This is the title

I like reading them too...

from a safe distance

We're everywhere.

My name gets brought up in religious shitstorms a ton.
"THE DOCTRINE OF THE CATHOLIC DOCTRINE STATES THAT ALL DOCTRINE BASED RELIGIOUS" ect ect.

i love reading them. accidental learning is the best learning.

Woohoo! so much fun, you're doing it right NOW!

I thought this content was funny.

That's a pretty ballsy thing to say. Thumbs up, good work, I agree, all that jazz.

I agree.

I have to agree.

Made an account in 2011 or before.. Something like that, not entirely sure. It's nothing though.

Oh, ok. This is the first time I've done anything on this site for a good year or so, so I'm still getting used to a few things. Thanks :)

Much obliged.
Why is my name blue? I'm slightly scared...

Meant to reply to your comment >-> haha

Because you have been on this site for a very long time, Like me.

I'm pretty sure the statement, "I'm gonna get thumbed down, only leads to green thumbs.

Yeah, I know :( Sorry, I didn't want to, but I couldn't think of a better way of saying "I realise this is an unpopular opinion, but fuck it I'm saying it anyway."

Its not that Religion is the problem, its the fact that idiots exist. Im a protestant and I am all for gays, science, all that good stuff. I think its a fact that most overlook.

Idiots are and always will exist. As I tried to say, I don't want to stop anyone anywhere from getting together and conducting a "religion" as such. There's nothing wrong (in my view) with non-worshipping religious practices, but worship and the implied belief in a higher power is inconducive to true scientific enlightenment.

Which still falls under the "idiot clause", any a fool would denounce science and what not in the name of religion. I am not a heavily practicing protestant, but I do believe. I do it because it offers a sort of comfort, and it is a sort of "explanation" for things. Like I said, if someone uses religion to denounce science then they are a fool, a damned fool. Same goes for the gays and whatnot, however I think most of the Christians are level headed and all the crazies are the loud attention drawing ones. But I do respect your opinion and I would never think of trying to change it. I think all Christians should try to be "Christ like".

Your speaking pleases Slannesh.

what about in a Brave New World scenario? With no absolute morality it seems like a world governed by subjective morality and science kinda warps into a really ugly thing despite our best intentions...

I agree, that's definitely a huge problem, but it's also a problem we've got to take on and conquer, rather than sidestepping it by declaring an infallible set of laws to follow.

it's a very handy safety though, you have to admit :D

Atheists live the way they want
Religious folk live they way they want

When one steps too far out of bounds the other burns their fingers... and in the end something usually changes :P

It is indeed, but I, personally, believe that it can only last so long. We need to establish what is best for ourselves as a species and as a global society, and use that to govern and judge our actions. This is all opinion, of course, but nevertheless...

some people like to think religion is what's best for our species and they're a rather stubborn group xD

Well, I don't disagree that it was, but I do disagree about it's usefulness in our current time. There's quite a few dead-stubborn atheists too, and I'm not sure I can deny being one myself.

I'm pretty apathetic. God could exist, but you know what... his existence has no bearing on how I choose to live my life... but I still respect religious people, 'cause by in large they are trying to be good people, they've just got different values from the secular community...

That's a great way to view things, really. I used to be in that exact same viewpoint, but I've met a few too many people that have had their lives ruined and/or ruled by religious bigots and the organisations that support them, so now... well, I'm sure you've heard my views.

You do realize religious morality is subjective, for example the bible says to stone your unruly child, yet people no longer do this, and if you are to say this is old testament nonsense then you have to assume the ten commandments are not morally binding.

Religious morality is not morality, it is superstitious nonsense at best to get to moral rule you have to cherry pick through your various books, morality has always been subjective and it always will be religion or no religion.

You're approaching the bible from a literal perspective. There are countless texts by theologians which rationalize the more ridiculous statements such as stoning unruly children. By in large it's about giving the courts the authority to give that punishment but in practice, they never would.

You, as an atheist, are correct in stating that the morality IS subjective. However, to one of faith, it's not. It is one of those things that can't be questioned. Therefore the stuff like do not murder, do not cut the limbs off of living animals and other such basic logical moral concepts that were introduced to society by the bible are sort of held in an untouchable status.

Religion is like a check and balance system. If science and secular society start to wheel out of control and start promoting helter skelter and the destruction of countries... Religion kinda stands there saying "THOU SHALT NOT MURDER" "BASELESS HATE WAS WHAT LED TO THE DESTRUCTION OF THE SECOND TEMPLE"... You know, the nagging voice in your ear that tells you that even though you don't believe in God there are some moral lines that ought to remain taut, not fluid.

You called?

where the fuck is skelter, this is important! :|

Anything you tell Skelter you can tell me dammit! I'm just as good as him

The reason that we hold rule such as the ones against murder and the ones against stealing is not because of that little book or religion as a whole it is because we are social animals, if we did not become the pack animal that we are we would still be living in caves or worse we could be extinct, there is a reason dog is a mans best friend, dogs are also pack animals and as such they look to an authority figure, the pack leader if you will, if you were to die in your house and your dog was trapped in the room with you and the dog is loyal to you, the dog would sooner starve than touch your corpse, and if hungry while you are alive will not rip your throat out and chow down on you.

All of these so called moral absolutes are programed into us by our genetics but as advanced creatures we have the ability to go against our instincts, these rule have been seen and demonstrated in wild animals that are social animals.

Also why do you think we have gods?
Also fall back to the pack mentality, if we all follow the alpha as the higher power who dose he have to follow?
This is why kings and queens throughout history have been heavily religious.

and where do you think the social construct for your churches comes from, using the catholic church as an example we see the same hierarchical system as i have before mentioned we all look to the higher power, the people look to the priest, he looks to the bishop, the bishop looks to the cardinals and they look to the pope the pope then has to look to the next higher power to himself.

I wrote a reply... then accidentally refreshed... and now I don't wanna write it again :(

Suffice to say, I'm not religious you know, I just know there's a reason to keep it around even if I'll never subscribe to it xD

Religion in this day and age has no purpose, the same as you said before religion often takes a moral stance based on its doctrine, and stand up when science or politics goes a way that they don't like, this could be stem cell research or homosexuals getting married, unfortunately the religious bads are usually outweighed by the goods, and i know people say stuff about the charity work and helping people off of drugs but the religion gives no help its the people i that help in those circumstances, every thing in religion can be accomplished and has been by no secular means, this on its own proves religion obsolete.

Also i hate refreshing by accident it sucks.

religion seems to have no purpose because we still have it. Imagine if they didn't fight using fetuses for stem cells. Ya, we'd be a lot further in our research, but our definition of life would be sealed as "when the baby starts kicking" or something like that. No thought would be paid to the fetus at all. It is BECAUSE religion exists that we are forced to grapple with these tough moral choices. What is life? What is death? What is moral? If religion didn't exist we'd lose an entire avenue of thought.

It may not always be right, it may even be wrong more often than right, but it still forces us to take a step back before we leap into very serious issues to think carefully before we jump.

Well the best way to look at the stem cell argument in my view, (im against abortion past the first 2 months unless the mother is at risk), the fetuses that have already been aborted and will continue to be aborted are serving a purpose, they are helping to benefit everyone these people have been denied their right to exist so why not let them make a difference, and fetuses are not the only source of stem cells we all have stem cells however the number of which decreases over time.

it isn't religion that argues with abortion, however they are the most vocal about it, i my self am an atheist and i believe that abortion is ethically wrong past the stages i said earlier, these questions are not posed by religion they are simply the most vocal.

if we did not care about these moral choices, without religion then we could kill children right out of the womb or simply kill someone for committing a crime, im sorry but that is bullshit, some of the biggest killings of man has been through religion, for example in the crusades they killed cooked and ate children, this was because under their religion these people were seen as animals.

Religion may not be exactly what cause massive atrocities but it is certainly an enabler.

you're imposing a 21st century morality on peasants from the middle ages. People were being slaughtered en masse back then WITHOUT the help of religion... and EVERYONE hates the catholic church anyways... Remember the reformation?

Yes but if i can not apply 21st century morality on people from the middle ages, how am i expected to believe that modern day religions are able to preach morality from their book that was many years ago, it is simply a logical fallacy to believe using your own point that religion has any place in moral arguments, this renders your entire point mute.

moot*

When your parents tell you not to cross the road on a red when you're a kid you might think that red is bad.
When your parents tell you not to cross the road on a red when you're a teen you might think that other drivers are bad.
When you are a grown up and you understand that you don't cross the street on a red because it's the law of your country... are you supposed to just accept that because as an infant you thought red was bad that is the only view that you can ever associate with?

The law never changed. You don't cross on a red. What changed is humanity. So religion, even if it is ancient, is capable of evolution through the increasing maturity of the folks that are interpreting it.

It is idiotic to assume that you would think it was bad on instinct, if a parent cares enough and is not lazy, they will explain to you that it is dangerous to cross the road with a red light.

And you are saying we should forget about the wrong that they have enabled just because they are getting better over time, im sorry but as long as they ignore evidence and argue against that which they don't understand they have no place dictating morality.

Would you listen or laugh at someone if they told you the earth is flat, there are people out there that still believe that shit, we can not allow people that believe this dictate geology to us.

Religion has had some good points dont get me wrong but the bad outweighs the good, we can not let people with immoral views dictate morality.

you're assuming a child understands the world as a rational human being...

Seriously, you are so obsessed with hating religion for what it did in the 16th century... excuse me but look at Mao and Stalin. Were those religious dictators? These people were 20TH CENTURY dictators who committed far more murders than all of the crusades combined! AGAINST THEIR OWN PEOPLE. But no religion is the only thing that has ever killed anyone ever... not to mention the fact that you are so obsessed with catholocism that you deem its crimes the crimes of ALL organized religion.

If someone nowadays says the world is flat they haven't matured. They are not the representatives of religion just as the fascists and neo nazis aren't the representatives of secularism.

You keep deigning people immoral because of the sins of their ancestors. Let THEM behave immorally then condemn THEM for their actions. Quit hiding behind the crusades as an excuse to blindly hate.

I'm pulling away from the child argument as the point has moved forward and i don't wish to backtrack.

the fact that is am using examples from Catholicism is because they are one of they largest religious groups on the planet, there are religions out there that are perfectly good but unfortunately they rarely get a say.

Now you missed the point of the flat earth argument, there are people in this world that to this day in developed countries believe that the earth is flat, now would you like one of these people teaching your children geography.

in the UK and America the problem of religion always falls to Christianity, that is why is use the crusades as an example Christianity is the form of religion that i am most familiar, i don't hate religion and i lost mine while reading the bible.

Going on to the dictators Hitler was a religious man he used Jesus in many of his speeches and held a few public prayers he also used the story of Jesus being killed by the Jews as an excuse at one stage, this is an example of how the religion enabled the immorality (as we would se it)

The godless dictators cannot reflect on the secular community because besides the fact that we dont believe in a god people in the secular community have many different beliefs and as this is the way it is the people in this group can not be blamed for what the person did wrong, the same however cannot be said for religion religion has strict guidelines and because of this most of the people hold to the same beliefs and although you can not link the individuals to the horrors because they them selves did nothing wrong, you can look to the thing that enabled the person to do wrong in the case of arguments i have made previously region is what was to blame.

So because catholics are bad FUCK ALL RELIGION.

You realize you have to get a teaching degree, right? You can't teach flat earth theory in ANY public school system. I repeat, these are not the examples of religious people. These are the examples of religious idiots. You can point at idiots within ANY demographic.

Christianity isn't just Catholicism.

The point wasn't to have a dick comparing competition of whose killed more religion or secularism... it's to point out the fallacy in saying "BECAUSE THESE GUYS KILLED THESE GUYS BECAUSE OF THIS, THIS MUST BE WRONG!" Maybe the guys were wrong and simply used the idea for selfish reasons! Oh no, but it's much easier to hate, now isn't it.

It's like you think all religious people are homogenous... there's fractures within every religious group. I repeat, REFORMATION LOOK IT UP.

You're taking my initial argument for the validity of religion and trying to turn it xD You're saying that the absolute moral laws are the ones that lead people to do wrong, and not the fluidity of moral laws xD

Fact of the matter is, most of the moral laws in the bible are logical. Ya you can pull shit out with a literal stare and say LOOK LOOK IT SAYS STONE PEOPLE WHO PUT A DONKEY WITH A BULL UNDER A YOKE... but come on... that's just freaking petty and you know it. Fluid moral compasses are a dangerous thing. If you allow for only fluid morality there exists a possibility that we could completely forget what morality is as we rationalize immoral actions as "for the greater good" or "for the benefit of society at large". Hell that's WHY religion came into existence. Someone wanted to establish value for the individual life back when pagan society had no such thing. Now we take it for granted, but it's very easy to reverse.

I said it before and I'll say it again. Religion may be wrong 99.99% of the time... but its very existence forces us to question ourselves on a much deeper level before we make potentially morally repugnant choices.

Im not even going to read the rest of the comment, i stated in the previous comment that some religions are ok and don't think everyone in a religion is evil so to speak, but you still dont get the point of the analogy, and i realy cant be bothered arguing anymore, this is the second night in a row i have got caught up in debates.
i have been planing to watch The Avengers for the first time these past two nights and have forgotten to because of arguments like this.
You can say you won here if you want i dont give a shit but when you fail to grasp a simple analogy twice there realy is no point. I'm away to watch this shit.

do you know what an analogy is? I see none.

Religion isn't the one and only source of morality.

of course not, but it's an absolute morality. You can't question the morality that religion offers when you're religious.

The thing about atheists is that they think that religious, or absolute, morality is wrong and that morality should be fluid, or subjective, depending on the situations that arise.

Sometimes it's good to have that sort of rock in place that keeps nagging you to keep you from straying too far from what is moral when you're being real fluid abot it...

Sacred geometry?
Symbol looks familiar.

Coheed and Cambria, nothing to do with anything :)

Ah. Sweet. I would've panicked if I hadn't recognized a symbol. Lol.

Anyway, I don't particularly agree. I was an atheist up until a year or so ago. I don't follow any popular religion now, but suffice to say I'd suggest you take a look at Spirit Science - The Human History Movie on Youtube. Very...interesting stuff, to say the least. Might change your view on the topic. There are a few other episodes that I'd recommend too, if you like it. If not, I won't hold it against you, lol.

Also, check out stories of Ayahuasca and such. Or anything said to effect the Pineal Gland. Very mind-blowing stuff when combined with knowledge of mythology and religion, if you are into that.

Give some whacko on FJ a chance - At very least, it'll be interesting. Regardless, you didn't present your point like an ass-hat, and I can't argue with that too much.. I think you'll be fine either way, haha.

I'll watch those when I've got a minute. I did an odd diploma program through high school that included a lot of that sort of stuff, so I've got a fairly good grasp (I hope) on a lot of it. Thanks for your input :)

In a way you are right, i mean if there were no black people the starving Africans would not exist and one of the worlds major problems would be at an end.

While what you're saying sounds good on paper, you have to realize that on a larger scale, religion can be harmful (IE any large group of people is going to have more stupid, hateful people in it than a smaller group) on a personal, or community wide scale it has a very useful purpose. I don't know about other places, but I know that in my area Churches give very large donations to several charities. Last month we had a charity drive to raise money to buy mosquito nets for people in Africa to help stop the spread of Malaria and our small church raised enough money to buy over 100 nets in less than a week. Alcohol/drug support groups are normally spearheaded by churches, and religion gives hope and guidance to countless people across the world. The concept of religion isn't bad, it's the people themselves that makes Zealots of themselves which slow progress. And in the present, these Zealots have less and less power. In most states of the US, Evolution is taught. Seperation of Church and State has been fairly successful, and although there are a few things such as right to abortion that are still heavily contested, religious Zealots are basically incapable of accomplishing anything anymore other than pissing people off.

TL;DR, Religion isn't really holding us back anymore, and idiots are going to be idiots regardless of whether religion exists. Also your idea would take centuries to actually carry out.

People can be philanthropic on their own, and I think it seriously brings into doubt the legitimacy of "donations" if they're solicited by a group with the moral influence of a church. As I've tried to say several times now, I'm not interested in the dissolution of all religion per se, but in the dissolution of organised worshipping religions. I believe that this sort of religion is directly in impedance of humanity's progress. I recognise that it might be decades, even centuries, before we truly accomplish what I suggest, but I think it's a step we need to start at some point, and that point may as well be now.

but someone could just say why not everyone belief in this religion

I don't quite understand, sorry.

well we people could say why not everyone become a christian the world will be perfect we would get rid of those guys that only sex, drugs, etc. (but it will never happen) the same way not everyone will become atheist

I realise that it's nearly impossible for the whole world to become irreligious, but I think getting the whole world to become atheist wouldn't be too much to ask. I have a problem with worshipping a deity, not with the concept of religion itself.

I'll tell you what, how about we teach tomorrow's children about true, proven facts only. We don't teach them any sort of religion, nor do we allow them to be indoctrinated by any outside party. We'll see how many of them discover god on their own.

well i'm a christian and I THINK that we should teach them religion if they want it

If that's your stance, then that's fine. The concept needs to be introduced once they have the faculties to make their own decisions, though. You can't tell 8 year olds that sort of thing because they take every word out of your mouth to be gospel truth (pun intended). Start telling them at 14 or 15 about your gods, and we'll see how that works out.

I think the Catholic Church and the head of many religions are very biased and slow down scientific progression, but it isn't religious people, just stupid religious radicals. I understand your point, but many inventions and scientific discoveries have been made by religious people. Half of the members on the Manhattan Project were Jews, including the lead scientist Robert Oppenheimer. While this may have been a controversial project, it was a very progressive one as well. Prepared for the red thumbs.

I haven't got a problem with the people at all. There's nothing wrong with a religious person, and I'm not suggesting that we try and convince everyone to drop their religions. What I would suggest is that there is a problem with being satisfied with a final explanation. Any notion of "God" often gives us answers, and then we stop asking questions about things which a true scientific answer too could be very helpful.

You've no reason to agree with me, but I don't appreciate the ad-hom. I sincerely believe, for humanitarian reasons, that the world would be closer to perfect without the various competing belief systems. Logic tends to progress, progress tends to survival.

Also, I'd like to point out that I thought the absolute majority of this site were interested in tolerance of others, be they gay, religious, atheist, or whatever. I'm surprised I've not been buried in red thumbs already :/

it didnt use to but then people got smart

I am so moving there! In the town where I live everyone is a christian. But not the kind the keeps to themselves. No they fuckin wake me up every sunday to tell me about "God" or "Jesus". THey constantly target me because I'm atheist. At school (Same town) its worse because Religion is compulsory and all they teach is Christianity.

When I was at school, we had to do a christain assembly like...once every 3 months. Boring, but hey. None of us minded. But most people who were christain were mocked when I was at school. Apathists/Atheists ran shit. There is a catholic school nearby where I live, but about 1 in every 30 students are seriously catholic. The rest were just baptised and attent the school because it's nearby.

Its the opposite for me. I get mocked for being atheist (only one who has come out and said it) and every assembly is an hour long "Christian Worship".

Amen.


Pun intended.

Well i guess now we can see why some people have a problem with religion, if you grow up with athiests or Christians constantly mocking you for what you believe, then your most likely gonna grow up hating them.

The simple and short answer is you don't live in America so you wouldn't be able to understand. While I know the majority (this is counting the world) of Christians aren't bible thumping crazies, America has a crazy disproportional number of hard core Christians , so all the other countries don't really understand because they don't have all the crazy fundamentalists we do. Here we call Muslims fundamentalists terrorists while we have Christians killing doctors and blowing up abortion clinics while they get a slap on the wrist. There are fundamentalists in every religion, America is home to the Christian fundamentalists which is why you probably never have and never will actually meet one.

I live in America and most people in my area are very tolerant of Atheists. My best friend is an Atheist, so it's not like it's just that i've never seen anybody been mean to one since I don't know any. I've been his friend since 3rd grade and i've only ever seen one person get into a debate with him about being atheist. Maybe it's different in other parts but I live in Virginia in the mountains, so I'd think it would be worse here than most other places.

I grew up in Texas, it was much different for me. It was a very religious place, abstinence only teaching, they encouraged prayer, it was pretty crazy. I never made my faith known until after high school when I moved away, but I moved to Florida and I found it there too. I moved to Ohio and my husband's coworker wants to convert me now and tells him he needs to get us to church because we have a son and our baby needs Jesus lol. They come out of the woodwork everywhere I found, just keep your eyes out :p

America is pretty anti atheist. In 2006 atheists were the most hated minority, even more hated than muslims. Baring in mind the effect of 9/11 on the american public that is astonishing. That sentiment is still around today although obviously a lot of younger people aren't so religious anymore.

Go look up who Bill O'reilly is, and you'll get a good idea why some people aren't big fans of religion.

But ponies do exist.

Talking Ponies do not.

Touché

Pirates also tromp ninjas. All hail FSM!

I'm a Christian and laugh along with a lot of jokes aimed at Christians. However, the second an atheist claims that religion is stupid, that all Christians are brainwashed, dumb, or seriously claims that God doesn't exist with absolute certainty, then it isn't funny anymore.

This OC, however, was funny.

HERO

Wow, you're stupid how can you say you guys like all christians laugh about it. Sure some do but so do some athiests there are assholes everywhere you go bud.

Without punctuation I have no clue what the hell you're trying to say, or how it's even relevant to my comment

You know what I said, you're just trying to avoid how I proved you wrong.

...hmm nope, nope. Your terrible punctuation makes your post unbelievably confusing. You also did nothing in that post to prove me wrong. I'd be glad to be embarrass you if you actually organize your thoughts into coherent sentences.

You're the only one avoiding anything genius. Rewrite your first comment into something someone can read and I will, otherwise you sound like a 12 year old youtube commenter.

"Wow, you're stupid how can you say you guys like all christians laugh about it. Sure some do but so do some athiests there are assholes everywhere you go bud."

If you think this sounds smarter than anyone besides a kindergartner learning how to write a sentence, then you're seriously mistaken.

The best I can make out is that you said atheists laugh at controversial humor. If that's right then it has no relevance to my post. I said Christians that laugh at other horrible shit, yet can't take a joke about something THEY think is important, then proceed to bitch about it shouldn't be here, are fucking hypocrites. My comment has NOTHING to do with atheists at all. I guess can't read or write English buddy, tough break buddy.

I found a lot of mistakes in your comments too, but I was not an asshole to point them out. What I was trying to say jackass is that you act like every Christian does that yet nobody should laugh at jokes about 9/11. Nobody should and just because someon is athiest doesn't mean they don't have to have morals. You're sadly misguided. There are assholes everywhere for example I just met one.

Listen I don't really care about arguing with you, I'm taking about 20 seconds to write these because you're already wrong. Anyone can laugh at anything they find funny, not laughing about doesn't change the fact that you thought it was funny. I didn't say anything about atheists not having morals. Actually I didn't say ANYTHING about atheists AT ALL. I didn't act like every Christian does, I clearly was talking about the ones who complain about them being made fun of yet are always making fun of someone else. It's hypocrisy at its finest. I don't care about assholes, I care about hypocrites. Now you should either realize everything you've typed has nothing to do with what I said or don't reply. Either way I don't care.

What I find the funniest is that they're raging against a post that's making fun of Bill O'Reilley, not Christianity. Either way, neither Christians nor Atheists are without their insane hypocritical dumbasses, so everyone can shut the hell up.

Anyone from Fox News is a fascist anyway.

I didn't say anything, I just thought it was a humorous pic.

Oh You.

you can't be serious.

It was a joke...

Oh, sorry for the misunderstanding then.

"I came on FJ to laugh, not to talk about religion. "
Then kindly move along.

Some of us do enjoy these debates.

The last time I checked, this site was called Funnyjunk, not Debatejunk...................................................................... ................................................................................ ................................................................................ ...................

It's also not called FeelJunk
Or MorbidJunk

Agreed.

Then go to a forum website about the topic.

The key use of internet content websites such as FJ is entertainment.

You're meant to share content that is funny or awesome.

And I found nothing funny or awesome in the post what so ever.

Just another atheist post to cause a shit-storm once again on the frontpage somehow.







Who the hell is on the vote page?

Maybe some people found it funny.
Maybe they could relate to it.

I dunno. I only thumbed it so it would get closer to front page, so more people see it, and therefore more people comment on it.

I find FJ's layout to be great for debates, and there are plenty of "normal" people here, not just debators. So I get to talk to people from all over the spectrum.

True, there are "normal" people here.

And I do like chatting to some.

But the quantity you speak of...not so much.

I love you too random anon :)

When an object gains a large mass, it will create a gravity field around itself. The larger mass, the more gravity.

we all know that, but what we dont know is why large mass causes gravity.

god doesnt cause gravity dumbass

He didn't say he did dumbass.

there's nothing funny on this website

there's nothing funny about seinfeld

Oh no.
Whatever shall I do should my eyes be subjected to that.
I might die