I'm not dismissing the concept as useless, I dismissing the concept of 0 uncertainty as useless. "the more you know about one, the less you know about the other" is pretty much exactly what I was saying... Not, you can only know one of them which is quite misleading.

That definition of certainty is completely useless because 0 uncertainty doesn't exist... That equation is a physics equation. As far as reality is concerned, you know both to at least some degree. To say you can't know both is misleading to anyone who doesn't define "know" as infinite certainty...

The point is, the more you know about one, the less you know about the other. It is not completely useless, it helps us to understand the uncertainty principle. To dismiss a concept as useless as it is not possible in reality is foolish. The underlining reason why you cannot know the position and momentum of a particle with absolute certainty is the uncertainty principle.

I'm not dismissing the concept as useless, I dismissing the concept of 0 uncertainty as useless. "the more you know about one, the less you know about the other" is pretty much exactly what I was saying... Not, you can only know one of them which is quite misleading.

no... you can know both up to h-bar/2. As in, if your uncertainty in position is as low as h-bar, your certainty in momentum will be valued 1/2

as in the lowest value of your momentum uncertainty will be 1/2

You cannot know both, to say you know one with certainty means that the uncertainty = 0, which doesn't satisfy the equation.

Or: As the uncertainty in position approaches zero, the uncertainty in momentum becomes very large, so much so that you cannot have any idea of it's momentum with any real certainty.

That definition of certainty is completely useless because 0 uncertainty doesn't exist... That equation is a physics equation. As far as reality is concerned, you know both to at least some degree. To say you can't know both is misleading to anyone who doesn't define "know" as infinite certainty...

The point is, the more you know about one, the less you know about the other. It is not completely useless, it helps us to understand the uncertainty principle. To dismiss a concept as useless as it is not possible in reality is foolish. The underlining reason why you cannot know the position and momentum of a particle with absolute certainty is the uncertainty principle.

I'm not dismissing the concept as useless, I dismissing the concept of 0 uncertainty as useless. "the more you know about one, the less you know about the other" is pretty much exactly what I was saying... Not, you can only know one of them which is quite misleading.

planck* not plank
i'm very sorry, i can't help it :S

Isn't it like if you know the position, you can't know the momentum and if you know the momentum, you can't know the position? I'm trying to remember... :S

What hell are you guys saying? You CAN know both the position and momentum, that equation just says the more you know about one, the less you know about the other (gives it a specific value)

Dude, I explicitly said on my comment that I was trying to remember this shit. It's been a long time since I even looked at this.

my bad, didn't mean to single you out, my reply was kind of in response to this entire chain

yes, that comes from it. If you know either x or p then the related term becomes "0", making the left hand side equal to zero, which doesn't satisfy the equation. So you cannot know both with any real certainty.

no... you can know both up to h-bar/2. As in, if your uncertainty in position is as low as h-bar, your certainty in momentum will be valued 1/2

as in the lowest value of your momentum uncertainty will be 1/2

You cannot know both, to say you know one with certainty means that the uncertainty = 0, which doesn't satisfy the equation.

Or: As the uncertainty in position approaches zero, the uncertainty in momentum becomes very large, so much so that you cannot have any idea of it's momentum with any real certainty.

That definition of certainty is completely useless because 0 uncertainty doesn't exist... That equation is a physics equation. As far as reality is concerned, you know both to at least some degree. To say you can't know both is misleading to anyone who doesn't define "know" as infinite certainty...

The point is, the more you know about one, the less you know about the other. It is not completely useless, it helps us to understand the uncertainty principle. To dismiss a concept as useless as it is not possible in reality is foolish. The underlining reason why you cannot know the position and momentum of a particle with absolute certainty is the uncertainty principle.

I'm not dismissing the concept as useless, I dismissing the concept of 0 uncertainty as useless. "the more you know about one, the less you know about the other" is pretty much exactly what I was saying... Not, you can only know one of them which is quite misleading.

dont ask me how it works, but ive used it before now and it does work

the last one is true, its an outdoor survivor tip

Not only would the temperature change not be able to travel all the way to your teeth, but it's nerves not veins that cause toothache

dont ask me how it works, but ive used it before now and it does work

This