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#75 - brettd
Reply +24
(07/18/2013) [-]
Literally went from being my least favorite character to my favorite character in a single page.
#169 to #75 - organicglory
Reply +2
(07/18/2013) [-]
i just feeled

hard
#88 to #75 - Sethorein ONLINE
Reply 0
(07/18/2013) [-]
Yay black and white morality...

Snape can't be a good guy who does bad things... he has to be a good guy that ALWAYS did good things...
#90 to #88 - brettd
Reply 0
(07/18/2013) [-]
What are you trying to say here? are you being sarcastic?
#93 to #90 - Sethorein ONLINE
Reply 0
(07/18/2013) [-]
... I was merely commenting on the fact that what made you love him made me dislike him as he went from a well done tragic hero to a paradigm of the human race...
#95 to #93 - brettd
Reply +6
(07/18/2013) [-]
Dude, Snape didn't become a tragic hero until the very end. He started out as the dick from slytherin who betrayed dumbledore and bullied harry, but ended up being what he was. Snape teetered on the line between good and bad his entire life. He is the opposite of black and white morality.
#99 to #95 - Sethorein ONLINE
Reply 0
(07/18/2013) [-]
Clearly don't understand what a tragic hero is...

Tragic hero in the barest terms is a powerful individual of high class. An esteemed professor at hogwarts and close friend of dumbledore is pretty high class, no? This Hero will always intend to do good, but have a fatal flaw that prevents things from turning out as he intended. Admittedly the worst flaw you can really find in Snape was that he trusted Voldemort.

We knew before the last book (thanks to the half blood prince) that he had been in love with Lily and that he was betrayed. Now here's where it's perfect. This is like Macbeth. Hero meant well but has become as bad as a person can be! Now here's the thing, a tragic hero is not supposed to find redemption. Their death should result in change, but it should not involve invalidating all of their previous actions and making them a saint.

Tell me one bad thing Snape did that was not invalidated by the ******** of the final book. Now if he had sacrificed his life for Malfoy and insodoing somehow assisted in the destruction of Voldemort, while he would not have been a saint, he would have at least shown that he was guilty over his betrayal of Dumbledore.

Black and White morality. When good guys are good and bad guys are bad. Tell me one guy who legitimately skirted the line and didn't just appear to be because we didn't know enough facts surrounding the nature of his actions.
#104 to #99 - brettd
Reply +1
(07/18/2013) [-]
Tragic Hero- "a literary character who makes an error of judgement that, combined with fate and external forces, results in a tragedy."

Describes Snape perfectly, doesn't it? And of course tragic heroes are supposed to find redemption, that's what makes them heroes.

Snape's whole life was a tragedy. His worst enemy marries the love of his life, he goes over to Voldemort, and in doing so, brings about her death.

It was his guilt over Lily's death that make him change sides. In all honesty, he may actually have been a ****** person, but he wasn't about to continue helping him after he murdered her.

And Snape's death brought about change. It was instrumental to Harry's victory.
#105 to #104 - Sethorein ONLINE
Reply 0
(07/18/2013) [-]
You've yet to tell me a bad thing he has done.
#107 to #105 - brettd
Reply 0
(07/18/2013) [-]
ARE YOU EVEN READING MY COMMENTS? HE WENT OVER TO VOLDEMORT. HE WORKED FOR HIM FOR ALMOST A DECADE. HE STOLE VITAL INFORMATION AND GAVE IT TO HIM WITHOUT HESITATION. HE BEGGED HIS MASTER TO KILL JAMES AND HARRY, TWO INNOCENT PEOPLE, IN EXCHANGE FOR LILY'S SURVIVAL. HE SPENT SEVENTEEN YEARS BULLYING INNOCENT STUDENTS. DOES THAT QUALIFY AS BAD???
#110 to #107 - Sethorein ONLINE
Reply 0
(07/18/2013) [-]
#1 - Worked for voldemort to protect Lily
#2 - Begged voldemort to kill James and Harry but not Lily knowing that Voldemort have every intention to kill all 3
#3 - Being a dick isn't grounds to judge someone's character so long as their actions were always done with the greater good in mind.

No, none of that qualifies as bad.

Turn off capslock, I can read.
#114 to #110 - brettd
Reply 0
(07/18/2013) [-]
No, Snape was not actively trying to protect Lily until Voldemort suspected her son of being the one mentioned in the prophecy. He initially became a death eater because he actually wanted to be a part of the Voldemort movement. He never really gave a **** about anyone but Lily, and probably would've been happy to see James and Harry dead. The only reason he tried to protect Harry in his later years was as a last favor to Lily.
#122 to #114 - Sethorein ONLINE
Reply 0
(07/18/2013) [-]
So let me get this straight.

Hero is a well meaning guy who loses the girl. Decides to become an asshole because everyone knows you can only love one girl in your life. When asshole leader dies he redeems himself and joins forces with dumbledore because that girl he was obsessing over still controls him. Spends 17 years being a stand up guy. Always does what he has to do to make sure that magic hitler doesn't win even if it's just because his OTP's kid is at stake. Then dies.

Last I checked Brutus didn't confess to his crime, find redemption, spend nearly 2 decades helping mark anthony and Augustus before joining a revolt to make sure the two of them could never lose. I'm pretty sure Macbeth kept his murder of Duncan a secret.

Ya you'll see most tragic heroes don't see the light until they're literally seeing the light before they die.
#124 to #122 - brettd
Reply 0
(07/18/2013) [-]
I think we disagree on the definition of a tragic hero.
#126 to #124 - Sethorein ONLINE
Reply 0
(07/18/2013) [-]
Macbeth, Oedipus, and Brutus also disagree with you.
#265 to #126 - brettd
Reply 0
(07/18/2013) [-]
No one author gets to define a tragic hero. Not even shakespear.
#266 to #265 - Sethorein ONLINE
Reply 0
(07/18/2013) [-]
Oedipus was Plato.

Tragic heroes have been defined literarily. Those were just examples. I can provide more examples if you like. Gatsby is a great one... Hell, even Holden Caulfield could qualify.