911

A lot of people died when we got rid of the nazis too. But you're right, we probably shouldn't have done that either. (obvious sarcasm in second sentence)

when you say 'we got rid of the Nazi's too' do you mean america or England because in all fairness it was the Russians that defeated the Nazi's when they took Berlin.
It was a combined effort of the allies to defeat Hitler, with the English (me),Canadian(also me) and Americans (also combined countries) leading the aerial assault and the Russians pushing from Stalingrad all the way to Berlin and raising the soviet flag over the Reichstag effectively ending the war in Europe

The United States was actually on track to reach Berlin before the Soviets.

General Eisenhower ordered General Patton to stop advancing because he didn't want to fight on any German soil that was going to be in the Soviet sector anyway (the future divide of Germany had already been decided prior to invasion).

If the United States hadn't of fought Japan in the Pacific, Russia would have never been able to reinforce their front with Germany because an invasion by Japan was certain.

While it definitely was a combined effort, I think it's fair to say that the United State's entry into the war was necessary for any sort of allied victory.

I just hate the fact that some Americans love to go like "lolz we saved your asses in WW2".

If i make a comment about the WW2's victory, i always find it worthy of mentioning the Sovjet union (yes, i write it Sovjet). Simply because millions died fighting in Stalingrad, and afterwards all the way to Berlin.

I'm not one to talk about helping in the war, i'm Belgian. And Belgium just got screwed over because French people thought the Ardennes would be a natural barrier against vehicles. Clearly mistaken, we were flanked. All we did in this war was help the Allies evacuate themselves.

I hate that because "they" didnt save us during WW2, the people that fought in the war did.
Im not a very respecting person, but using someones elses achivements to make yourself look better is just retarded and shameful.

I'm sorry, but no. Even though the Russians helped end the war, they were still one of the countries that started it, when they decided to split Europe between themselves and Germany. Also, the reason why the Russians lost so many soldiers is because their war tactic was to throw as many lives at the enemy as possible. Also, when Hitler attacked Russia, Stalin was unprepared, so as a defense he started retreating the troops while destroying all food and livestock. However, his citizens weren't told to retreat, and many died of starvation by Stalin's own hand. In fact, many Russian citizens cheered when the Nazi's entered their towns, thinking they were there to save them. This was a major factor in the Russian casualties. As for the battle of Stalingrad, the reason Russia won was because while the Nazi's waited for the winter to end, Russia was receiving weapons and help from the United States.

For the record, I'm a Polish-Canadian, and yes, I'm butthurt. Because, after the war was finished, Russia installed communism in Poland, which was simply adding insult to injury, since even though Germany was the first to invade from the west, Russia invaded from the east only a couple of weeks later. They then tried enforcing the idea that they had "liberated Poland from Nazi occupancy". So no, I believe that Americans deserve more credit for ending WW2.

They told me it was because German supply lines were getting too long and they got "undersupplied", whilst the Russian just fought with sticks to defend their homes.
I know they just won because of sheer numbers, but i've seen a documentary about the battle of Stalingrad and they truly fought until their last breath, with sticks and stones.

the only reason they mentioned in the documentary were supply lines getting way too long for the Germans to survive the winter

When the Germans first attacked, it's true that the Russians fought with all they could, but they were mostly defeated before the winter and we're only performing small night time raids. Before winter came, the German's stationed there asked their higher ranked officers if they could move more west, but Hitler decided to keep them there and promised to resupply them, which was his fatal mistake. Although some of the equipment sent from the US, under the Lend-Lease program, was lost during the German raids, it greatly resupplied the Russian forces, considering they were previously reduced to using knives and bayonets to fight. It was then during operation winter storm, that the Russian's began to retake Stalingrad, right in the middle of winter.
The German's were able to keep sending a surprising amount of supplies during the battle, but it was when the Russians destroyed a German airfield that took a toll on German resupplying. The German's waited for the winter to end and for the supplies to arrive, and ended up being defeated by the Russians.

I cannot stand that whole "We saved your asses in WW2"
The soviets done most of the work, and from the other end us brits had the best navy at the point and lost a fuck-ton of men fighting them back.
America came in closer towards the end and claimed victory.
Yes, they may have saved us, but if the Triple entente (Cannot remember correct spelling) weren't around, America also wouldn't have stood a chance

we also sent nearly 200,000,000$ in supplies to aid britain, france, and russia during ww2. America actually had spent the most money during ww2.

If it weren't for the Sovjets America would've just been overrun by everything. It's not like America can fend off both Japan, Italy and Nazi Germany at once.

The Soviets were a tremendous help, but it's not like America didn't have enough people to do that. The Soviet Union mobilized 20 million soldiers during the war, which is a hell of a lot. However, the United States deployed 16.4 million soldiers during the war, with France being in 3rd with 5 million. Due to the Russian purges however, the USSR lost 6.5 million in Barborossa, while Germany lost 500 thousand.

More to the point, during the war Japan mobilized 7.4 million, Italy mobilized 4.5 million, and Germany mobilized 10.8 million. In the Pacific theatre, Japanese losses far outnumbered American losses, and the Italians surrendered soon after Italy was invaded. So with a 2/1 Kill Death Ratio for Japan, and less than half of the Italian soldiers actually fighting the US, assuming a 1/1 KD for Italians v Americans (which was likely not the case) that leaves 16.4 million Americans to fight 16.75 axis troops. In May of 1944, the invention of the P51D-Mustang decimated German Air power, and the United States was producing over 100 fighters a day in March of 1944,much more than the combined Germany, Italian, and Japanese factories could produce.

Although it is purely speculation, it would have been possible for the United States to win the war by itself. Assuming the powers didn't attack a single other country which would have wasted their manpower. And if they hadn't, there would be no need for America to attack in the first place.

Add to that the fact that many Japanese soldiers would have never gotten to see combat due to use sinking their transports and letting them die out, which is what happened in the actual war.

But to what end?

That war would rage on endlessly unless one of the nations comes out with a more powerful weapon/vehicle/tactic against the others.
And wasn't Germany building long-range rockets? Or were those finished? Because we haven't discussed that yet during History.

Germany had 3 Vengance weapons in production during the war, but only the V1 and V2 were completed. One of them being a self guided plane armed with explosives, and the other being a self guided missle. But they didn't have the range to hit the US, and barely had the range to hit Britain from France/low countries. But yeah the war would have taken MUCH longer and probably would have lasted until one side got the nuke (or any Germany's case until they actually reached a nuke to the US)

Exactly.
The tripe Entente did most of the work.

Well fuck, never thought i'd run into someone on the internet who knew a think about WW2.

a thing*

I done History 2 years ago at school.
All about WW2, I still remember a lot of it because I loved the subject.

Two words. Pacific Campaign. Who was going to fight that if the U.S. didn't?

Britain had the best navy using American ships
lend-lease, bro, lend-lease

America didn't get rid of the Nazis, you idiot

You contributed 7 pilots to the Battle of Britain and nuked Japan. Well done

Canada started fighting in WW2 before the Americans did.

Fuck you

They're both bad. We all hate what America does in the Middle East. That includes most Americans. Probably a lot of the people in those towers hate what America going into wars

As for the person comparing WW2 to wars like Iraq, go read a book and do us all a favour

Blame the U.S Government. Hell no one wanted to go fight a war.

Nice said brother I don't blame the citizens for the war but the government.

Actually a lot of people did. Everyone was so overwhelmed by the horribleness of 9/11 that they wanted the heads of who was behind it.

Let us clear this up, when i say "America" i do actually mean the American government, but the people are just as much to blame... or not to blame... considering Americans are fed nothing but war propaganda supporting what the war effort is doing.

while i admit there is a lot of propaganda, most of us dont listen to it. in fact, if people in america gave a shit, then wed be out of the middle east. but since most people let our government go unchecked, they can do whatever and get away with it.

I am american, I live in New York, and I agree with you. What we have done in the middle east is worse than 9/11. We need to pay more attention to our government, without question.

You are not an American. Lies. They are still living in Stone age. Have some patriotism.

You're going to tell me that I am not an american on the grounds of because I can admit top my countries wrong doings? Are you fucking kidding me? I'll have some patriotism when the rest of this country has some insight.

Yeah, we shouldn't have gone to war with Japan either huh? Even though they slaughtered their own people. BAD AMERICANS

So they slaughtered their own people and America dropped some nukes to help the people ?

Yes. The bombs ended the war.

It seems to me that every person that attacks America on the internet is praised by the thousands. America is a good and bad country, but i'm sure yours is no better.

Fuck you buddy. Show some fucking respect. Having two of the most known buildings in New York is a pretty big deal. I dont' know where your from but imagine if one your most noticeable buildings got taken down. Ya Fuck your shit.

yeah we did awful things to innocent people in the middle east, that doesn't mean we can't be upset when innocent citizens die here, too.

uncyclopedia.wikia.com/wiki/I_Can%27t_Believe_It%27s_Not_Terrorism

America has KKK also an extremist group so stop talking bullshit.

"It's their own fault for nurturing a culture of violence and intolerance that allowed extremist groups to flourish." I'm talking about this part.

The KKK doesn't fly planes into buildings in countries that it has no reason to attack.

Yep, keep watching American war propaganda and keep believing what you hear.
you ignorant fuck wit.

Keep thumbing me down, it makes your opinion more valid...
Or just keep insulting the grammar i have used in an argument over the internet.
As we all know perfect English makes an argument all the more valid.

Well i am glad i could warm you up.
it must be cold where you live.

It's called war, not tea time.

Let the terrorists win? they want you the fuck out of their countries.
that is why 9/11 happened in the first place.

And even if America left the area, they would turn on Isreal, Kuwait, or some other neighboring country. Maybe no one remembers Operation Desert Shield where America came in to defend the sovereignty of Kuwait and other allies, but I do. You act like nothing good has come of the intervention, when there has been progress made. Yes innocent people have died, and that's tragic. But in order to gain something, sacrifice is necessary. And the terrorists and extremists factions are just as much, if not more so, to blame for the killing of civilians in a war zone.

I wonder how eager you'd be if the sacrifices had to be made in your part and the war fought in your country and just how tragic the lost lives would be then.

We went in to stop all the in fighting in the area, especially with Muslim countries always attacking Israel. The whole region was a warzone before we ever got there.

the fact israel is getting attacked that much is their own fault, they claimed some land that belonged to Palestina.
I mean, you wouldn't be happy if I walked into your house and claimed half of the rooms for myself, would you?

And before that, the Jews claimed it for themselves. It's a pretty vicious cycle in that area; everyone claims to have claimed it years before anyone else, when in all reality it has changed hands more times than anyone can really remember. And they didn't claim it; the United Nations set that land aside for the Jewish people as their homeland after World War 2 and the Holocaust came to light. That was a joint decision by the UN, not just the USA.

And they do not want Americas help.
your country needs to stop trying to be the worlds police because violence is not solved by more violence.

And you have to realize that sitting by and watching solves just as much as violence does. Letting rape happen because violence doesn't solve anything doesn't stop the act. If anything it encourages it to continue.

So you are saying that Iraq was attacked because of terrorists?

The war in Iraq costed about 1 trillion dollar you really think America is spending so much money on "peace" ?

Grow up dude America is doing it for it's own benefits.
(ps: I bet America's next war is with Iran. I'm wondering what kind of bullshit they are gonna use this time to start a war)

I just wanted to point out that this is why the people of Uganda were so pissed off with the Kony movement earlier this past year. Coincidentally, they have oil and the Congo has the minerals they use in cell phones and computers. Africa would fucking hate the Ugandans if American soldiers make their way in there.

Do you understand the US has troops in africa

Why thumb this guy down if he's correct? He's stating a fact, not contributing to the argument.

People are strange on funnyjunk

Well then tell me what you think America is getting out of all of this.

Control because they are getting paranoid.

I'm not paranoid. I'm confident that we could kick any country's ass.

And there is no problem with that.

You must watch fox news.

Are you fucking kidding me, the Taliban and Al-qaida are in Afghanistan/Pakistan not Iraq.

Nice try.

Worth it

i lol'd

You are not a funny guy.

...his name? God damn FJ.

I didn't capitalize. God help me...

They wouldn't be speaking Japanese you idiot, if anything we'd be speaking German

That's pretty fucking obvious. My point was that the Germans were more powerful than the Japanese

The Japanese were weak

Nope they were pretty fucking weak

Japanese Navy = 290,000 personnel

USA Navy = 4,200,000 personnel

Work out the differenece, if you can, retard

i understand your point... but... japan can mourn and we wont bug them for it.

Implying america is/was the only country to occupy foreign regions killing hundreds of civilian and non-civilian people

So did the UN, primarily due to America's involvement first hand. What happened to isolationist?

Because every other time we attempted isolationism, we were dragged into conflict any way. Wether it be by direct attack or allied nations begging for assistance, America is drawn into war.
But, the way I see things is that, even if we didn't intervene in modern international affairs (such as Somalia and shit) then we'd be criticized for not doing enough
Everyone's a critic.

America nuked Hiroshima because Japan attacked America first.

America bombed them becuase they could, even you must know that " The greatest weapon is one that never has to be used "...

So why were Americans in Vietnam then? if you wish to bring it up?

To stop the spread of communism? is that right?

I agree. we shouldn't have fucked with them in the first place. It didn't have to be our problem and what they were doing was none of our business. Now we are wrapped up in this never ending war and more countries are really starting to hate what we're doing, especially Russia, China, and Iran. This is ww3 just waiting to happen.
I also think it's really stupid of people to think that if you attack another country they aren't going to attack back. 9/11 was retaliation for the invasion and occupation of Iraq. Another less obvious and not as good example was pearl harbor. In 1883 the US sent navy ships into tokyo harbor and forced Japan to enter trade with them. Japan couldn't defend themselves because they didn't have a navy. Japan built up a huge navy after that. Before the attacks on pearl, Roosevelt moved the fleet there to purposely threaten Japan again. Japan decided it wasn't going to be bullied around anymore and decided to knock them out. Sure the Japanese weren't very good people back then, but it was our fault once again.

My first thought exactly.

relevant

There's such a thing as middle ground. You don't need to involved in some things.

This

Did you see any 'funny' Disney Channel sitcoms there? I didnt.....

how did you mention "funny" and "disney sitcoms" in the same sentence without exploding?

I am immune to bad sitcoms, that's the trick.

This happened ~10 years ago.
We can still grieve if we want, quit being a dick.

actually, japan has numerous memorials dedicated to Hiroshima and Nagasaki bombings. also, that happened long before internet.

he said post. as in post on the internet.

Yeah, that's what chazzy said also. He's saying that people don't post stuff about the bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki because it occurred 70 years ago, long before the internet was around.

**unncommon thumbs up chazzjoel's comment**

Well, I meant posts as in internet posts. Of course they're going to have some form of real life monuments commemorating the bombings, but I meant that you don't get "Remember Hiroshima and Nagasaki" posts all over the inernet...

I see what you're saying, but 9/11 started a war, Hiroshima ended one.
P.s. The Jap's knew that they could have prevented the bombings, they just chose to not to. 9/11 was an attack that the United Stated had no control over. Plus the U.S. has both apologized on numerous occasions and has paid both money and man hours to try to make things better.

I still understand what you're trying to say though.

I also think that this is honoring the heroism of the N.Y. Fire Department. Nothing wrong with that.

there was way more options of ending the war without that much civilian damage. Just think of it as, you're gov't is being stupid, and then you get nuked the fuck out of and you had nothing to do about it.

Your* and there's a terminology called 'Acceptable Losses'. It means that one thing is sacrificed for the greater good. The war could have went on, could have killed more and more people, ruining more and more lives, but they seen a way out. It might not be clear to you, but I'll give you an analogy: It'd be like two guys fighting to the death, they're both battered and weak, one man cuts the others foot off so he can't fight, the man continues swinging his blade at the other. So the man cuts one of his hands off. The man can still fight, but they've accepted that if the fight goes on, they'll both die.

Well Japan was crippling already. With the countless amount of B-29 bombings, America would have had things wrapped up in days. Japan literally had little to no military left.

That's where you're misinformed friend. Many people died on either side, too many people, and Japan wasn't going to let go of that so easily. The bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki was a last resort. Even before they bombed Nagasaki the Americans begged the Japanese to surrender. They Bombed Hiroshima and begged once more, then threatened to bomb Tokyo. The Japs finally gave up.

Trust me when I say that it was necessary. I have family that died in the bombing of Nagasaki.

Actually, more bombings were planned. America had 7 nukes ready and was ready to take out the Japanese race. Someone in the military stepped up and stopped them at two. Japan was also ready to surrender before the Nukes. Look this up, it's probably what they never taught you in schools.

Well I take back the last part, but Japan didn't surrender until after Hiroshima, the Americans just didn't get it until it was to late. And back to that analogy, the Japanese were planning to do the same to the United States. What about all of their bombings, sinking of ships, and countless other tragedies towards the U.S. (i.e. Pearl Harbor).

That's just one occasion. If America did that to them, it would be heroic, if you do it to America, it's a war crime.

Well considering that Pearl Harbor was the start of the war and that no prior conflicts are recorded. There was more occasions also, maybe you should research them.

Actually, America kind of forced Japan into war. While not necessarily forcing them to commit atrocities and Pearl Harbour, the US did use huge amount of sanctions of oil and a boycott of any Japanese goods, ensuring that the Japanese economy suffered greatly and increasing popularity for the incredibly militaristic and nationalistic factions within the government. Imagine today if the EU, OPEC and Canada stopped exporting oil to America and began to boycott American goods - you're kiiding yourself if you don't think America would go to war. War already looms with Iran due to its threats to block the Straits of Hormuz, and that's just a drop in the bucket compared to the fact that almost all of Japans oil was provided by the US...

If they were to stop exporting other countries it would be ignorant, they'd loose money and hurt themselves. But if that were to happen we would simply start drilling our own oil (which I'd hate to say it, but Obama is right on that part). Japans hand wasn't forced to do anything. They over reacted and started a war because of it.

While the US does have oil, Japan is a largely resourceless island, and doesn't have a source of oil, meaning that it would be further pressured. Besides, how is it ignorant for other countries to stop exporting to the US, yet the US stopping exporting to Japan wasn't? Destroying a nation's economy is a far better reason for it to go to war than for the reasons the US gave for invading Iraq and Afghanistan...

The US stopped exporting to Japan because it stopped drilling. We found it to be easier to import oils rather than to attempt to make a profit off of it (it's also dangerous, i.e. the exon oil spill). Japan could have found someone else to have purchased the oil from.

At the time 80% of Japan's oil came from the US - it's impossible for a Nation to completely overhaul its economy overnight, it takes several years at least....

Just because only a few people died relative to other attacks doesn't minimize their importance. The 9/11 attacks have still had an absolutely incredible impact on the direction of America in the last decade

I never said they weren't important. I just stated that akhilleus shouldn't assume that the death toll is the most important aspect of a tragedy. But yes, people do need to move on from the tragedy (probably not to racism though, as that's something you really can't kill), as dwelling on it really brings nothing good nowadays.

yeah actually your right

How the fuck can you generalise every single Japanese person as an "evil bastard?" That type of blatant jingoism is fucking retarded. The only sins of the civilians killed in Nagasaki and Hiroshima was to have been born Japanese and to have lived there. Sure, Japan comitted a lot of atrocities, but blame that on the military commanders and the government of the country at the time. The citizens and civilians of a nation are scarecely to be blamed for the sins of its leaders, especially when the leaders were there undemocratically, and used political murders and extrajudicial executions in order to maintain power...

And the civilians of Hiroshima and Nagasaki were the ones committing the atrocities? Collective guilt's a retarded concept - by that logic you're responsible for the deaths of civilians in Iraq and Afghanistan...

with the amount of feel posts on todays front page i have a feeling that alot of these douchebags are profiting from the dead

Hey, fellow new yorker from brooklyn here, I know how you feel. I was just in kindergarden, I remember being able to look out the classroom window and just seeing smoke in the void where the towers used to occupy. My teacher was in a panic. My parents picked me up and I remember seeing burning papers in the sky. When I got home my parents had their eyes glued to the tv set. So sad.

Yeah, it was a weird feeling, especially because the morning had been so bright and sunny.
I can't imagine what it was like for you being five or so. I'm sure it was a little more confusing but just as much as a shock.

I was 5 when it happened. Never forget. I was in school and I could see the smoke billowing outside the classroom windows. The teachers were in uproar and panic. My parents came to pick me up early. I remember looking out the window of the minivan and seeing papers and ash fluttering in the air and landing on the pavement. When I got home my parents were mesmerized by the television. If I recall correctly my mother was crying. Seriously thought these 9/11 jokes are fucked up. I was born and raised in New York. I knew people who lost their lives in the attack and I really cannot understand how people can be so hearless as to make jokes about the attack. Never forget 9/11/2001.

I live about 15 commuter minutes from Lower Manhattan, many residents in my town work there. Many saw the incident unfold, 10 were lost that day. That evening we had a service in town hall to give our condolences (we didn't know how many were lost at that time). I saw one of my classmates crying and holding on to his father tightly, he lost his mother on the North Tower. The father stood there and and was trying to be strong for the both of them.

To sum it up, sometimes you don't realize what you got until it's gone.

I agree completely, I can't even imagine what it was like for everyone who really did lose a loved one.

But sometimes, even the best of things can come up in the worst moments. This video gave me faith in humanity.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=NlRTyt6dALM

what hes basically saying is that what if it were your parents that died from a terrorist attack would you get over it?

I have, but like many other things I've experienced I still look back on them from time to time and remember it. It brings me comfort, whether it be a beloved family pet who was brutally killed or a tragedy that effected thousands upon millions of people, I still think about it because those are events in my life that are important to me, no matter how far they are in the past. I believe I'm allowed that much.

People like you are why nobody likes us.

well its not like people were happy about it, i mean idiots were, but most rational people were just like "its bad, but many worse things happened and everyone forgot about them, why should we care about this then" and i think the same way

And that's a perfectly acceptable way to think. Me being a true American I will never forget that day.