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|#173 - Obama is the only sane choice now seeing as there is no way th… [+] (77 new replies)||03/19/2012 on Well ain't that a paper cut...||-1|
#193 - anonymous poster (03/19/2012) [-]
I agree with you whole heartily sir!
#207 - anonymous poster (03/19/2012) [-]
You know the job market crashed when Bush was on top and Obama got it back on track. He tried to fix your broke ass medical system and he got the soldiers back from Iraq. I'd wager he's done a whole lot of good things, and more than people actually give him credit for.
#274 - jedic (03/19/2012) [-]
Now you say Obama put the job market back on track, I'd like to ask for sauce please.
On a side note, I think we need to start worrying more about our Congress members then our President. Cause, as basic schooling will tell you, Legislative makes the laws while Executive enforces.
#288 - Triskiller (03/19/2012) [-]
I had a good source on it yesterday, but I lost it. If I find it again, I'll be sure to send it your way. It's this whole graph with job creation, etc. from the Bush Kony, the Ugandan heroistration to where we are now. It's pretty good to see America getting back on track.
Did I mention he saved General Motors? I don't think I did. Well, he saved them. :P
#315 - jedic (03/19/2012) [-]
#284 - IamEllis (03/19/2012) [-]
it fucks everyone over. My sister once had a friend who lived in canada. Her mother felt a lump on her breast so she made an appointment. it would take nearly 6 months just to get a screening of it due to their medical system so they moved down here where she got in right away and guess what? It was indeed cancer and doctor said if she had waited any longer, she wouldnt have made it. Now we practically have the same system as them, also people such as ileagle immigrants get a free ride
#294 - Triskiller (03/19/2012) [-]
That isn't really the fault of the medical system, is it? I don't know about Canada, but I know a lot of people in the US that benefit greatly from the new medical system. Private companies were trying to fuck people over and this new medical system is going to try and prevent that. I've been hearing nothing but good things about it in the past year or so.
#319 - Triskiller (03/19/2012) [-]
Well, I'm sorry to hear that. But there are just as many conditions in the world as there were when this medical system wasn't there. That amount didn't just skyrocket when the system was changed, did it? People get treated for their conditions, and that's a bad thing? How selfish is that? Yes it needs some time to get on track, but it's for the better.
#326 - IamEllis (03/19/2012) [-]
But the middle class has to pay for everything for everyone no matter what it is. we grow closer and closer to becoming a part of the poor population everyday. I agree we do need to help the less fortunate at times but again, people are sucking off it. there are more people in the cart than there are pulling
#333 - Triskiller (03/19/2012) [-]
Well he can't get the taxes to be raised on the rich people yet because the Republicans are riding his ass about it. If he could get that done the poor would be sustained by those taxes. You as middle Americans aren't paying for the poor, you are paying for your own safety net.
#350 - IamEllis (03/19/2012) [-]
Many republicans want the taxes to be slightly raised on the rich in order to relieve pressure on the middle class. Middle class was fine until obama came in. The say we are paying for our own saftey net but that is only because everyday, more and more people are considered lower class or poor. soo enough there will not be a middle class left
#355 - Triskiller (03/19/2012) [-]
Then why was Bill O'Reilly flipping his shit over raised taxes for the rich? He didn't want to hear any of Obama's plan to raise taxes for the rich to a whopping thirty-something percent (which is relatively small if you make over a million dollars a year), seems to me like you're getting your parties mixed up.
#924 - IamEllis (03/21/2012) [-]
You are the one that is misinformed. That pipeline deal I mentioned earlier would have also created thousands of jobs and he still declined it. Why the hell do you think when more than half the kids that graduate college have no where else to go but back to live with their parents? there is nothing for us. It is because of him a majority of the younger generation has slim chances at success.
#928 - Triskiller (03/21/2012) [-]
You should really look into it more, because that is just blatantly not true (Not talking about the pipeline deal, haven't heard anything about that.)
However hard you try to convince yourself he created more jobs than most former presidents. He saved asses of companies left and right (which would've dragged the economy even further down had they gone bankrupt), he made a lot of tough decisions to create a better and more stable America.
#959 - IamEllis (03/24/2012) [-]
the last one works fine and yes he is trying his best to fix the economy but it is evident that his best is not enough. http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-5744/national-debt-has-increased-more-under-obama-than-under-bush/
blindly agreeing with one's decision without any other information other than your thoughts about how smart he is. oh interesting. Okay. the real reason why he did it is for himself. He knows he will have a lot of competition during the presidential election so he is attempting to appeal to as many people as possible because he wants to be seen as a "green presodent" but shutting out all of our best sources of oil even before we have even have green technology is the worst fucking idea ever.
no, he promised to have them out in his first year.
It's also easy to say that obama is a good president when you are on the other side of the world. I've said it before and I'll say it again. Both my parents have very good jobs yet my family and I are still struggling to get by because he is giving all out money to a majoirty of people who dont need it. At this rate. I would be better off claiming I'm sick and unable to find work so the government can just hand me money. It would make a shit load more than my family does now, and that is a majoirty of who supports Obama. the people in the cart. not my parents and I who are pulling it
#955 - IamEllis (03/23/2012) [-]
"You should really look into it more". those were your exact words and you are saying I have a straw-man argument? hypocritical much? because you are clearly too lazy, this is for you
Again, its not hard to comprehend. it doesnt matter what either of us think about oil. the fact is that large portions of the world run on it and Obama is screwing us over which once again proves you are a hypocrite. Now I bring facts to the table and you are saying my argument is invalid simply because you dont care. just because you dont care that my favorite color is blue dosent make it any less true.
I know to remove troops, it takes large amounts of time but he didnt start the process of doing so 3 years till after he said he would. he is a very powerful speaker but his words are full of holes.
#957 - Triskiller (03/23/2012) [-]
The last link doesn't work and the other one is.. well it's full of shit. If you look through the treasury website, during the bush Kony, the Ugandan heroistration the national debt fell from 5 trillion to 10, so that's actually more than Obama already. Obama already had a tough break by starting out with such a shit economy and he has tried his best picking up the pieces. Again, this isn't a straw-man argument, supported by a sensationalist report. Just try and research something before you try and blame someone for something.
But your favorite color is an opinion, and that I can't refute. This however, has nothing to with factual evidence. It's pure speculation from both of our ends that it's either good or bad because neither of us knows the full story. Neither of us knows all the good and the bad things about the oil in Canada and the situation in the middle-east and the one that does know the most about the whole situation made this decision. I am going to trust him on that, just saying.
Did he specify when he would remove the troops? As I recall he only said he would get them out of there before the end of his term. He kept his promise. Nothing bad about that.
#953 - IamEllis (03/23/2012) [-]
What the fuck do you mean I have no proof? Just look into and you will see what it is i'm telling you! The middleclass is dying because of him. It isnt going to good causes because more than half of it goes to medical care for ileagle immigrants and to fat assed people who have no desire to work and just want to leech off the system. "disepersing" and "sprading" the wealth isnt capitlaism, its socialism. And states ARE allowed to make their own laws and regulations. States do have the ability to create a higher emploment rate and morem job oppurtunities.
once again you fail to see your single oppinion on oil doesnt mean shit. I dont like oil either but that doesnt prove you are right. Oil is a big factor in everything because the rest of the world cares about.
that whole debt thing than every other president combined is fact. look it up, I shit you not.
I realize our defence is our biggest budget but that dosent change the fact that he has racked up the most debt ever with evrything else. Obama also promised to get the troops out of iraq, right when he got into office but it took 3nyears before he even consiered doing it
#954 - Triskiller (03/23/2012) [-]
That's a straw-man argument if I have ever seen one. "Want proof? Look it up!" Yeah, great. Dispersing wealth is a part of socialism, yes. But socialism isn't a bad thing. It can coexist with the free market and with capitalism. The whole attitude against sharing wealth isn't good for America, and certainly not for your economy. Because you need the lower class to spend to help the middle and upper class get a nice paycheck.
Your opinion on oil doesn't mean shit either.
Another straw-man. I you bring the facts the table, I don't have to look it up. I gave you facts and you try and refute them every step of the way with nothing but speculation and sensationalist reports.
You can't just up and take the troops out of Iraq, that shit takes time. At least he did it. He promised something and he did it.
#951 - IamEllis (03/22/2012) [-]
I'm not playing off the job argument like it doesn't matter. If I'm not mistaken you played of both the oil and the amount of tax/spending pattern off like it was nothing. And you dont get it. The decisions that Obama is making is causing the number of jobs to go down so the individual states are attempting to increase them as much as they can.
The oil would cost less money because not only would we not have to ship it half way across the world but also a majority of it would come from U.S. property (Alaska). I still also fail to see why he would even care about the cost seeing as how I stated earlier, he has wracked up more debt than all previous presidents combined... that is a rather worrying amount. People also fail to understand that we have technology now in days to prevent any ecological disasters. And if they are not stupid enough why do they continue to build them and if not now, when? 10, 20 years from now? Just because they are on good terms with your country doesnt mean it will stop them from blowing the rest of the world to shit
#952 - Triskiller (03/23/2012) [-]
Ok, well first thing's first. I did not play off that tax/spending pattern jibba jabba, I just did not pay much heed to it because you had no proof whatsoever of your claims. Plus: Obama's spending pattern might be really high, it's not like the money isn't going to good causes. Again, he saved multiple companies from the brink of death and got the economy mostly back on track. Jobs are on the rise and it does have to do with Obama's decisions, not with states all of the sudden going: "You know what we should do? Actually fix stuff." because that's not how it works.
I played off the oil, because I do not, and will not care about the oil. Oil sucks either way, either you get pollution or you get friction between countries.
"more debt than all previous presidents combined", well that's just a really big lie.
And for the record I found a little something for you to read about that spending:
"The biggest expense of the government by far is the department of defense. The costs of the multiple wars in Iraq and Afghanistan have been huge. Now let me mention a little detail that most of you don't know. The Bush Kony, the Ugandan heroistration was not including the costs of those wars in their budget! They would propose the funding as "emergency" or "supplemental" funding bills so that they could avoid including them in the official budget to make it look better. Obama is changing that to get rid of the phony accounting tricks and bring accountability to the budget. Yes, it makes the budget look much worse right off the bat because we're including that in the numbers now, but the plan is to reduce the U.S. presence in Iraq to cut some of that out of control spending. That will reduce the budget expenditures."
I'm kindof done talking about this, you know? It's been a fun little conversation, but I guess we just have our differences. I just do not agree with the statement that Obama is the worst thing ever, and I hope I have made clear why.
#949 - IamEllis (03/22/2012) [-]
The reason why the charts say jobs are going up is due to mostly the individual state governments, not obama. Just because they slap "obama Kony, the Ugandan heroistration" on there doesnt mean he had anything to do with it, it is just in the same period of time that he is in office. It also dosent matter whether or you care or not about oil. the majority of the world revolves around it. Its not about YOU the fact is that he is jepordizing U..S. citizen lives. the people he is meant to protect. America isnt their only enemy either. chances are your country is also at risk. The deal also would have been a great step to get out economey back on track and create THOUSANDS of jobs but he refused to.
#950 - Triskiller (03/22/2012) [-]
See that whole fighting spirit is what got you in problems in the first place. And now don't try and play off the job argument like it doesn't matter, because you kept saying it was going worse and now that you know it's better Obama has fuck all to do with it. Hypocritical.
Oil is a problem and it will always be a problem, but if Obama thought that it would cost more money and cause more pollution to start drilling in Canada, then I guess he did so with a lot of thought behind it. He is the president after all. It's very easy for someone like us to say: "Well he should've done that because now everything is going to hell!" but the fact of the matter is, things aren't as clear-cut as that. My country is on very good terms with the middle east, and the Arab Spring took care of most of the problems the western civilization has with the middle east. The only thing that's still a minor threat is Ahmedinejad. Even he isn't stupid enough to fire nuclear weapons in such times as this.
#941 - IamEllis (03/21/2012) [-]
and the pipeline thing I mentioned earlier
The only real source of income from the Middle East is oil. We are the largest consumers of oil and buy I'd say about 90% of our oil from the ME. recently there was a proposed oil deal. We were offered the chance to have pipelines from Canada come down to the U.S. but Obama refused. Because of him we are still throwing all of our money to countries like Iran who use it to build nuclear wepons in hopes of one day destroying us along with many other coutnries. Obama is buying our own annihilation. if we stop buying oil from them, they will have noithing to build their nuclear arms with. on top of that, it could have cut gas prices here down around 25% or something incredible like that. He has also wracked up more debt than all of the other previous presodents combined...thats like what? 43? 44?
#945 - Triskiller (03/22/2012) [-]
You do realize that our graphs don't correlate? You know why? Because you have a graph of job seekers per job opening, that means that the higher amount, the worse the job market. It's going down, so that's a good thing. See that spike at the end of 2008? Yeah, that's the end of Bush' term. See that graph going down steadily after that spike? Yeah, that's Obama doing his thing.
I don't really care about oil anymore, because it's a bad thing either way.
Yeah, try harder next time.
#936 - IamEllis (03/21/2012) [-]
The job market isnt an easy place but Obama isnt making it any better. I'm telling you, there is a massive shortage of jobs and obama isnt doing shit to make it better. The kids are also scared shitless because they know that even if for some miraculous reason they do mange to get a job, they will just be fucked over like their parents because of Obama. He likes to "spread the wealth" that we bust our asses for. thats not what capitalism is about
#934 - IamEllis (03/21/2012) [-]
It wont let me reply to your comment so im sending a reply on this one.
Once again, stop acting as if you know me because you dont know shit about me. I never watch fox new because I know they are very bias. Also Obama hasnt done anything specifically to make jobs rise. He has destroyed far more opportunities for employment than he has created. Besides, the job market always has gone through short periods of change. within the next few months to the next year i is drastically going to fall again. If you evr come to america, just ask any college graduate how how scared shitless they are because of the situation we are in.
As for Romney, no president or cianidate will ever be perfect but Obama is terrible and for now at least we could use romney. He wants to focus on the the middlclass because he understands we are struggling. Obama is destroying any "equal oppurtunities by giving it all the to poor
#935 - Triskiller (03/21/2012) [-]
This isn't a short period of change, it hasn't been. For the past few years the jobs have been on the rise because Obama was saving companies left and right, helping to stabilize the economy as much as he could. It's not because of Obama that those students are scared shitless to go into the job market, it's because they should be. The job market isn't an easy place, not even when your country has one of the lowest unemployment rate in the world (believe me, I'd know), the fact of the matter is, because of Obama they stand a bigger chance of actually getting a job, even in this fucked up day and age.
#930 - IamEllis (03/21/2012) [-]
we are not any better or more stable than we were 4 years ago! what are you talking about? our economy kept has hardly improved. And no shit he saved the asses of those companies because that will help in the next election. The constitution say we the people, not we the corporations. The people here have no voice. it is all the major businesses so no shit he tried to bail out the companies with OUR money. I am telling you the job market is getting worse. young adults everywhere are going nowhere in life because there is noithing for them after colllge. it is one of our nations biggest concerns
#931 - Triskiller (03/21/2012) [-]
Go look at real sources and not just Fox news before you come back and try and argue with me, because you're just regurgitating their lies. Check out any factual source and you will find that the country is indeed getting back on track slowly but steadily. The job market is stabilizing.
PS: Wasn't it your precious Romney that said: "Corporations are people too!" Yeah, no. They aren't and Obama knows it and he is making sure that there will be equal opportunities. Take off those tinted shades and try and see it how it really is.
#237 - Triskiller (03/19/2012) [-]
He isn't Superman. Politics is about making and breaking promises, it's not like Ron Paul or Romney can do most of the things they promised, because most everyone in congress would be fighting them every step of the way, just like they did with Obama. He has been a good president these past four years, even I know it and I don't even live there.
#254 - IamEllis (03/19/2012) [-]
I relaize he is only one man. I never said I see presidents as a god or superhero but the job of a president is to make sure you're people are safe, free, and somewhat happy. you have to live here to realize what it is like to be a middle class citizen. he has taken so much from the us to give to the poor that many of us are poor ourselfs now. his goal was to take a hand full of money and sprinkle it around and it turned into one giant shit fit. The majority of ppl who do support him only do so because they are sucking off the system. While me, my firends, and my family work out asses off, they get most of what I earned. note that these arent disabled war veterans or elderly people but fine, healthy, lazy, fat assed people that are getting a free ride. Hoover was a better president than this guy and he literaly didnt do shit all 4 years
#268 - Triskiller (03/19/2012) [-]
I live in Holland and I know how the system he is trying to implement works, 'cause it's been working for us (with an even more extreme approach) for many years. It's fantastic. People need to realize that to create equal opportunities (note: Opportunities. It's not like I want all the money to be shared by everyone.) you need to share a bit of the wealth and health you have to benefit others. He's not trying to screw over the middle American, but he's trying to help the lower one.
Well, I suppose this isn't helping much, because telling someone they're going to have to hand in a part of their paycheck (even if it's a very small part) doesn't go over well, no matter how you put it.
I work a whole lot too, to pay my bills, and I probably have to hand over a lot more to the Government in taxes, but that's fine by me. Because I know that when I get disabled or get really ill, my bills are paid by the same hardworking people I used to be part of.
#291 - IamEllis (03/19/2012) [-]
He may not be trying but he certainly is screwing over the middle american. The majority of the poor here arent poor at all. they are perfectly healty human beings who refuse to work so the govenment gives them our money. sure their are people who actually do need a bit of aid like I said, many of them are just low lifes. you have no idea.
It may work for you in Holland but the the point of coming to america is freedom. You reap what you sow. You work hard and you will go far. Obama has made that impoible. the american dream is dead. the more you make, the more they take.
#308 - Triskiller (03/19/2012) [-]
No, that's your perception on the matter. We have the same naysayers in our country that pop up every once in a while, but the fact of the matter is that a lot of people that get the aid really need it.
You may preach freedom, but there ain't freedom for everyone in America. I'm going to take a wild guess and say that I am more free to do as I please than you are. Obama has been trying to make it possible for people to live a good life without having to be born rich or get there by sheer luck. Money is so unequally divided over there that the poor stay poor and the rich stay rich. And the middle people, well, they either get rich, or get poor trying. And it's too bad that doesn't seem to be changing anytime soon.
#318 - IamEllis (03/19/2012) [-]
the rich are fine and the poor have a saftey net. Like I said they suck off of the middle class. its like the middle class is a duying breed. if we keep doing what obama is doing, there is only going to be a massive poor population and a tiny tiny tiny rich one. You dont have to like my opinion, as you are entitled to your own but I am just not a fan of obama
#329 - Triskiller (03/19/2012) [-]
Well, I respect your opinion. I don't like it. But I respect it.
I also respectfully disagree with it.
Obama is trying to make it so that there will be more middle class people and less rich and less poor people. That's what he's doing, and that's what should be done.
#523 - IamEllis (03/20/2012) [-]
He is failing at making more middle class. that is what I have been saying. The fact that he is also trying to destory the rich proves he is also a bad president. if its money you worked for, why he should he have the right to tell you how much you can and cant have? I understand making less poor but he is going about it wrong. I respect your oppinion as well but Obama just pisses me off to no extent
#908 - Triskiller (03/20/2012) [-]
Because you live in his country and the country deserves a share of your money to keep running. That's how the world works. You are a part of a system and you have to share a part of what you earn to keep that system running. I refuse to believe that what you are saying is true because I live I Europe and all the people in all the countries in Europe have to pay way more taxes than you do, and they do just fine.
You just have to adjust your spending pattern, don't buy that new tv or that new car, because at this point you can't afford it. That has nothing to do with Obama or his presidency and everything with people being selfish pricks.
#919 - IamEllis (03/20/2012) [-]
I never said that you had to believe anything. I'm not forcing you to beileve anything. I'm simply stating my oppinions on obama. I know that every country in the world must pay some sort of tax but the amount he is putting on us is ridiculous. On top of that he takes extra amounts out our paychecks. My dad works a lot of details just so that he can get by. my younger siblings are lucky if they see him twice a week and even then they take about 3/4 of all the extra money he is so despratley trying to earn. My spending pattern is fine. you dont know shit about me. I dont want a new car or a new tv. I am perfectly content with what I have. All I want is the money that I work so hard for. I'm not busting my ass through years of school and work for random bum on the street who will just blow the money on drugs anyways. the poor do deserve help but damn, there is a limit. there is a balance to everything
#225 - IamEllis (03/19/2012) [-]
Its just some of the shit he pulls like the pipeline deal. The only real source of income from the Middle East is oil. We are the largest consumers of oil and buy I'd say about 90% of our oil from the ME. recently there was a proposed oil deal. We were offered the chance to have pipelines from Canada come down to the U.S. but Obama refused. Because of him we are still throwing all of our money to countries like Iran who use it to build nuclear wepons in hopes of one day destroying us along with many other coutnries. Obama is buying our own annihilation. we we stop buying oil from them, they will have noithing to build their nuclear arms with. on top of that, it could have cut gas prices here down around 25% or something incredible like that. He has also wracked up more debt than all of the other previous presodents combined...thats like what? 43? 44?
#262 - rangerxaetos (03/19/2012) [-]
Canadian oil isn't enough to sustain us. The Middle East sits on top of the largest amount of oil in the world, of course we would buy it from them. Anyone in his position would know. We can't just stop buying our lifeblood fuel because they might use it for a weapon (assuming they have the technology to do so, seeing as how they don't even have an air force of any kind) or possibly improve their own lives. Is that really such a bad thing? We're already heading down, Obama isn't making it worse. He's trying to make it better. The problem is America is too shortsighted to see that we aren't helping others, we're dooming ourselves by not taking action within our own borders. Fix problems on the home front first, then move on to the international level. like debt. That debt level isn't his fault, it's the result of U.S. spending on the international scale over past years, and the inability of Congress to say "No more spending" when it's in their power to do so. We don't need a new president, we need more intelligent people in our country who see the real issue.
#296 - IamEllis (03/19/2012) [-]
the reason why the plan was put into place was so that we could be more self sufcient. much of the oil would also comefrom our alaskan grounds which is actually very plentiful. I know we couldnt stop buying from the ME completley, but atleast we Iran. obama may be trying, but he is failing.
#281 - dracinis (03/19/2012) [-]
actually, canada has the most oil in the world by far, it's just stuck in the sands. the middle easts oil is just in pools underground and is extremely easy to take. in canada, the oil takes tons of resources and produces a lot of pollution to get, but there's a shit ton of it
#321 - rangerxaetos (03/19/2012) [-]
I have taken Chemistry classes and researched these things. In reply to both of you, I would like to point out the the Middle East sits on about 62% of the planets oil supply, with a roughly 2-4% being in North America. The rest is scattered, the second largest quantity is near Venezuela, being at about 10% if I remember correctly.
#257 - dracinis (03/19/2012) [-]
actually, the reason that he refused the deal is because at the moment canada is not taking much oil from the tar sands in alberta. the reason is because if he agreed to the deal they would start extracting oil from the sands. the way they extract it is so bad that it takes 4 barrels of water to get 1 barrel of oil and it produces over 5 times as much co2 pollution as any other way of getting oil.
#272 - IamEllis (03/19/2012) [-]
and so you would rather have everyone you know and love be obliterated in a nuclear war. all i can say is that I hope you enjoy the fallout games. also a majority of the oil was actually going to come from alaskan grounds as well which is another reason why it would be cheap
#285 - dracinis (03/19/2012) [-]
you act as if the world is really stupid enough to start a fucking nuclear war that would destroy everything. the leaders of each country aren't really that stupid, of course they have the weapons, but if they use them they'll just end up destroying the world and usually people don't want that
#305 - IamEllis (03/19/2012) [-]
Really now? Yeah. A radical group of terroists are just building Nuclear wepons with death threats to america just for shits and giggles. Who gives a shit what people want? That has nothing to do with it. If Obama along with all the other european really asked the iranian leader to stop he would? no. he hates them nearly as much as he hates us. He would fire them at us then them. they arent building wepons as a present of good faith
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