've said to you doesn't become invalidated in your mind. You "win" on that regard. Honestly, I think it's pretty sick, initially using arguments only to inevitably reduce a dispute to something like that. You really hold true to your personal values on that one. I really walked right into this one anyway, trying to talk it through with someone who wants to coerce people into not bringing up valid potentially helpful points. I guess you could say that that kind of thing wouldn't matter to a militarist dictator anyway since their subjects don't have a lot of choice. That's the kind of value system you represent, narc.
#34 - kamion (08/24/2016) [-]
At first I thought you didn't take the bait, but then I read that wall of spoiler text...
You need to work on making your thoughts more concise bitchboy, all those arguments ain't worth shit if you drown them in a sea of blabbing nonsense.

And how old is ME?
I'm a 19 year old guy from Croatia, still a kid just like you. A kid with half a brain unlike you. Just enrolled in law school, and it doesn't start until next month so I might read and watch some of that wisdom you linked me, might not, fuck knows.



OK, now, aside from all that ideological bullshit, you seem to be a reasonably intelligent guy. Impressively researched arguments, a methodical approach to the subject you're discussing, a nice use of some fancy vocabulary, so on and so forth. Aside from that concision thing I mentioned, what you need is an edge, even the most civil of arguments require some edge to win, something that plays on people's lizard brain, not logical reasoning, a style, charisma. I like to mix a little psychotic in there too (it used to win me every class debate in high school, people love that shit), but you don't need to do that.

What I'd like you to do is start going out a bit more, go to a nightclub (or whatever the fuck you call them where you're from) with your friends, supposing you actually have those. Wait until 1 or 2 in the morning, but don't drink. Stay completely sober, and just start watching people around you. Watch them carefully and think about what you're seeing, I did it a year ago a few times when I was a designated driver (try never to be the only one in your group of friends with a car) and found it to be really insightful. Maybe then you'll see why my aggression, assertiveness and dirty arguments tend to work pretty well.
After that you can get shitfaced with your friends and forget all about this nonsense while making out with some girl.


User avatar
#38 - kjoni (08/26/2016) [-]
The very thing I'd argue for would be to reason logically instead of playing on people's lizard brains, because in stressful situations you need to be cold, calculated and alert, that's why I want to empathize with the people that make up this society and dignify their concerns so as to communicate clearly. That seems contradictory, but people are good to work as societies, and societies are good to form trade networks, and for that to work realistically, you must spread understanding. Rivalry is a volatile thing best reserved for the markets. If that doesn't work for a bunch of drunk people at a bar, then I'm sorry, brutha.
#39 - kamion (08/26/2016) [-]
Yes you absolutely need to remain cold, calculated and alert; but only on the inside. Thin line between dignified and weak, even thinner between aloof and being seen as arrogant. You think this world will adapt to you and your two-bit standards of professional conduct. It's not just the drunk people at a bar who will dismiss you, it's most of the human population. My advice remains the same: try to see people as they really are.

P.S. I'd really like to know this time, and I promise nothing you say will be used against you. How old are you and where are you from?
User avatar
#40 - kjoni (08/27/2016) [-]
I'm here to spread ideas and ideas are timeless, enough with this personal information shit. You're just waiting for me to "take the bait". The majority of the world isn't so pathetically dependent on the welfare state that they couldn't understand economic opportunity and rationality. Don't tell people WHOM to dismiss or not, try to see the FACTS as they really are. The difference that makes is like the difference between feudalism and the industrial revolution, you cynical shill. I'm a little ass faggot from Finland talking out of my ass for life, and I'm about to use a kitchen knife against myself. Lizards did 9/11
#41 - kamion (08/27/2016) [-]
"I'm here to spread ideas and ideas are timeless."
Okay little Messiah, good luck with your life.

Btw Harambe did 9/11 and was assassinated for it.
#35 - kamion (08/25/2016) [-]
Oh and another thing. When you really do get down to good old logical reasoning, try to approach it a little colder, more detached. You seem really passionate about this subject, have an air of idealism around you. It's charming, but it doesn't help your case, if what you want is to get down to cold hard truth. You can dismiss me as a regular run-of-the-mill asshole, but sometimes even assholes have something smart to say, when they're not poking fun at you. If I only managed to shove one piece of advice into that thick, volatile head of yours, it would be this: try to see people as they really are.
#22 - Why would you build your massive mansion in the middle of your…  [+] (2 replies) 08/19/2016 on AnCap Comp, p6 0
#36 - jamesten (08/25/2016) [-]
>ancap
>roads
#37 - kjoni (08/25/2016) [-]
>not providing near-by road services as part of the infrastructure of your establishment
>not building a road as you're building a house away from previous roads
>not working as a security guard for a private road out in the countryside
#21 - >Well ****, if that person on your profile pic is you, you'…  [+] (15 replies) 08/19/2016 on AnCap Comp, p6 0
#23 - kamion (08/19/2016) [-]
You're a babbling idealist who thinks he drank all the knowledge of this world. Now how's that for ad hominem and argument from ridicule or whatever the fuck else you like to come up with to convince yourself that you're above being made fun of.
The reason I attack both the argument and the guy who presented it is because it works in the real world, no matter the logical fallacy.
Look, I think the main difference in our worldview is that you perceive humanity as a coherent bunch of mainly good-hearted people who would find a way to live in peace and prosperity if they were just released from the iron fist of the strong and corrupted government.
I see humanity as a dumb, panicky animal who needs to be kept on a leash in order not to tear itself apart like a beast it is. I don't support welfare state, what I support is pure dictatorship, not by one person (that shit always goes south), but still, a tightly dictated state. People don't want to be free of oppressive authority, they want to be happy.
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#26 - kjoni (08/19/2016) [-]
Hey, you can make fun of me all you want, but all I'm asking you is whether you want to make a rational case for why people should heed your suggestions or whether you want to ridicule them into silence? Furthermore, which choice would represent a more functional society? You might call me a babbling idealist for wanting a society with more choice, ie. free markets rather than nationalized state monopolies, but history will show you that free enterprise produces way more wealth than strict statist structures, compare south and north Korea, and the Roman empire which started decaying after its constant influx of slaves from conquered territories stopped as expansion stopped like some kind of a pyramid scheme of slavery and war. Anarcho-Capitalism just expands that principle to the logical end-point, posing that nothing about the police and the military (extensions of self-defense) or the legal system (arbitration and contract enforcement) needs to necessarily be a state monopoly (among with every other service). Indeed, competitive markets produce goods more in line with consumer demand.
If we can't trust people with freedom, why should we trust them with power? Honestly, would you call the Chinese happy in regards to their government (opening your markets is really a solution to a problem that you, by yourself, caused in the first place) compared to the west for example? Lots of state control there y'know. And with good intentions too, I'm sure. Sure works in the real world, like being the dictator of a centralized government that exists because everyone is automatically convinced that top-down authority is better than bottom-up cooperation.
#27 - kamion (08/19/2016) [-]
I wanna ridicule them into silence, or better yet, force them into silence. Because it's a lost cause trying to explain yourself to people in general, they won't listen. I could try to explain myself to you, you wouldn't listen, because you will always value your opinion over mine, no matter which one is more valid. The only real freedom is power. I know I sound a bit ridiculous, but that's the way I view things, and it's worked pretty well in my life so far.

Anyways, bottom-up cooperation works quite well in a tribe of 10 people, not so much in a complex society. Police, military and the legal system absolutely need to be a state monopoly. They have to be entities beyond reproach. I completely agree with competitive market, healthy competition is essential for a stable economy. But a society where market is completely free, capital reigns supreme and everything can be bought and sold is a society that wouldn't result in healthy bottom up cooperation, it would result in a few eating the many. It's just the way of things, those powerful would seek to become more powerful without the police or legal system as a higher entity to stop them. I'm not against freedom of people or the market, I am against true freedom, the one without boundaries.
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#28 - kjoni (08/20/2016) [-]
Few eating the many? That's the exact thing I would claim of a state system. Those who want more power wouldn't have the infrastructure of the state for them to seize. They'd have to start from scratch, first by succeeding in the free market, and then what? Violent conquest? They'd be weeded out by protection firms and the media quicker than they accumulated enough wherewithal to buy their weapons. Religious personality cults? Anarchism makes no pretenses towards such things. Money manipulation? There'd be no taxes to give to a central bank. The cultural perception of the necessity of government monopolies is precisely why the few get to eat the many. If abuse is preferable to peaceful negotiation for you personally, then I see why dictatorial censorship would help upholding society in your mind, but you also say that things need "higher entities" to stop them. I'd say that then creating a state that's higher than anything else whatsoever is committing suicide. But then again, you don't want to discuss, you want to shut me up, amirite?
#29 - kamion (08/21/2016) [-]
Yeah, kinda.
Dude, I only want to protect people from themselves. Ensure that the poor cannot sink to rock bottom, ensure that those who have don't forget about those who haven't, ensure that humanity doesn't run rampant because there is no one to control the growth. That the environment is not completely destroyed because fossil fuels are cheapest and most effective, that the lower class is not forced into modern slavery because they have to feed their children and the factory they work in wants to make more money, that every person can count on having a doctor when they need one instead of good health care only being available to middle and upper class, having a credible news source when they want one instead of mainstream media turning into glorified commercials for insanely powerful globalized companies and cartels, having good education for their children when they send them to school, instead of all the good teachers working at private schools where they're paid more and where they have good school infrastructure because the ghettos can't pay for that shit. I only want peace and prosperity, for everyone.

I'm sure you want the same thing, but your insanely positive and optimistic outlook on human nature makes you think that all that would be possible if people were just left alone. Who knows, you might even be right.
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#30 - kjoni (08/22/2016) [-]
>Ensure that the poor cannot sink to rock bottom
Through welfare?
www.youtube.com/watch?v=XooUY4p4RaY
>the environment is not completely destroyed because fossil fuels are cheapest and most effective
Either we stay, like, hunter-gatherers until the sun burns out and go out with a whimper, or we indulge and go out with a bang. Allegedly. Even besides oil we've got nuclear.
> that the lower class is not forced into modern slavery because they have to feed their children and the factory they work in wants to make more money
What whaaaat?
www.youtube.com/watch?v=J_Qg5xDnNiw
>every person can count on having a doctor when they need one instead of good health care only being available to middle and upper class
R u sure?
www.youtube.com/watch?v=fFoXyFmmGBQ
>insanely powerful globalized companies and cartels
Unlikely to exist under market competition.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=hcZvTcpsuLY&index=8
> if people were just left alone.
Yeah, by government. Wubba lubba dub duuuub
#31 - kamion (08/22/2016) [-]
How old are you?
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#33 - kjoni (08/23/2016) [-]
Oh, and I forgot: if you are still only of the mind that private law would only result in chaos, consider the opposite hypothesis: mises.org/library/wouldnt-warlords-take-over But am I wasting my time or not. I don't know.
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#32 - kjoni (08/22/2016) [-]
Had I been acting in a composed manner until that last comment? My age? Sorry for trying to level with you in a way that was intended to be humorous and inviting but instead completely distracts you from my points and links and makes you attack people based on things like age... How old are YOU?? Saying people should be forced into silence... Jeez bowl cut, cut it down a notch. I don't want to give in into what you think you're doing. All I wanted was to share a viewpoint with and try to give some insights to someone who disagrees with me. You can look at the links and the arguments for what they're worth, but I sense a personal streak coming from your aim at the characters of the people you've talked to (well, and also from your direct admission to that sort of conduct in your own personal life). I bet that for every second of this you're waiting to gather some piece of personal information, on the basis of which you could just reject every point your opponent (you've roped me now into this mindset) is trying to make. I don't need to just stand here and take this. I was willing to try to give some info out and put my beliefs to the test, but you've thrown it into my face. I'm sorry if me trying to make it a little fun too distracted you from your course. Or did it? I mean, like, even if you were to achieve that goal, would you carefully explain the logical relationship of how that invalidates each specific point, or would you just use it to reinforce your prejudices? You probably think you're pretty hot shit, getting me all defensive about a personal detail only important to you, just so everything I've said to you doesn't become invalidated in your mind. You "win" on that regard. Honestly, I think it's pretty sick, initially using arguments only to inevitably reduce a dispute to something like that. You really hold true to your personal values on that one. I really walked right into this one anyway, trying to talk it through with someone who wants to coerce people into not bringing up valid potentially helpful points. I guess you could say that that kind of thing wouldn't matter to a militarist dictator anyway since their subjects don't have a lot of choice. That's the kind of value system you represent, narc.
#34 - kamion (08/24/2016) [-]
At first I thought you didn't take the bait, but then I read that wall of spoiler text...
You need to work on making your thoughts more concise bitchboy, all those arguments ain't worth shit if you drown them in a sea of blabbing nonsense.

And how old is ME?
I'm a 19 year old guy from Croatia, still a kid just like you. A kid with half a brain unlike you. Just enrolled in law school, and it doesn't start until next month so I might read and watch some of that wisdom you linked me, might not, fuck knows.



OK, now, aside from all that ideological bullshit, you seem to be a reasonably intelligent guy. Impressively researched arguments, a methodical approach to the subject you're discussing, a nice use of some fancy vocabulary, so on and so forth. Aside from that concision thing I mentioned, what you need is an edge, even the most civil of arguments require some edge to win, something that plays on people's lizard brain, not logical reasoning, a style, charisma. I like to mix a little psychotic in there too (it used to win me every class debate in high school, people love that shit), but you don't need to do that.

What I'd like you to do is start going out a bit more, go to a nightclub (or whatever the fuck you call them where you're from) with your friends, supposing you actually have those. Wait until 1 or 2 in the morning, but don't drink. Stay completely sober, and just start watching people around you. Watch them carefully and think about what you're seeing, I did it a year ago a few times when I was a designated driver (try never to be the only one in your group of friends with a car) and found it to be really insightful. Maybe then you'll see why my aggression, assertiveness and dirty arguments tend to work pretty well.
After that you can get shitfaced with your friends and forget all about this nonsense while making out with some girl.


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#38 - kjoni (08/26/2016) [-]
The very thing I'd argue for would be to reason logically instead of playing on people's lizard brains, because in stressful situations you need to be cold, calculated and alert, that's why I want to empathize with the people that make up this society and dignify their concerns so as to communicate clearly. That seems contradictory, but people are good to work as societies, and societies are good to form trade networks, and for that to work realistically, you must spread understanding. Rivalry is a volatile thing best reserved for the markets. If that doesn't work for a bunch of drunk people at a bar, then I'm sorry, brutha.
#39 - kamion (08/26/2016) [-]
Yes you absolutely need to remain cold, calculated and alert; but only on the inside. Thin line between dignified and weak, even thinner between aloof and being seen as arrogant. You think this world will adapt to you and your two-bit standards of professional conduct. It's not just the drunk people at a bar who will dismiss you, it's most of the human population. My advice remains the same: try to see people as they really are.

P.S. I'd really like to know this time, and I promise nothing you say will be used against you. How old are you and where are you from?
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#40 - kjoni (08/27/2016) [-]
I'm here to spread ideas and ideas are timeless, enough with this personal information shit. You're just waiting for me to "take the bait". The majority of the world isn't so pathetically dependent on the welfare state that they couldn't understand economic opportunity and rationality. Don't tell people WHOM to dismiss or not, try to see the FACTS as they really are. The difference that makes is like the difference between feudalism and the industrial revolution, you cynical shill. I'm a little ass faggot from Finland talking out of my ass for life, and I'm about to use a kitchen knife against myself. Lizards did 9/11
#41 - kamion (08/27/2016) [-]
"I'm here to spread ideas and ideas are timeless."
Okay little Messiah, good luck with your life.

Btw Harambe did 9/11 and was assassinated for it.
#35 - kamion (08/25/2016) [-]
Oh and another thing. When you really do get down to good old logical reasoning, try to approach it a little colder, more detached. You seem really passionate about this subject, have an air of idealism around you. It's charming, but it doesn't help your case, if what you want is to get down to cold hard truth. You can dismiss me as a regular run-of-the-mill asshole, but sometimes even assholes have something smart to say, when they're not poking fun at you. If I only managed to shove one piece of advice into that thick, volatile head of yours, it would be this: try to see people as they really are.