Seems more relevant

Why did I check if it were 11 links... what am I doing with my life?

11 posts and 11 thumbs up

Really? I couldn't tell.

11 posts and 11 thumbs up just makes your comment immensely awesome.

THANK YOU! This picture is at every fucking content related to: Arabs, Muslims, Islam, Israel-Palestine or terrorism. Its getting old!

Wow... That has to be the smartest controversy written in the comments that I have ever read

implying this post isn't anti arab?

Adorable?

If only I could give you all the thumbs and bump you to the top of the comments.

That's only one side of the argument.

I'm not understanding the downvote i'm right.

He gave one side and then gave another "side" which was simply sarcasm based on the first. That's exactly what keeps people from knowing whats going on and is a perfect example of the way the media reports "both sides"

No, my point was that one side is saying that Israel is murdering everybody and the other is saying that Israel is defending itself from everyone trying to kill them.

See, the problem is countries barely out of third world country mentality have gotten their hands on first world technology.

No country should have access to the horrible things we call technology.

Oh, yeah, because we should totally give automatic weaponry and missiles to people who are borderline neanderthals.

wait who are you referring to?

The majority of the Middle East and similar countries. Also, anyone getting violent over Religion is clearly not fit to be a part of modern society.

The only country with first world technology in the Middle East is Israel

And are they violent over Religion? My point stands.

yes, I know, I just wanted to clarify that they're the only ones with such technology

um. yes they are, that's why they're occupying the west bank through violence, because it's the "holy land"

I'm not exactly a scholar in this area, but I'm guessing it's not even really religion at this point, just so much taking of land and lives over time that people just endemically hate each other.

Take out the religion,

Israel slaughtering children, women and civilians.

Probably Micheal Bay started it by testing his Special Fx on the wrong country

12,000 rockets have been launched at civilian towns from Gaza since Israel withdrew from Gaza a few years ago. About 1000 just this year. You won't see that on TV.

you DO know that they both have been at each others throats since forever right?

one is as guilty as the other

The fuck are you talking about?

Here's the history of who ruled Israel

Egyptians->Jews->Assyrians->Babylonians->Persians->Greeks->Jews->Romans->Arabs-> Europeans->Arabs->Turks->British->Jews.

Palestinians didn't exist until 1967. Palestinian refers to non-Israeli Muslim Arabs that reside in the West Bank and Gaza (and their diaspora).

he is right, the Palestinians where next to forced from their homes when it was decided

Palestinians feel that the land is rightfully theirs as they had it first (not historically) and the jews feel that they have right to the land plus are pissed about the Palestinians hating them

both people throws rockets at each other and you get to the situation you have today

why did you think they hate each other so much?

The Arabs were never forced from their homes. In 1948 during the start of the Israeli-Arab war (when Israel declared independence), many Arabs fled, fearing Jewish rule. Those that stayed were given Israeli citizenship.

20.3% of Israeli citizens are Arabs.

i just realized that i have insufficient knowledge about this topic to go into a deep discussion about it

what i know (which might very well be wrong, fuck if i know) was that the Palestinians lost land that they think is rightfully theirs and hate those that now live on it.

the people who live in israel however think that the land is rightfully theirs (chosen by god or what not) and think the palestinians are stupid for wanting it back

dissagreement lead to hate, hate lead to fighting, fighting lead to rockets

all i know with certainly is that i think the fighting is stupid and that they wont stop before they go into full scale war with each other

anything wrong? i would like to know if that is the case (can't be right all the time, right?)

and those arab "citizens" aren't allowed to own guns but isreali jews are

Where do you get this shit? Israel has very strict gun laws. Outside of the military, few people have guns.

Arab Israelis have the same rights as Jewish Israelis. If Jews could own guns, Arabs can too.

wtf have you been reading

the british-french agreement of 1920 defined the borders of Palestine and was placed under the power of The British Mandate of Palestine and held as such until 1948 when the british and jews defined the borders of israel as an Independant state

more proof landlords are assholes

The West Bank was part of Jordan and Gaza was part of Egypt. When the Arab nations lost their war in 1967, they lost Gaza (Egypt), the West Bank (Jordan) and the Golan Heights (Syria) to Israel.

The Syrians evacuated the Golan Heights because they were told by their government that the Jews were going to kill their children to make matzah. The Jordanians and Egyptians in Gaza and the West Bank have been known as Palestinians ever since then.

lrn2history

you know your shit, that is good as most people don't

but yeah giving the jews the land was a huge mistake

i would really like to meet the dumbfuck who thought the idea up

just checked the history

apparently after WW1, the british took the lands of palestine from Syria and kept it as a british mandate nation
over the years the brits slowly let jews migrate there, despite that the palestinians didnt want it, but you know brits, they have a 'do as we say' policy

strangely, during the 1930's, germany tried to migrate jews out peacefully to palestine where they wanted to go, but britain denied it and left the jews in german hands (and we saw how that ended)

the man to blame for it all, is this man:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harold_MacMichael

he was in office in the mandate of palestine from 1938-44

i knew that the nazi's original plan was to move all the jews but i have heard that they planed to move them to Madagascar

oh well, i have been wrong before. just a shame that they couldn't go through with it, the world would have six million less graves (really just fewer mass graves but you know what i mean) if they had. plus if they would have been moved to Madagascar then they would have been much less harassed as there is no real value of the island as far as i know

well they did also plan to build madagascar as a place to put them but the war drained resources and british blockades stopped it

a shame really, a country mostly populated by jews in a remote part of the world where no one would bother them and where they would be able to become the new (and probably better) Switzerland in the bank world.

this is fact: most old jewish families worked with bank, loan and money business and where damn good at it

yeah but do you really feel safe with jews controlling your money?

as much as they have 2 commandments in their religion that speak out against borrowing or lending with interest, most jewish bankers charge shitloads

now that is just plain stereotypical racism and i will now continue this discussion with you

goodbye

well seriously, look at the bullshit in life

paying water bills, for stuff that falls out of the sky for free
the government genetically modifying fruits and veggies to not have seeds so we cant grow our own and have to BUY from stores
paying land rates? im sorry when did i agree to pay to be alive in this country

...god did i misjudge you

you are one of those retarded anti-capitalistic conspiracy acussing twits that have are blocking scientific progress with your ignorance

i regret talking to you, more so agreeing with you. i am leaving this conversation and hope that you won't spawn another ignorant dumbfuck into this world

go die in a fire

no i fully support science for the improvement of humanity not its subjugation

all that man has built and will build should be to improve life for all, not for the few at the top who made themselves out masters

to deny what i say shows you are happy blindly being a servent,

back in the days of black slavery, the masters would have a favored slave they kept in the house as a privileged domestic slave who got better treatment than the other slaves who slept in the barn, better bedding, food, clothes, etc, but still a slave
- perfect metaphor for you and others like you,..living in a 1st world country, happy to be a slave to that government rather than like the people in 3rd world countries slaved to their governments

jesus christ

1. seedless fruits are created cus no one like them (who the fuck plants their own orange bush for example? i don't)
2. the world HAS the solution to world hunger since like 2 years back but they aren't allowed to use the plants cus hippies says "the end is nigh" "genetically engineered plants kill the diversity" with out the knowledge that we would be able to fix that even if it happened (wich it most likely won't)
3. "slave of the government"? holy shit son what be you smoking? ya think that the government goes around and rewards the mindless and punish the questioners? you are retarded. the "government" as you call it is not some kind of money sucking mass of greed, it is a money collecting machine that then distributes the money where the moronic masses want it wherever or not it is the place is should go.

if you wanna blame something then blame the masses who, in their infinite greed, stupidity and ignorance of the world, force the elections and politics of the parties to be focus on the stuff that is insignificant in the large picture

"slave of the goverment"? don't make me laugh. what would you want instead? liberalism, where the rich will dominate the poor? anarchy? maybe you think me a communist? a idiotic fool that think that the sweat of a mans brow should belong to everyone. well you would be wrong you clod. the government is there to regulate, not to, as you oh so wisely says, enslave

right because its perfectly okay to mess with mother nature to make things more convenient for people, and they wont say if theres anything leftover in the GM food you eat, just eat mutant food and be happy

GM doesnt kill diversity, the hippies dont know wtf its about, GM doesnt affect diversity, in a way it encourages it....BUT the issue is, the government wouldnt modify foods to satisfy lazy fuckers who cant spit seeds out, they do it to prevent people from having any ability to grow own crops and thus leave the government the only ones who can
that and also with all the chemicals the government sprays around, the crops have to be GM'd to survive in poisoned soil

the government IS a money magnet, do you seriously think all the money collected from taxes, fees and fines goes back to the people?
yes there are the occasional expenditures of money on things to distract the people but largely the money goes where the leaders want, for reasearch, for war, for all their secret sciences....science is at least 50 years ahead of where the government claims it is

elections are a sham designed to make the people think they count towards anything, and if anyone disagrees, they can protest, standing in a public place screaming womething is okay and if you get too carried away police can arrest for for disorderly behaviour (or worse depending how a protester acts)

and you prove western ignorance, true communism is where a person lives as part of a community where everyone shares as they can BY CHOICE, not the movie style stalin communism you have been told

the government does enslave and so-called regulating is in fact maintenace on the slavery system, they dont beat with whips and put you in chains, they beat you with laws and put you in handcuffs

if you disagree please tell me why so many of the so-called united states are upset wit hthe federal government and talking about splitting from usa

you know what?

fuck this

we can sit all night with this and neither of us would change our minds so why bother?

i am gonna do what we sweds have done since the 30's; put my hands in my pockets, leave this to someone else and continuing like i did before

so your real name is Patrick

take these problems,. and move them somewhere else

when i say this i mean that that plan was better then killing them all, i do not in any way support any nazi ideas or goals

really ? you must not live around gaza where israely people getting bombed everyday, after 4 long months they deside they had enough.
Ofcurse isael has LARGER bombes, they are more advanced ffs.
So everyone are getting down on israel because they had enough of arabic bombing them?
If 5 men were to attack you with stick and you had a gun, wouldn't you shoot them all? or just let them hit you over and over again because it isn't fair that you have a gun when they have only sticks to beat you up.

Poeple need to live in israel or gaze before talking shit.

well the other side is :what did the guy with the gun DO to piss off those 5 men to make them so desperate to attack him with sticks when they know he has a gun

israel is that, the guy with the gun, keeping palestine in such shit all they have are sticks and since they have little else left but honor, they may as well put up some tiny act of defiance against israeli tyranny

You really dont know the history of israel don't you

never really cared to read up on it, i dont consider them important enough to care

yet you.... talk about the histroy of israel like you know it...
forget it, i thought i was talking to someone that knows what he is talking about...
have a good day

ive checked up on issues about them but not read the distant history of them

i dont care where they came from my concern is what they do now and why Palestine has rights to the land

Actually, it's more like a father and his family (Hamas and Palestine) are walking towards you (Israel) and you 10 bodyguards (USA) , the father punches you, and you get a bodyguard's gun and shoot the baby and wife, grazing the father.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_phosphorus#Gaza_War_.282008.E2.80.932009.29

Really? if you think that way it is wrong, israel targets the armed forces and not the civilians, they try to do their best not to kill the civilians.

> they try to do their best not to kill the civilians.

come on, do you really believe this? Just read the article where they dropped WP on a residential area and then lied about it

israel and USa are the best at killing civilians then telling the world "we didnt do it'

have you actually seen said bombings or just going by what iraeli media tells you
hell, every time someone fires even a 9mm round in israel's way, they report it as 'coming under heavy enemy fire'

they exxagerate to get foreign sympathy while they get away with murdering civilians in the gaza and palestine
take a look at the way israel's map has changed over the years, its like the imperial conquests of pre-21st century,

if any other country today did that, the USA and the UN would bitch for the attacker to release the captured territory.....but israel is allowed to keep and hold?

and it is not true that they say "coming under heavy fire" did you even watch an israely report about the bombing on israel?
they say the exact number of bombs that fell and the exact weaponry that was used.

right and they never hollywood'd it up to make it appear as bad as they say

about as believable as hitlers claim of polish attacking the radio station

Yes, i have expect sevral bombing's around my house, some of them where so close it came to the point that i could have alomst died.
And for "murdering civilians" you know how hamas operates? they hide behind children, kindergardens, red cross and shoot their rockets from there, israel can just look at it and do shit about it so the world won't say how horrible they are, but sometimes they do fire back and children get hurt, that what happends when they hide behind them
sphotos-b.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/189701_428863400516166_454880685_n.jpg

sounds more like israelis shoot first then count bodies later, and if any civilians got hurt, oh well, they were being used as meatshields

They do try to take shots as easy as they can, they look around for civis, they dont shoot right away, there are footages of planes looking around before shooting, when they see someone not from the hamas 3 kilomiters away they dont shoot and say it is too risky, but sometimes misrakes happen, and they hit civis

kinda reminds me of the scene from the movie 'Soldier' where an enemy took a captive, and kurt russel still opened fire because he knew his shots would penetrate the civilian and hit the enemy soldier

www.youtube.com/watch?v=QW57mVNNJM8

Israel acts in a different way, they try to look for all the possible ways to nutrilize the enemy and not killing the civi, in this movie the soldiers are heartless, they shoot no matter what. israely army is not like that, they try to find every possible way to kill the enemy and not kill the civi.
but what if they cant? lets say there is no way to save the civi. should they just leave the terrorists and let them bomb theirs civilians? let the keep bombing isaely cities because they dont want to kill civis? what would you do in a situation like this?

and who is to say they are doing everything they can? do you expect military officials to tell the truth?, the only officers who speak to media are bullshit artists

without any outside source watching the israeli soldiers at war, all you have is their testimony that 'theyre doing everything they can to neutralize the enemy and not harm civilians'

Okay, who are you to tell that any other media tells the truth about israel and gaza.

well most other media also bleat 'poor little israel' stories

hence the need for a non-biased media
even if it needs to be a civilian with a home movie camera sneaking a couple non-edited shots and getting it on the internet asap so people KNOW the truth about the war in gaza

Well you didn't answer my question then so okay fine.
You seen videos from israel, how it gets bombed no matter where, hamas wants to bomb civis, israely army doesn't want to bomb civis. This is the only difference.

yep thats what they tell the world

truth is, yeah sometimes hamas open fire at random and sometimes civilians get hurt...but israel specifically targets civilian areas then tells the world 'whoops we didnt mean to do that'

Gaza is constantly firing rockets and mortars in to Israel, so when Israel retaliates... Israel is the aggressor?

Gaza is very densely populated and civilians unfortunately do get killed by Israeli forces, but it isn't intentional. It doesn't help when Hamas fires their rockets and mortars from the roofs of schools and hospitals.

yeah, nice hollywood style that, israel blows up any place they can kill large numbers of gaza civilians then plants token munitions in the rubble BEFORE photographing the ruins to justify the attack

hell i can bury a broken AK47 under a few rocks, pour some gasoline over it and light it up, then take a pic of 'burning rubble with destroyed weaponry' doesnt make it real

What the hell are you talking about? Is this conspiracy stuff?

not conspiracy, fact!

israel has always wanted all other arabs dead as revenge for the historic wrongs done to jewish people, and as soon as they got USA to watch their back they began their quest of revenge

You're nuts.

Cool fact: 1/5 Israelis are Arabs and get along fine with the Jews.

Israel has a Jewish majority, but Israel is also a very multicultural, multifatih society. It's a hodgepodge of religious minorities throughout the Middle-East. The Druze for example are often more loyal and defensive of Israel than Jews are.

well the faith of Druze is Monotheism, as in they follow 'the one god'
while all other religions including judaism bleat their ideal of god is better than the other faith

in fact it would be better for all the false religions to die off, they are the main reason why israel and palestine want each other dead

Israel, which claims to only try to kill terrorist cells, has countless counts of "collateral damage" which is just civillian killings.

see en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_phosphorus#Gaza_War_.282008.E2.80.932009.29

Pic related, Israel dropping white phosphorous on residential Gazan neighborhoods

israel's policy is kinda like Warhammer

"its better that a thousand innocents die than allow one heretic to live"

White phosphorus is used by a variety of armies, and it's used as a smokescreen. It's relatively harmless as long as you don't get hit by the initial combustion or sit in it for a long period of time.

Israel isn't practicing chemical warfare. How about you actually read the wiki article rather than just linking it as if that vindicates your position.

>relatively harmless

How about YOU read past the first sentence of the article

"As an incendiary weapon, white phosphorus burns fiercely and can set cloth, fuel, ammunition and other combustibles on fire, and cause serious burns or death."

I'm sure the purpose of the israelis was to just drop a "relatively harmless smokescreen" on the palestinian civillians

and since you seem to think anything short of direct shell hits are a piece of cake, www.google.com/search?q=White+Phosphorous&rlz=1C1CHFA_enUS485US485&sugexp=chrome,mod%3D0&um=1&ie=UTF-8&hl=en&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi&authuser=0&ei=0wqoUNL6LeXC0QGBvoGABw&biw=1169&bih=751&sei=2AqoUPHTEIHl0gH2vYHYAg#um=1&hl=en&safe=off&tbo=d&rlz=1C1CHFA_enUS485US485&authuser=0&tbm=isch&spell=1&q=White+Phosphorus+effect&sa=X&ei=2gqoUMqrNLSC0QGZvICAAQ&ved=0CEMQvwUoAA&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.&fp=78e2858cad7dcb12&bpcl=38625945&biw=1169&bih=751

dont worry about him, he's on the same bandwagon as the people who say 'depleted uranium shells didnt cause gulf war syndrome'

denial is much sweeter than facing facts

Please read the wiki article. The pic your provided from the shells initial combustion. Otherwise damage from white phosphorus typically only happens from a long period of exposure.

Why are you ignoring the link I gave you to the effects of indirect WP shells?

All you did was post a link to Google images.

LOL are you seriously this retarded or are you trying to avoid the fact that I posted a link showing the effects of white phosphorous

That's from getting hit by a white phosphorus shell.

if the arabs would put down their weapons, there would be more and more and more and more israel in the next few years

Israel obviously has no intention of expanding as it's only interested in what it currently holds, which is the territory of the historic Kingdom of Israel/Judah. The only conflict where Israel was the aggressor was the Suez Crisis back in the 1950s.

Say what?

I don't understand what your argument is.

because you're an idiot, the argument is obviously 100% proof that isreal is very interested in expanding. Obviously you can't admit that or you'll be admitting that you were wrong. Why do you support them so much? They're the real terrorists, along with the CIA and the rest of NATO nations.

yea, that's exactly why they're building illegal settlement in the suez right now, because they don't want it.
Do you people really believe this rhetoric or are you on their side because they're americas allies? Either way it's still immoral

Umm... what? Israel doesn't have any "settlements" in the Suez. The Suez is an Egyptian canal that connects the Mediterranean with the Red Sea.

This is why no one values the opinion of teenagers.

sinai, whatever

Israel never had any settlements in the Sinai either. The Sinai is a desert wasteland. The entire area between Israel and Egypt's Nile is uninhabitable.

wrong, infact they only dismantled 18 settlements on the Sinai in 1982. There are still several standing but uninhabited since the peace agreement.
Dumbass. The nation has no morals, how can you have sympathy for someone when your religion states that you are the chosen people and you are the only ones allowed into heaven, everyone else is inferior. They are self worshiping and the disproportional wealth to population of jews in america has led to their rise in politics and their ability to brainwash the ignorant masses (that's you since you were ignorant to the sinai situation).

In the end jews emigrated to palestine, took their land, forced families out, went to war with everyone, kills civilians purposefully (whether it's bombs or sanctions on medicine), owns illegal nuclear weapons yet criticizes Iran.
You can say it's the holy land but that's religious nonsense, and if you believe that they should be given back their homeland because it was taken thousands of years ago, then everyone should leave america and give it back to the natives, europe would be ancient rome and greece (or whatever came before them) and isreal would be EGYPT

Israel returned the Sinai to Egypt in 1979.

Christians also believe only Christians will go to heaven. Muslims also believe only Muslims will go to heaven. The "chosen people" crap is what antisemites have been shouting since time immemorial.

The last paragraph of yours is just thinly-veiled antisemitic bullshit. Israel never forced anyone out of their homes. People fled fearing Jewish rule, fearing the Jews would kill their children and use their blood to make matzah (the Syrians especially believed this, as it was in Syrian school textbooks). Israel does not intentionally kill civilians, and yes Israel does own nuclear weapons but it doesn't own them illegally as it never since the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty. Iran however is a signatory.

I believe that Israel should exist because it already does. Would you have every Jew forcefully expelled from the region?

Your comments about Rome and Egypt speak volumes about your ignorance.

Before you accuse me of being a Jew, I'm a Canadian Atheist of British descent.

Thanks for clarifying your nationality, i would like to add that I don't care. You can say they fled fearing jewish rule all you want but there are endless accounts of israeli jews and it's military in it's early history forcing arabs from their homes. I'm also an atheist which is apparant in my previous comments so I'm not an anti-semite, Palestinians are Semites too. All religions are ignorant to reality and i don't defend any of them (other than maybe buddhism for the simple fact that they leave everyone alone). I would leave the jews alone too if they did the same, but instead they "HAD" to invade a land that wasn't theirs because their stupid religion, of which they worship themselves, prompted them to do so. There is no thin veil or any type of veil at all, the simple fact is that they are terrorists, and hamas responds to them the same way isreal responds, in a terrorist manor. Even if i was an anti-semite my arguments would still be valid. I would rather have a free palestine that minds their own business then a free israel that fights for it's survival on a territiry that isn't their and is unnatural in it's existence. Jews could have lived peacefully on the land beside the arabs but they just had to call the shots and ruin everything for themselves. If they are forcefully removed from their homes it is because they ruined their reputation and must face the consequences of their actions. I'm for justice, and that's that.

My comments about Rome and Egypt were to allude to the ignorance of your comments about the historic kingdom of Judah (Anyone that can read english could have understood that while being bludgeoned to death by a mace)

You're one of the most grossly ignorant people I've encountered on the internet in quite some time.

You don't care for history or facts. You just utterly fabricate everything to support your narrative.

Seems like you're doing that. Fact is bad people run governments, and israel is an especially bad nation. Bye

and they're still building settlements there, egypt is powerless to stop them.

No, they're not. The Sinai is 100% Egyptian territory.

Post a link showing me that Israelis are building settlements in Egypt. You can't because it isn't happening. You've made it up.

You're just a flaming antisemite that likes to make shit up to fit your anti-Israel/Jewish narrative.

You do need some historical help. What Israel wanted is the whole area of Sinai including the "Suez Canal" and they had no rights over it since it's Egyptian Land.

Huge difference, get your facts right.

Israel gave back the Sinai to Egypt in 1979 as a peace offering. Israel never had any settlements in the Sinai. They used it as a buffer zone.

The only place Israel has settlements is the West Bank.

No, you need to get your facts straight. You're making shit up to fit your narrative.

Gave back as in after the war which in 1973 and then in 1979 which is 12 years after the sudden attack they performed which also included Golan Heights in Syria?

Let me try to get you right here. Israel not building any settlements means that they didn't want any control of it?
I disagree. Not having settlements doesn't mean they didn't want to take over the whole Sinai Peninsula. They took over Sinai, blocked the Suez Canal and built the Bar Lev line to block any Egyptians from crossing to Sinai.

>Implying Israel was the belligerent, and not the Arab states.

The Sinai is nothing but desert with a few roaming Bedouin tribes. Israel couldn't settle it if it wanted to. The Sinai was a buffer between Israel proper and Egypt.

The Sinai is valuable as a buffer zone, but it was more valuable as a peace token.

Your narrative of "israel is the expansionist aggressor" is shit. The only time Israel was ever the belligerent part was in the Suez Crisis, when Israel was allied with Britain and France against Egypt which tried to nationalize the Suez Canal.

If all humanity put down their weapons, it'd be awesome.

The US would still find a way to preserve freedom around other countries.

"We're not talking about a cease-fire, it's not on the agenda,"
November 16 2012
Israeli senior official after briefing with Barak and Netanyahu

November 8th 2012: Palestinian boy is killed by an Israeli bullet while playing soccer after a two week no violence streak
>Palestinians injure Israeli soldier
>Israel responds by bombing Gaza strip, killing a military target as well as several children under the age of 5

Keep fighting Israel! If you don't keep defending yourselves, Hamas will destroy your extraordinary military power (including f16's and nukes) with nothing but primitive rockets. Riiiight...

The terrorists have no chance of destroying Israel's military capabilities. That's not their goal, and that's not what Israel's worried about.
The terrorists can and have intentionally attacked innocent civilians. That's their preferred method of "resistance", and that's precisely what necessitates Israel's actions in the Palestinian territories.

I won't deny that Israel sometimes uses excessive force, but as a whole it has shown remarkable restraint. It also does not intentionally target innocents, unlike its adversaries.

there would still be violent Persians

...or Canada

Here's a few facts you conveniently omitted.
1. At the time of the creation of Israel, about 1/3 of British Palestine's population was Jewish. Originally the Jews were welcomed by the Arabs because they brought skilled labor, technology, and patronage for Arab businesses, but as the Jewish population grew so did tensions between the two groups.
2. The UN Mandate that created Israel originally offered half of the land each to the Jews and the Arabs. The Jews accepted, the Arabs did not.
3. When Israel was created as a state, it was immediately attacked by most of its Arab neighbors, as well as the Arab residents of the Palestinian territories. Israel easily won the war and occupied the territories to defend itself against future attacks. The occupation allowed it to create a buffer zone between itself and its enemies, as well as to prevent attacks from the Palestinian territories themselves.
4. Since the occupation of the territories, Israel has signed peace treaties with many of its attackers. However, the threat from within the Palestinian territories did not go away, and Israel has been attacked countless times by terrorists from the territories (and Lebanon).
5. Many of the terrorist groups seek not merely liberation but the outright destruction of Israel - for example, Hamas, the terrorist group democratically elected as the government of Gaza, wrote that goal into its charter. These groups have turned a conflict over land into a religious jihad and think it's okay to fire rockets at school buses in order to achieve their goals. For some reason people tolerate this because they think the Palestinians are desperate.
6. Though Zionism may well influence the motivations of some Israelis, the primary reason for Israel's actions is defense. Though Israel sometimes uses excessive force to achieve this end, it nevertheless shows remarkable restraint in order to avoid killing innocents. The necessity of its actions will persist only as long as the threat.

Here's another, more historically correct lay-out of the conflict:

Before 1881, Palestine was an Arab region, with Jews, Christians and Muslims lived in peace. The region itself wasn't officially called Palestine, but by the Christians of Europe and other international organization, it was called Palestine. It was also called Palestine in colloquial speech of the locals at that time. They were all regarded as Arabs, as the Jews themselves spoke Arabic at home, and were very well integrated into the society at that time. They lived in peace, and no major conflicts occured this time. We'll call these the Old Jews.

In Russia, the Tsar starts pogromming and persecuting the Jews. In the meanwhile in Europe, nationalist sentiments were sweeping across Europe for the past century. The Jews, who in a European Christian context, had always been persecuted in Europe. They were considered a distinct ethnic group, whereas in the Middle-East, Judaism was considered a religion and not an ethnicity. There were varying degrees of mistreatment, from discrimination on a daily basis, to direct persecution. The Jews did not feel themselves at home in this new wave of nationalism, and the general consensus of the non-Jews, was that you either choose to be a Jew, or a national of the respective nation-state. The Jews did not like this idea, and most of them were actually supporters of Communist and Socialist thoughts and ideas, so many of them had very little connection to Judaism. So the Jews of Europe and Russia got together to form and develop a new form of nationalism as common denominator for all Jews. It served as an alternative to the varying forms of European nationalism. They created Zionism. (Zion = Jerusalem). What Zionism essentially did, was it borrowed the Biblical tales and myths about the Jewish people, and secularized it. They secularized Judaism.
Continued below.

These Jews started migrating to Palestine. Jews were welcomed with open arms, for different reasons. I've asked my grandfather (who happens to be a Palestinian refugee from 1948) and he told me, and that his grandfather (my great-great-grandfather) said to him, that Jewish immigration to Palestine was a normal thing, and at the start of the Zionist immigration (starting in 1881), people weren't worried about the new influx of Jewish immigrants. They saw it as a part of the renewed European interest for Palestine. (This has since been confirmed in Ilan Pappé's book: Palestine - one land, two people). Prior to the onset of the Zionist immigration, European Christians, banking companies and the like, had started to invest in this land. They brought a lot of new agro-technologies, banking systems and the established new secular/Christian schools. (This disproves the Zionist narrative, that they modernized Palestine) This happened 30 years before the onset of the Zionist immigration.

As the Zionist immigration continued, Zionist leaders saw a problem - Palestine was already inhabited. Also, the Ottoman Empire started limiting the Zionist immigration to the land. They then suggested moving to another empty land. Some of the suggestions were Uganda, or Argentina. That proved to be very unpopular among the average Zionist, so it was decided it was necessary to convince the rulers of the land, the Ottomans. After many negotiations, the Ottomans denied their plans. That didn't stop them though, as they continued to craft a comprehensive and coherent Zionist narrative. And the Zionist leader at that time, Theodore Herzl, chose to align himself with the extremely rich and influential family, The Rotschilds. They started lobbying and pressuring the British government to let them have Palestine. And it succeeded. British foreign minister Balfour declared that he would work to establish a Jewish homeland in Palestine in 1917.

When the British conquered Palestine, and subsequently got a mandate from the League of Nations, they opened up Palestine for Zionist immigration. Before the proposed mandate was given to the British, The Syro-Palestinian congress demanded the recognition of the "independence and national rule (al-Sultan al-Qawmi) of Syria, Lebanon and Palestine". The mandate was also given on the condition, that the British built up an independent nation-state for the local population. The British accepted, and opened up the country for European Zionist immigration. The tensions then started to grow between the immigrants and the natives (as there happens everywhere in the world) and this resulted in a number of conflicts from 1920-1948. That was during the entire British Mandate. Eventually, the British published the White Paper of 1939, in which a Jewish national home was abandoned, and a quota of 10.000 European Jewish immigrants per year. Though was not enforced completely though, as many many more European Jews took refuge in Palestine, from the Nazis and other European regimes. The Jewish terrorist groups Lehi, Irgun and Haganah started terrorist attacks against the British kim jongistration, including the assasination of the British Minister of the Middle East.

Later, they joined forces, and then carried out several terrorist attacks against the British kim jongistration, the most famous of which, is the bombing of the King David hotel in 1946, where many British officials were residing.

The result in 1947, was that the Jewish population had grown to 1/3 of the total population. Though, they only owned 6% of the land, and did not have a majority in any district, except Tel Aviv. The UN proposed a plan, which would give 56% of the land to the Jews, and 42% of the land to the Arabs. The remaining 2% was Jerusalem, and that was to be put under international kim jongistration. The Jews accepted this, the Arabs rejected it. The reasons for rejection were many, but includes:
1. 66% of the population was Arab, yet they only got 42% of the land, even though they owned a much larger share of the land than the Jews.
2. The Jews had immigrated to Palestine, and suddenly they wanted an independent state on their land.
3. The Jews owned only 6% of the land, yet they were given the majority of the coastline.
4. They were given the Naqab/Negev desert, in which the majority of its inhabitants were Bedouin Arabs.
5. The Jews were given the demographically and historically Arab cities of Haifa and Jaffa.
6. If the plan had been carried out, 200.000 Arabs would have to be expelled, to establish a Jewish majority in the proposed Jewish state.
7. and many more.

The British had given up then, and so the conflict was between Palestinian Arabs and Jews. The Jews started the ethnic cleansing of Palestine already in March 1948 (2 months before the independence, and 2 months before any other Arab nation declared war). It was planned long before, and the one of the most famous incidents before the Arab-Israeli war of 1948, was the Deir Yassin massacre on 9th April 1948. This resulted in a huge drop in Palestinian Arab morale, and many Arabs hoped that they would be left alone, if they didn't fight. Unfortunately, that was wishful thinking, as a lot of areas were still ethnic cleansed. When British withdrew, and the Jews declared independence, the surrounding Arab states declared war. The following war lasted until 1949, where an armistice line was drawn, now known as the green line. In the meanwhile, 750,000 Palestinian Arabs were violently expelled and/or fled (I say 'and' because, many of them were expelled from their homes, and they would then go to live in another city, where they were expelled or had to flee again). This resulted in the current refugee problem.

Didn't the Arab leaders voice to stop the Jewish immigration and when the British didn't go through with it, they started a riot in Jerusalem which ended with six Jews killed and hundreds wounded?

I wasn't familiar with the specific event you described, but this seems to fit your description:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1920_Nebi_Musa_riots
It doesn't surprise me. As I said, gradually the influx of Jewish immigrants into British Palestine increased tensions between the Jews and the Arabs and led to violent conflicts (before the creation of the Israeli state).

Yeah thanks for showing which specific riot it was

Israel is as much a product of its environment as Hamas is.
I always can't help but laugh when people paint this shit in black and white terms.

He is partly right but the way Isreal was made is that the Arabs, and Palestine disagreed that made Isreal and Palestine two states. So when this happend anyway all the Arab countries basically said "Fuck Isreal" and started aggression Which lead Isreal to start spying on its naboring countries with double agents which lead to the Six Day War in which Isreal got what land it has now as well as the Sinai Peninsula, Which they Gave back to Egypt later, And they have been there since. And thats why Isreal is how it is today.

I don't necessarily disagree with him. I didn't intend my post to be a counter-argument. I probably should have worded it better.

Slight correction - You're an idiot that can't help but laugh with everything he disagrees with. Anon up there at least has an insightful and factual argument with some bias thrown in there but you're just spewing baseless bullshit and hoping something sticks. Elaborate or GTFO.

>implying i didn't thumb him up.
>implying I intended my as a counter-point to him
>implying I laugh at everything that disagrees with my viewpoint
Why so mad?

1. I didn't talk about thumbing up at all, and thus did not imply anything about it
2. Your what? That's not even a coherent phrase, let alone a sentence
3. It wasn't an implication. I straight up said it
And lastly, now that I realize you're just trolling, I ain't even mad

Intentionally reading a typo as indecipherable.
Calling a person a troll
I've seen pots calling kettles black before, but damn.

"I intended my as a counter-point "
Still don't understand what he means, not intentional whatsoever.
As for calling him a troll, if any comment permits the use of that word, it's any variation of "U Mad?" which was clearly used. I don't know what else you would call that.
I feel like the definition of the word "troll" is largely exaggerated among FJers, I don't know how I'm the one trolling here. Please let me know when you find out

I will give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that a word lost to lack of proof-reading threw you off and clarify.
I have a minor in communications, a large part of my studies in college was dedicated to the art of making people see things my way. If I was trying to make a counter-point, he'd know.
I'd also recommend you stay away from words like "idiot" and "troll", they only serve the purpose of shutting your audience off from your message and painting you like an ass.
I'm sure you're a decent person in irl and doubt was that your objective.

Also, saying I laugh at two extreme-radical viewpoints concerning a single topic hardly includes "everything"

Slight correction - Zionism has been around since the 19th century at least but you are right It did not gain much support particularly from western(read Britain) nations until the fall of the Ottoman Empire.

are you retarded?

no he is right you know
UK is still the owner of 'Merica
Holland is still the owner of a lot of eastern countries
So is Turkey of half Europa while sharing it with the Germans
And Spain still owns almost whole South America.

thats not the same

Your right, this is going back even farther than those comparisons.

I wish Netanyahu was brought to world court and hung

Staph bombing my parents!

wat?

you where apart of the protest in haifa?
feels good to have a minute of silnce for a terrorist leader.
If you love gaza so much go live there, go study there, why do you even live and study in israel if you hate it so much?

a lot of childen have died.
you are saying i can't stand for one minute of silence? and you call this state a democracy?

children die because hamas hides behind them to shoot rockets at israel.
OFCUSRE it is sad and i feel bad for those kids. I guess it was wrong taking it apart so quickly but really? what do you expected, you did it at the exact time the hamas leader died and it looked like you did it for him.
And what you want israely army to do? not to shoot and let the hamas shoot rockets endlessly?

every action has a reaction.. as best said by Ron Paul..
Gaza has been under siege for the past 6 years with limited resources, while the army monitors every thing that comes out and everything that comes in. it's basically the biggest prison in the world.. that my friend, like it or not is the action. it's only inevitable that there would be a reaction.

Let me respond by the same statement.
Rockets fired from gaza to israel, israel blockes gaza and makes a siege around gaza so no weapons will come in, ofcurse it effects everything. less food can come in because they need to be checked for weaponry etc....
Action and reaction.

are you really going deeper? Israel Occupies Palestine and demolished villages to replace with places to live for their own residence.. i could go on for ever.

I have to time to go deeper i have to go to sleep so forget about it.
But tell me, what would you do in a situation like this? In what is happening in gaza?
leave it alone? let the bombing continue? let hamas take more territory and more and more untill there will be nothing left of israel?

There won't be a solution until Israel fixes its self from the inside

Same to gaza and all arabic countreis that want to destroy israel.

no one want's to destroy Israel and no one hates america.. you watch to much mainstream media.. and they are fixing them selves.. by a revolution, From the inside.
i'm gonna leave this conversation here, for i am going to bed.
good night

They do want to.
arabic cuntries cant negotiatio with israel, israel can. they manage to make somekind of peace with egypt & jorden , other arabic countries dont want to make peace with israel, israel wants to.
a man cant talk with reason with a lion

Let the red thumbs come down on me

This comment made my life. And your username added to it. XD

you fired 'murrica at Israel.. AWESOME!!!
not really