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caesarslegion

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#90 - There is no such thing as a robot that doesn't do things it's …  [+] (7 replies) 09/12/2016 on Lancer 0
#130 - angelicdemon (09/12/2016) [-]
I hear your argument and raise you ZAX.
fallout.wikia.com/wiki/ZAX

This was a robot built to simply aid in scientific research at "The Glow" or "West Tek Research Centre"

It plays chess and has been playing chess for a long time along with thinking about it's own existence instead of sitting idle because there was no research to do. It was a "Robot" built to research and it's doing things other than researching.
#179 - icantbelieveitsnot (09/12/2016) [-]
which is fictional
#200 - angelicdemon (09/14/2016) [-]
This discussion is about the fallout universe you nigger.
User avatar
#127 - leonhardt (09/12/2016) [-]
Jeez, calm down Maxson.
User avatar
#101 - therealtjthemedic (09/12/2016) [-]
And there's no such thing as a human who doesn't do what it's programmed to do, unless it's defective.
Humans are biological machines, with every instinct, fear, and thought a manifestation of the body's ultimate goal of continuously consuming resources and reproducing another copy of itself to no end.
#180 - icantbelieveitsnot (09/12/2016) [-]
That is an interesting though on the theory of determination, the base of the argument is that nothing and nobody has free will. Everything should follow exactly what it is programed to do. The physical world should all follow the laws. My issue with the idea of determinism is that The Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle tells us that it is impossible for us to use determinism to map out the future, as we cannot map out the present, which suggests that everything is not set in stone, and we may intact have free will.
#118 - masterboll (09/12/2016) [-]
#84 - And as a side note, synths aren't people.  [+] (17 replies) 09/12/2016 on Lancer +1
User avatar
#103 - inverseiconoclasm (09/12/2016) [-]
They're just synthetic clones man. That's really all they are. They're not half the threat they could and probably should be.
User avatar
#88 - angelicdemon (09/12/2016) [-]
Any robotic entity that questions if it's alive and hasn't been programmed to do so has reached the singularity and should be considered alive.
#91 - heilhotwheels (09/12/2016) [-]
That's a pretty arbitrary and non-science based requirement for what living is

A living object is defined as one that was born, can die, and demonstrates the qualities of a living creature. Synths are by definition, non-living.
User avatar
#129 - angelicdemon (09/12/2016) [-]
"Does this unit have a soul"
There is not science to souls.
Souls are a concept made by a biological machine and we can't confirm that they exist but we all feel that we have one somehow.

Have you ever played the game SOMA? It pretty much covers the issue.
Here, have a video. Extra Credits  The Singularity  When Technology Becomes Sentient

A machine able to both understand being alive and also question if it's alive would destroy all we understand. It is impossible for me to comprehend I can't even put it into words. Your idea of life is based on our observations. Being alive is an abstract concept.
#178 - icantbelieveitsnot (09/12/2016) [-]
they would still not be considered living, they do not fit the characteristics of life, like being made of cells. being born is not actually a characteristic given to living things, as hellhotwheels stated. but I agree with theealtjthemedic, in that the definition of living is not really the important point.

The issue lays more in the idea of consciousness, as you said, if it UNDERSTANDS what being alive is. The issues with this definition, is that we do not understand it ourselves. We do not understand the processes of how the brain works in order to produce thoughts and feelings. We may create an intelligence that was able to learn, and reprogram, but we do not understand still whether it is able to truly create complex thought and emotion rather then mimic it. We would need to understand actually how these processes happen in our own brain. Interestingly, if it were to beat us to the punch, and understand exactly what makes our brain tic, one could argue then that we were taught what it means to be alive by a computer. At which point we or the computer would have to create a metric for a new definition.

Additionally, there are physical limitations to the memory storage, and complexities to computers that we will not likely be able to reach this level anytime in the near future. The idea of accelerated returns such as Moore's law will reach physical limitations and decelerate. Computers will have to make a literal and metaphorical quantum leap before they would be able to reach anywhere near the complexities of the human brain. We have barely scratched the surface of the brain, so the idea that we would be able to make something that would evolve and reprogram itself would require that it have a greater complexity, which we are simply nowhere near.
#164 - anon (09/12/2016) [-]
Nice avatar btw
User avatar
#199 - angelicdemon (09/14/2016) [-]
Ty
Killgore best girl.
#201 - anon (09/14/2016) [-]
Surrender!
User avatar
#100 - therealtjthemedic (09/12/2016) [-]
And being alive isn't a meaningful definition for whether something is intelligent and is ethically wrong to destroy.
Bacterium are alive. A hypothetical computer with the exact same consciousness as a human would not be alive, but destroying it would be the same as killing a human.
User avatar
#90 - caesarslegion (09/12/2016) [-]
There is no such thing as a robot that doesn't do things it's not programmed to do. A machine designed for killing won't one day decide to stop killing, synths are at their core programmed to behave in a human manner because in the Institute's eyes they were to replace all natural life in the wastes.

They should never have existed, they are not people, destroy the source of the synths and then just leave the ones already out there alone, since there is "no way" to tell other than killing them. Which I feel is just a bullshit excuse Bethesda used to blur the lines
#130 - angelicdemon (09/12/2016) [-]
I hear your argument and raise you ZAX.
fallout.wikia.com/wiki/ZAX

This was a robot built to simply aid in scientific research at "The Glow" or "West Tek Research Centre"

It plays chess and has been playing chess for a long time along with thinking about it's own existence instead of sitting idle because there was no research to do. It was a "Robot" built to research and it's doing things other than researching.
#179 - icantbelieveitsnot (09/12/2016) [-]
which is fictional
#200 - angelicdemon (09/14/2016) [-]
This discussion is about the fallout universe you nigger.
User avatar
#127 - leonhardt (09/12/2016) [-]
Jeez, calm down Maxson.
User avatar
#101 - therealtjthemedic (09/12/2016) [-]
And there's no such thing as a human who doesn't do what it's programmed to do, unless it's defective.
Humans are biological machines, with every instinct, fear, and thought a manifestation of the body's ultimate goal of continuously consuming resources and reproducing another copy of itself to no end.
#180 - icantbelieveitsnot (09/12/2016) [-]
That is an interesting though on the theory of determination, the base of the argument is that nothing and nobody has free will. Everything should follow exactly what it is programed to do. The physical world should all follow the laws. My issue with the idea of determinism is that The Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle tells us that it is impossible for us to use determinism to map out the future, as we cannot map out the present, which suggests that everything is not set in stone, and we may intact have free will.
#118 - masterboll (09/12/2016) [-]
#83 - Everyone says that, but Lyons brotherhood pissed me off with a…  [+] (24 replies) 09/12/2016 on Lancer +14
#87 - angelicdemon (09/12/2016) [-]
"The peace with NCR served to ease Veronica's worries about the Brotherhood's immediate future. Still, a distance had arisen between her and her fellow members that would never be bridged. She began secluding herself in crumbling libraries of the Old World, learning of promising technologies she knew the Brotherhood would never adopt" This isn't how I want it to go. They would kill an entire race and destroy the tech that could be used to secure their own food and water for the rest of time. They blew the institute up to sate their own fanaticism, oh no synths tickle my butthole forget that they have flourishing green plants and free access to clean water and clean housing. They completely ignored useful and incredibly powerful technologies. If you're going to rough it alone at least be smart about it, don't let your own fanaticism destroy your chance at a civilized wasteland without any fears for stuff like food and water. Fuck they even found ways to CURE mutants. Freedom is an important value, just as important as honor and duty to me. The other chapters that I believed in had some idea of that. I'm not one for arguing on the internet my ideas get a bit muddled but I still feel like Maxson has taken the idea of the brotherhood too far. I agree with you, the brotherhood originally was meant to be like this secure tech until people are ready. But I don't think that it's what the brotherhood should be. I value what the brotherhood was in all the games except fallout Tactics and 4.
#125 - rainbowblast (09/12/2016) [-]
I mean sure the Institute had some cool tech but they definitely were kidnapping people and replacing them with synths and they definitely kidnapped your child instead of just taking all 3 of you and explaining the situation.
#126 - angelicdemon (09/12/2016) [-]
The baby was the best possible option for the institute.

Listen, tech is tech. Research is research, just because the source is corrupt doesn't mean the information is. You can feel shame but shame means nothing when you are dying of thirst and your stomach is clenched tight. Look past your morality, your son did great things, if they had asked you and explained the situation you might've said no. They couldn't take that chance.

Listen, it was Kellog's fucked up fault that your SO was killed. The institute might be ass but it's advanced ass.
#157 - anon (09/12/2016) [-]
You know who else made some groundbreaking research by ignoring morals?

Nazi Scientists using 'undesirables' in human experimentation.
#198 - angelicdemon (09/14/2016) [-]
First nigger to relate the argument to Nazis lose.
User avatar
#132 - blackmageewizardt (09/12/2016) [-]
Also i see a better future with the lone survivor now having control of the Institute if he choses them.

He could put some moral and rational sense into labcoats that seemingless have stoped to consider if they should do something and instead just ask if they can.

The Synth tech could be used for so much good, imagine keeping every of their scientist alive! The imensive amount of technological progress they could achive would be world shattering and include immortality.
User avatar
#84 - caesarslegion (09/12/2016) [-]
And as a side note, synths aren't people.
User avatar
#103 - inverseiconoclasm (09/12/2016) [-]
They're just synthetic clones man. That's really all they are. They're not half the threat they could and probably should be.
User avatar
#88 - angelicdemon (09/12/2016) [-]
Any robotic entity that questions if it's alive and hasn't been programmed to do so has reached the singularity and should be considered alive.
#91 - heilhotwheels (09/12/2016) [-]
That's a pretty arbitrary and non-science based requirement for what living is

A living object is defined as one that was born, can die, and demonstrates the qualities of a living creature. Synths are by definition, non-living.
User avatar
#129 - angelicdemon (09/12/2016) [-]
"Does this unit have a soul"
There is not science to souls.
Souls are a concept made by a biological machine and we can't confirm that they exist but we all feel that we have one somehow.

Have you ever played the game SOMA? It pretty much covers the issue.
Here, have a video. Extra Credits  The Singularity  When Technology Becomes Sentient

A machine able to both understand being alive and also question if it's alive would destroy all we understand. It is impossible for me to comprehend I can't even put it into words. Your idea of life is based on our observations. Being alive is an abstract concept.
#178 - icantbelieveitsnot (09/12/2016) [-]
they would still not be considered living, they do not fit the characteristics of life, like being made of cells. being born is not actually a characteristic given to living things, as hellhotwheels stated. but I agree with theealtjthemedic, in that the definition of living is not really the important point.

The issue lays more in the idea of consciousness, as you said, if it UNDERSTANDS what being alive is. The issues with this definition, is that we do not understand it ourselves. We do not understand the processes of how the brain works in order to produce thoughts and feelings. We may create an intelligence that was able to learn, and reprogram, but we do not understand still whether it is able to truly create complex thought and emotion rather then mimic it. We would need to understand actually how these processes happen in our own brain. Interestingly, if it were to beat us to the punch, and understand exactly what makes our brain tic, one could argue then that we were taught what it means to be alive by a computer. At which point we or the computer would have to create a metric for a new definition.

Additionally, there are physical limitations to the memory storage, and complexities to computers that we will not likely be able to reach this level anytime in the near future. The idea of accelerated returns such as Moore's law will reach physical limitations and decelerate. Computers will have to make a literal and metaphorical quantum leap before they would be able to reach anywhere near the complexities of the human brain. We have barely scratched the surface of the brain, so the idea that we would be able to make something that would evolve and reprogram itself would require that it have a greater complexity, which we are simply nowhere near.
#164 - anon (09/12/2016) [-]
Nice avatar btw
User avatar
#199 - angelicdemon (09/14/2016) [-]
Ty
Killgore best girl.
#201 - anon (09/14/2016) [-]
Surrender!
User avatar
#100 - therealtjthemedic (09/12/2016) [-]
And being alive isn't a meaningful definition for whether something is intelligent and is ethically wrong to destroy.
Bacterium are alive. A hypothetical computer with the exact same consciousness as a human would not be alive, but destroying it would be the same as killing a human.
User avatar
#90 - caesarslegion (09/12/2016) [-]
There is no such thing as a robot that doesn't do things it's not programmed to do. A machine designed for killing won't one day decide to stop killing, synths are at their core programmed to behave in a human manner because in the Institute's eyes they were to replace all natural life in the wastes.

They should never have existed, they are not people, destroy the source of the synths and then just leave the ones already out there alone, since there is "no way" to tell other than killing them. Which I feel is just a bullshit excuse Bethesda used to blur the lines
#130 - angelicdemon (09/12/2016) [-]
I hear your argument and raise you ZAX.
fallout.wikia.com/wiki/ZAX

This was a robot built to simply aid in scientific research at "The Glow" or "West Tek Research Centre"

It plays chess and has been playing chess for a long time along with thinking about it's own existence instead of sitting idle because there was no research to do. It was a "Robot" built to research and it's doing things other than researching.
#179 - icantbelieveitsnot (09/12/2016) [-]
which is fictional
#200 - angelicdemon (09/14/2016) [-]
This discussion is about the fallout universe you nigger.
User avatar
#127 - leonhardt (09/12/2016) [-]
Jeez, calm down Maxson.
User avatar
#101 - therealtjthemedic (09/12/2016) [-]
And there's no such thing as a human who doesn't do what it's programmed to do, unless it's defective.
Humans are biological machines, with every instinct, fear, and thought a manifestation of the body's ultimate goal of continuously consuming resources and reproducing another copy of itself to no end.
#180 - icantbelieveitsnot (09/12/2016) [-]
That is an interesting though on the theory of determination, the base of the argument is that nothing and nobody has free will. Everything should follow exactly what it is programed to do. The physical world should all follow the laws. My issue with the idea of determinism is that The Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle tells us that it is impossible for us to use determinism to map out the future, as we cannot map out the present, which suggests that everything is not set in stone, and we may intact have free will.
#118 - masterboll (09/12/2016) [-]
#13 - Minutemen failed before after their General died and all the o…  [+] (6 replies) 09/11/2016 on Lancer 0
User avatar
#46 - supervillian (09/11/2016) [-]
That's the point of taking over as General, you actually unite to bring them all together.
#48 - anon (09/11/2016) [-]
That's only guaranteed to last as long as you live. As soon as you die, they'll squabble and break up all over again. The same thing happened when their last General died, and since siding with the Minutemen forces you to destroy the Institute because nobody thought that capturing it in-tact was a good idea, apparently , you won't have the access to the same methods of extending your life that they used on Kellogg, making it inevitable.
#50 - supervillian (09/12/2016) [-]
The minutemen failed because they were disorganized and didn't know what they were doing, only that they wanted to help people. It's sad, but it's true.
Then, LS walks in, teaches everyone how to manage shit, and now the Minutemen are better equipped with a small but obvious chain of command and checkpoints all around the commonwealth, including minutemen stationed at Diamond City.
Also, you can become immortal in fallout 4 you goddamn dickdingus.
fallout.wikia.com/wiki/The_Secret_of_Cabot_House
#60 - anon (09/12/2016) [-]
Also, regarding the potential for immortality, that assumes that Lorenzo doesn't eventually turn on you, or that he doesn't cut off your supply to the serum somehow i.e. he gets bored and decides to leave the Commonwealth, depriving you of the source of the serum
#52 - anon (09/12/2016) [-]
You do realize that a lot of the Minutemen don't even recognize you as the General, right? Not only are you the guy having to personally do all of their dirty work whenever a feral ghouls wanders within a country mile of a settlement, but in one particular mission for the Institute, not only do they treat you as though you're some kind of cheap backup, but they'll DEFY your order to stand down unless you pass a difficult speech check, and may even SHOOT at you. That amount of insubordination is a sign that there's something SERIOUSLY wrong with the Minutemen on a fundamental level.
#53 - anon (09/12/2016) [-]
*ghoul
#1 - >not allied with Brotherhood  [+] (65 replies) 09/11/2016 on Lancer +257
User avatar
#80 - angelicdemon (09/12/2016) [-]
I like the brotherhood as much as anyone else, they changed over time. Hell even the Nevada chapter was sensible and they were in lockdown for-fucking-ever. Maxon is just, too dedicated to the old ways, all the good you did for the capital wasteland acting as a peacemaker all the work you did uniting NCR and Brotherhood, letting them still claim all of the power armor. It just doesn't feel right being forced to commit genocide. That's what the enclave's leadership wanted with the mutants but we said no. We never took the easy route when it came to entire races. Why would I choose the easy path now. I believe in the brotherhood but I couldn't believe in this. I decided to work with the minutemen. I'll fight tooth and nail to make the wasteland better. A united people is far better than a single victorious group.
#173 - anon (09/12/2016) [-]
I've actually liked Fallout 4 for introducing more interesting and more 3 dimensional factions than previous installations have. Fallout 3 had the right idea, but I do think Fallout 4 really captured the point of having more than 2 dimensional dualistic dichotomy between good and evil, and instead all of the factions have good and bad views.

Wheres we had the Enclave, and especially the slavers of Legion, now we have the Institute who are mostly a bunch of isolated scientists who have their own vision of restoring the world back to what it once was, but the Institute does not consider that not everyone agrees Synths are the future salvation of Earth.

And the good guys?Well like you said, the Brotherhood may have its points but they are also imperfect in their views. Same applies to Minuteman who see outsiders as invaders, and the Railroad who are willing to take their idealism to harmful degrees (kind of like PETA).
User avatar
#194 - jakotad (09/12/2016) [-]
The minutemen don't see outsiders as invaders, they only see those that would harm the people as enemies. They don't particularly care if you are synth or human, as long as you are not fucking with people they won't blow out your candle.
User avatar
#83 - caesarslegion (09/12/2016) [-]
Everyone says that, but Lyons brotherhood pissed me off with all their 'good guy, save the wastes' crap. It pissed off so much of the brotherhood that a large chunk of them said fuck that and continued the way the brotherhood should be!

As for the NCR, that's bullshit too. It was either join the NCR and live, or die by whoever wins the battle at Hoover.
Maxon's brotherhood is the love child of both, it's a brotherhood dedicated to eradicating and confiscating dangerous technology while also helping the people of the wasteland so long as they'll help the brotherhood.
#87 - angelicdemon (09/12/2016) [-]
"The peace with NCR served to ease Veronica's worries about the Brotherhood's immediate future. Still, a distance had arisen between her and her fellow members that would never be bridged. She began secluding herself in crumbling libraries of the Old World, learning of promising technologies she knew the Brotherhood would never adopt" This isn't how I want it to go. They would kill an entire race and destroy the tech that could be used to secure their own food and water for the rest of time. They blew the institute up to sate their own fanaticism, oh no synths tickle my butthole forget that they have flourishing green plants and free access to clean water and clean housing. They completely ignored useful and incredibly powerful technologies. If you're going to rough it alone at least be smart about it, don't let your own fanaticism destroy your chance at a civilized wasteland without any fears for stuff like food and water. Fuck they even found ways to CURE mutants. Freedom is an important value, just as important as honor and duty to me. The other chapters that I believed in had some idea of that. I'm not one for arguing on the internet my ideas get a bit muddled but I still feel like Maxson has taken the idea of the brotherhood too far. I agree with you, the brotherhood originally was meant to be like this secure tech until people are ready. But I don't think that it's what the brotherhood should be. I value what the brotherhood was in all the games except fallout Tactics and 4.
#125 - rainbowblast (09/12/2016) [-]
I mean sure the Institute had some cool tech but they definitely were kidnapping people and replacing them with synths and they definitely kidnapped your child instead of just taking all 3 of you and explaining the situation.
#126 - angelicdemon (09/12/2016) [-]
The baby was the best possible option for the institute.

Listen, tech is tech. Research is research, just because the source is corrupt doesn't mean the information is. You can feel shame but shame means nothing when you are dying of thirst and your stomach is clenched tight. Look past your morality, your son did great things, if they had asked you and explained the situation you might've said no. They couldn't take that chance.

Listen, it was Kellog's fucked up fault that your SO was killed. The institute might be ass but it's advanced ass.
#157 - anon (09/12/2016) [-]
You know who else made some groundbreaking research by ignoring morals?

Nazi Scientists using 'undesirables' in human experimentation.
#198 - angelicdemon (09/14/2016) [-]
First nigger to relate the argument to Nazis lose.
User avatar
#132 - blackmageewizardt (09/12/2016) [-]
Also i see a better future with the lone survivor now having control of the Institute if he choses them.

He could put some moral and rational sense into labcoats that seemingless have stoped to consider if they should do something and instead just ask if they can.

The Synth tech could be used for so much good, imagine keeping every of their scientist alive! The imensive amount of technological progress they could achive would be world shattering and include immortality.
User avatar
#84 - caesarslegion (09/12/2016) [-]
And as a side note, synths aren't people.
User avatar
#103 - inverseiconoclasm (09/12/2016) [-]
They're just synthetic clones man. That's really all they are. They're not half the threat they could and probably should be.
User avatar
#88 - angelicdemon (09/12/2016) [-]
Any robotic entity that questions if it's alive and hasn't been programmed to do so has reached the singularity and should be considered alive.
#91 - heilhotwheels (09/12/2016) [-]
That's a pretty arbitrary and non-science based requirement for what living is

A living object is defined as one that was born, can die, and demonstrates the qualities of a living creature. Synths are by definition, non-living.
User avatar
#129 - angelicdemon (09/12/2016) [-]
"Does this unit have a soul"
There is not science to souls.
Souls are a concept made by a biological machine and we can't confirm that they exist but we all feel that we have one somehow.

Have you ever played the game SOMA? It pretty much covers the issue.
Here, have a video. Extra Credits  The Singularity  When Technology Becomes Sentient

A machine able to both understand being alive and also question if it's alive would destroy all we understand. It is impossible for me to comprehend I can't even put it into words. Your idea of life is based on our observations. Being alive is an abstract concept.
#178 - icantbelieveitsnot (09/12/2016) [-]
they would still not be considered living, they do not fit the characteristics of life, like being made of cells. being born is not actually a characteristic given to living things, as hellhotwheels stated. but I agree with theealtjthemedic, in that the definition of living is not really the important point.

The issue lays more in the idea of consciousness, as you said, if it UNDERSTANDS what being alive is. The issues with this definition, is that we do not understand it ourselves. We do not understand the processes of how the brain works in order to produce thoughts and feelings. We may create an intelligence that was able to learn, and reprogram, but we do not understand still whether it is able to truly create complex thought and emotion rather then mimic it. We would need to understand actually how these processes happen in our own brain. Interestingly, if it were to beat us to the punch, and understand exactly what makes our brain tic, one could argue then that we were taught what it means to be alive by a computer. At which point we or the computer would have to create a metric for a new definition.

Additionally, there are physical limitations to the memory storage, and complexities to computers that we will not likely be able to reach this level anytime in the near future. The idea of accelerated returns such as Moore's law will reach physical limitations and decelerate. Computers will have to make a literal and metaphorical quantum leap before they would be able to reach anywhere near the complexities of the human brain. We have barely scratched the surface of the brain, so the idea that we would be able to make something that would evolve and reprogram itself would require that it have a greater complexity, which we are simply nowhere near.
#164 - anon (09/12/2016) [-]
Nice avatar btw
User avatar
#199 - angelicdemon (09/14/2016) [-]
Ty
Killgore best girl.
#201 - anon (09/14/2016) [-]
Surrender!
User avatar
#100 - therealtjthemedic (09/12/2016) [-]
And being alive isn't a meaningful definition for whether something is intelligent and is ethically wrong to destroy.
Bacterium are alive. A hypothetical computer with the exact same consciousness as a human would not be alive, but destroying it would be the same as killing a human.
User avatar
#90 - caesarslegion (09/12/2016) [-]
There is no such thing as a robot that doesn't do things it's not programmed to do. A machine designed for killing won't one day decide to stop killing, synths are at their core programmed to behave in a human manner because in the Institute's eyes they were to replace all natural life in the wastes.

They should never have existed, they are not people, destroy the source of the synths and then just leave the ones already out there alone, since there is "no way" to tell other than killing them. Which I feel is just a bullshit excuse Bethesda used to blur the lines
#130 - angelicdemon (09/12/2016) [-]
I hear your argument and raise you ZAX.
fallout.wikia.com/wiki/ZAX

This was a robot built to simply aid in scientific research at "The Glow" or "West Tek Research Centre"

It plays chess and has been playing chess for a long time along with thinking about it's own existence instead of sitting idle because there was no research to do. It was a "Robot" built to research and it's doing things other than researching.
#179 - icantbelieveitsnot (09/12/2016) [-]
which is fictional
#200 - angelicdemon (09/14/2016) [-]
This discussion is about the fallout universe you nigger.
User avatar
#127 - leonhardt (09/12/2016) [-]
Jeez, calm down Maxson.
User avatar
#101 - therealtjthemedic (09/12/2016) [-]
And there's no such thing as a human who doesn't do what it's programmed to do, unless it's defective.
Humans are biological machines, with every instinct, fear, and thought a manifestation of the body's ultimate goal of continuously consuming resources and reproducing another copy of itself to no end.
#180 - icantbelieveitsnot (09/12/2016) [-]
That is an interesting though on the theory of determination, the base of the argument is that nothing and nobody has free will. Everything should follow exactly what it is programed to do. The physical world should all follow the laws. My issue with the idea of determinism is that The Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle tells us that it is impossible for us to use determinism to map out the future, as we cannot map out the present, which suggests that everything is not set in stone, and we may intact have free will.
#118 - masterboll (09/12/2016) [-]
#12 - anon (09/11/2016) [-]
Why would you? They're all assholes!

The Institute are a bunch of scary as shit motherfuckers that decided to play God and are now going all biblical on the synths that ate the fruit of knowledge and think that sentience is wasted on being a designated toilet cleaner.
Institute is seeding paranoia on the level of Warschaw circa 1942 by sending out copies of people into the wasteland, to kill and replace, to infiltrate settlements. Countless people died in their Sturmfront-like tactics.

Oh but the Railroad isn't much better. These Social Justice Warriors-on-steroids wannabe's are fucking nutjobs. Stupid synth lovers constantly put so many lives at risk of REAL people just to protect their precious sexbots.
These "ISIS meets Tumblr" dickwaffles are not just bad, they are fucking stupid. If you support them they actually end up nuking the Institute. Killing hundreds, if not thousands, of people and synths alike. Just to protect the few synths that escaped, which couldn't be more than a few dozen considering how utterly incompetent these fuckwits are.

Then the Brotherhood of Steel. Basicly a cross between fascists, the KKK and religious zealots. These kiddy diddlers are super-racists who feel strongly about them being the only one's that should have any of the nice tech. Not just weapons, but medical stuff that improves everyone's lives.
Their stance towards outsiders ranges from "i dont give a shit about you" to "you got to the count of my laser gattling spooling up" if you got a bit of tech they like. In Fallout 3 they were still the good guys who tried to make everyone's lives in the Wasteland better. In Fallout 4 they are back to their xenophobic tendencies that would even shock your typical Japanese fuck.
Just for using tech they like they get so fucking prissy and jelly they will happily nuke hundreds of people and tons of high-quality tech. Just out of spite. Their overall attitude is basicly /pol/ but replace "degenerate" with "abomination".

Truth is they're all fucking terrible, and the only faction that would come close to rolling that Good allignment in the game of D&D is the Minutemen. Who are truely only concerned about one thing, which is rebuilding the Wasteland for the common people. Making it safer and prospering. All the other factions only give a fuck about themselves and their own.

In the end that's actually part of the strength of the Fallout 4 story. The fact that you don't just have a super clear "Good vs Evil" choice to make but you weight your options as you choose a faction to support, knowing that none of them are some saintly reincarnation of Ghandi and Mother Terresa's love child. They all do bad shit and they all try to fucking justify it.
#74 - jasohazard (09/12/2016) [-]
>Facists
>Terrible
pick one
#43 - anon (09/11/2016) [-]
Even the Minutemen have a fatal flaw though: they're FAR too disorganized, and the majority of them barely even acknowledge the authority of their own leadership. This combined with hopeless idealism is what led to their annihilation at Quincey. A Commonwealth led by the Minutemen is doomed to failure unless they're reorganized into an organization that would barely be recognizable as their former selves.

I hate to say this but the best chance for the immediate future would be to support the Institute and try to influence their policies to help people, as they have a massive amount of resources and, even more importantly, have a defined chain of command that few if anyone questions and anyone who questions it and refuses to see reason is quickly disposed of, be it by laser shot to the head, Courser beatdown, or getting mauled by Harambe
#14 - brobafett (09/11/2016) [-]
I smell a disgusting synth
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#33 - congthea (09/11/2016) [-]
lost me at "BoS = USA"
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#13 - caesarslegion (09/11/2016) [-]
Minutemen failed before after their General died and all the other leaders fought over who took control afterwards.

They had their shot and failed, why even risk a second shot?
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#46 - supervillian (09/11/2016) [-]
That's the point of taking over as General, you actually unite to bring them all together.
#48 - anon (09/11/2016) [-]
That's only guaranteed to last as long as you live. As soon as you die, they'll squabble and break up all over again. The same thing happened when their last General died, and since siding with the Minutemen forces you to destroy the Institute because nobody thought that capturing it in-tact was a good idea, apparently , you won't have the access to the same methods of extending your life that they used on Kellogg, making it inevitable.
#50 - supervillian (09/12/2016) [-]
The minutemen failed because they were disorganized and didn't know what they were doing, only that they wanted to help people. It's sad, but it's true.
Then, LS walks in, teaches everyone how to manage shit, and now the Minutemen are better equipped with a small but obvious chain of command and checkpoints all around the commonwealth, including minutemen stationed at Diamond City.
Also, you can become immortal in fallout 4 you goddamn dickdingus.
fallout.wikia.com/wiki/The_Secret_of_Cabot_House
#60 - anon (09/12/2016) [-]
Also, regarding the potential for immortality, that assumes that Lorenzo doesn't eventually turn on you, or that he doesn't cut off your supply to the serum somehow i.e. he gets bored and decides to leave the Commonwealth, depriving you of the source of the serum
#52 - anon (09/12/2016) [-]
You do realize that a lot of the Minutemen don't even recognize you as the General, right? Not only are you the guy having to personally do all of their dirty work whenever a feral ghouls wanders within a country mile of a settlement, but in one particular mission for the Institute, not only do they treat you as though you're some kind of cheap backup, but they'll DEFY your order to stand down unless you pass a difficult speech check, and may even SHOOT at you. That amount of insubordination is a sign that there's something SERIOUSLY wrong with the Minutemen on a fundamental level.
#53 - anon (09/12/2016) [-]
*ghoul
#6 - deaddropping (09/11/2016) [-]
There is only one group fit to wear power armor, and it is not the Brotherhood.
#158 - klabautermann (09/12/2016) [-]
They aren't even that different though. BoS at the moment are like the thunder warriors from old terra fighting the techno barbarians of the wasteland. They both use ancient technology and most of all power armor. Both have multiple factions scattered across the old settlements of humanity. Both purge heretics and kill mutants. The institute synths are like the men of iron, a threat to humanity's existance. BoS is basically the imperium -emprah & chaos
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#196 - existance (09/13/2016) [-]
Existence*
#162 - anon (09/12/2016) [-]
Thunder Warriors were also generically engineered super humans, Teh Emprah made them as a sort of prototype to the Astartes.
Main flaw is that Thunder Warriors are pretty much in a constant berserkers state and were likely to turn on the own population when bored, Teh Emprah made them with a biological failsafe so they'd die off by the end of the Unification Wars to be replaced by the first Astartes.
That didn't work though so Teh Emprah made them storm the last technobarbarian fortress by land and all the Thunder Warriors were killed but one in that assault,
Who then fled before Teh Emprah would personally choke him to death.

Tl;dr: Thunder Warriors and BoS are nothing alike in not a single way.
If anything Thunder Warriors would be Power-armoured Super Mutants.
#190 - anon (09/12/2016) [-]
FJ herd thumbing down because they read something they don't like/agree or know shit about.
So here is your damn source, god knows most of you lot are to stupid to use Google yourselves.
warhammer40k.wikia.com/wiki/Thunder_Warriors
Scroll down to "The Culling" before you fuck up reading for longer than a minute aswell.

Yes i mad, because actual information gets downthumbed because the FJ hugbox starts rivalling Tumblr
#82 - commanderboreale (09/12/2016) [-]
I wonder who?
#104 - inverseiconoclasm (09/12/2016) [-]
I'd pay to watch them fight.
#141 - anon (09/12/2016) [-]
that Bos art is sexy.
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#106 - commanderboreale (09/12/2016) [-]
You're comparing Genetically Engineered, 8 foot tall supersoldiers who can live for hundreds if not thousands of years with irradiated people? Plus 40k Armor is on a whole 'nother level.
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#185 - ognuggetry (09/12/2016) [-]
hes right you know. compare the t-60 to the x-1 that's soo cool. Well the X-1 is a badass upgrade now think of Warhammer space marine power armor...thats like Z-1000 version.
#131 - zetsuboukamina (09/12/2016) [-]
One space marine vs Frank Horrigab
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#186 - ognuggetry (09/12/2016) [-]
or we take Frank Horrigan and make him a space marine
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#187 - zetsuboukamina (09/12/2016) [-]
Loyalty: 6000000%
#107 - inverseiconoclasm (09/12/2016) [-]
Yeah, so?
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#115 - commanderboreale (09/12/2016) [-]
You'd pay to see the BoS get completely shitstormed by a hail of bolter fire in the EMPRAH's name?
#117 - inverseiconoclasm (09/12/2016) [-]
Would you not?
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#119 - commanderboreale (09/12/2016) [-]
I'd relish it bruva, It's high time for the Emprah to Reclaim the wastelands of Earth
#3 - tylerkade (09/11/2016) [-]
An unwise choice.
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#2 - guardianatreyu (09/11/2016) [-]
Could be another playthrough. You get bored being purely the good guy all the time.
#171 - anon (09/12/2016) [-]
>brotherhood and good guys being described as the same thing

Sure, that's about as true as most people actually wanting to save settlements more than once per location.

The answer is no.
#29 - anon (09/11/2016) [-]
Th brotherhood arent the good guys fallout 4 did a good job of keeping the good and the bad a little more grey than a lot of games
#202 - venomousvalentine (09/17/2016) [-]
In the end, thats why I never finished the game.
I couldn't figure out whos ideals I valued the most.
#145 - mrfinnt (09/12/2016) [-]
that's what a synth would say
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#174 - lesolan (09/12/2016) [-]
Listen here you little shit stained mongoloid. Don't you fucking ever compare the godliness that is Fallout 1 with the dirt loving plebiscite that is Bethesda's unfinished Satan spawn of Fallout 4.

Joking aside, while I still like Fallout 4, it really flopped hard on a lot of promised content, and that leaves a bitter aftertaste in my mouth.
#161 - aguycalledlee (09/12/2016) [-]
>Fallout 1 image
>Fallout 4 reference
#32 - Way to go full on cringe.  [+] (2 replies) 09/08/2016 on Pump-a-rum comics -2
#71 - amuter (09/09/2016) [-]
I suppose this is how you're supposed to react whenever you see hotties on the internet.
#36 - karenoniks (09/08/2016) [-]
Now that I reread my own comment it really does sound like something a creepy old man would say.
No point in deleting it now, I guess.
#58 - What's that mean? Lol  [+] (3 replies) 09/07/2016 on Disgust 0
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#59 - fapcat (09/07/2016) [-]
it's a tumblr post of a guy ordering pizza online and he decides to have only beef on the left side and nothing else
#60 - lollypopalopicus (09/07/2016) [-]
Also, I think they chose Symmettra because she is Indian, and Hindus don't eat beef.
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#64 - toastiewaffles (09/07/2016) [-]
or because she like symmetry?
#55 - I have no idea what the joke is.  [+] (6 replies) 09/07/2016 on Disgust 0
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#56 - fapcat (09/07/2016) [-]
none pizza with left meat
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#58 - caesarslegion (09/07/2016) [-]
What's that mean? Lol
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#59 - fapcat (09/07/2016) [-]
it's a tumblr post of a guy ordering pizza online and he decides to have only beef on the left side and nothing else
#60 - lollypopalopicus (09/07/2016) [-]
Also, I think they chose Symmettra because she is Indian, and Hindus don't eat beef.
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#64 - toastiewaffles (09/07/2016) [-]
or because she like symmetry?
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#57 - fapcat (09/07/2016) [-]
left beef**