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#184 - chiefrunnyjeans (04/27/2012) [-]
That's because the catholic church is already on the side of science in general. This is because we believe that God created everything and the way it functions. So if for example science proved the theory of evolution exactly without a doubt, we would already be on their side because that's how god designed cells and organisms to function. No offense to atheist but if you think about it, calling yourself an atheist is just calling yourself ignorant. All this didn't come from nothing you know. You can still believe everything about science and its theories, but not believing in a first cause (One Original creator/ higher power) like the atheist Aristotle is just ignorant. And if you want to bring the evil in this world into this argument, I have a pretty clear answer. God gave us free will because he knows that it's not love if we don't choose to love and believe in him and he didn't want us to be mindless robots, even though there would be permanent peace.
User avatar #499 to #184 - zicamox (04/27/2012) [-]
I'm like the 45434th reply to this but I feel the need to add my two cents.

Really? The Catholic church is on the side of science? Read a history book, dude. Just because your church finally accepts scientific findings that should've been accepted decades ago, doesn't meant they're on science's "side".

All you have described is the god of the gaps; that science is merely a long drawn out explanation with god behind it. You merely calling people ignorant for not merely attributing everything they find to god is ridiculous.

Evolution can never be "exactly proven without a doubt". That's not how science works, and at this point we can't find anything like that. But it's been heavily suggested with mountains of empirical evidence already. Yet I guarantee that if just a little more evidence comes forward, to the point where its even more ridiculous to deny evolution, you're gonna hop on the bandwagon with your church and be like "we were on science's side the whole time!".

Couldn't have god given us free will in a way where we still always choose to love and accept him and not end up burning in hell? Why not? He is god after all..
#470 to #184 - dovahkiiin (04/27/2012) [-]
First of all, the Catholic Church wasn't always on the side of Science. They caused the Dark Ages and rejected intellectuals such as Nicholas Copernicus, Galileo Galilei, and Giordano Bruno. "If science proved the theory of Evolution without a doubt, we would believe it." Theory in a scientific sense is something backed up by evidence and the amount of evidence behind Evolution is immense. Evidence such as the fossil record, location differentiation, and genetic mutations all stand to support Evolution. The reason it isn't accepted world wide is because it contradicts with people's religious belief systems, the evidence doesn't matter to them, creationists don't care to understand it, they only care to deny it. If you argue that Genesis is supposed to be taken as a metaphor, that would mean Adam's original sin is a metaphor, which is why Jesus sacrificed himself, making it meaningless. How dare you call atheists "ignorant" for simply taking the default position and not believing something until evidence is provided? The best explanation to the creation of the Universe is the Big Bang because it has substantial evidence such as CBM (Cosmic Background Radiation discovered by Robert Wilson) and obviously the expanding Universe, however it does have many unanswered questions. Believing that a higher power caused the Big Bang is not an argument for a Christian, it is an argument for a Deist, who believe there is a higher power but he does not care for us whatsoever, "it" simply served as the catalyst of the Big Bang. Your belief (Christian I am assuming) is based off of a male human God creating everything within 6 days, CREATED the first pair of humans, they sinned and we all inherited it despite the Bible claiming. "The son shall not bear the inequities of the father", we are damned to hell unless we accept his son as a sacrifice. That is greatly different, inaccurate, and much more specific then just believing a higher power started the Big Bang. Continued
#529 to #470 - dovahkiiin (04/27/2012) [-]
If you're going to cherry pick the things out of the Bible that are compatible with Science and Morality, then you might as well just make your own branch of Christianity. The Problem of Evil answered with Free Will? I hope you realize how many times that has been provided and refuted. Human actions aren't the cause of all the death and despair on Earth. Earthquakes, viruses, tsunami's, hurricanes, floods, etc. 17 innocent children die every minute, 9 million die every year before their fifth birthday, much if not most of this is caused by non-human action. Not to mention the majority of human problems are created cause of religion. Atheists ignorant? I'll tell you what is ignorant, believing that this whole Universe was created just for us. That is one of the most pitiful beliefs I can think of because of the arrogance, conceitedness, and ignorance of the cosmos. Not to mention that it is constantly trying to kill us. So many things are capable of annihilating this planet. Our sun becoming a red giant, gamma ray bursts, magnetic reversal during solar wind, and most of all black holes. The default position is disbelief until proven not belief until disproven. Religion was clearly made out of fear. Understanding science truly releases you from the grasp of superstition and religion, it's no wonder 93% of scientists are atheists. Thank you for your time and attention.
#561 to #529 - realyboredguy (04/28/2012) [-]
Actually warmist are now trying to blame earthquakes, hurricanes, floods and tsunamis on humans. Oh and the death related to humans I think atheist has a large part too. What about Mao? With 40 millions deaths. He was a commie, so he was probably atheist. But yeah atheist don't kill in the names of atheism (Well I think). Religious people though, like you said, the Christians killed non Christians during the dark age. Now it's the Muslim extremist we are dealing with. ''Kill the infidels, ALA AKBAR!''.
#566 to #561 - dovahkiiin (04/28/2012) [-]
I fail to see how anyone can find out a way to blame earthquakes, hurricanes, tsunami's, and floods on humans since we know how they are caused by natural forces. However, even if they could be proven to be from humans, destructive forces on a stellar scale are trying to destroy our whole solar system. Black holes, gamma ray bursts, solar wind, even our own Sun is going to take it with us when it dies. The nearest galaxy, Andromeda, is on a collision course with ours which could possibly hurl our planet into deep space when it does. Not to mention that we now understand that the Universe will die when the dark energy that is expanding it expands it so much that everything will be too far from each other and stars and galaxies will die out. You're correct that dictators such as Mao and Stalin existed but you are also correct that they didn't kill cause of their Atheism. Stalin did however support a group called the Militant Godless that were an anti-religious group of workers, peasants, and youth that wonder to embrace a secular scientific mindset and used violence in some cases to achieve that. Mao and Stalin are responsible for many deaths, but as you stated, it was not because of their Atheism, it was because of their desire for change. Mao and Stalin both built their countries up quite well despite the large sacrifice. The abominations on religions side are specifically because of religion. 9/11, the Inquisition, Dark Ages, and the Holocaust. If it was a matter of live and let live where religious people did not interfere with science, then I would be fine with religious people's beliefs, but sadly that's not the case.
#577 to #566 - realyboredguy (04/28/2012) [-]
I don't believe it either, warmist are lying to fill in their paycheck. True, large asteroids could crash on the earth, and we need to find a solution for that. Did you know that some scientific say there is a slime chance an asteroid crash into the earth in 2035(or around that date)? And yeah I agree with the rest of your comment, except, pretty sure those dictators were more a disadvantage then an advantage for china and Russia. Communist never succeeds.
#522 to #470 - realyboredguy (04/27/2012) [-]
You're right on allot of things, but there is one you're wrong about. The dark age was created by people using Christianity to control people. If Christianity would have never existed, they would of used something else. Also, Christianity had good impact. Allot of great mind were christians.
#541 to #522 - dovahkiiin (04/27/2012) [-]
You just stated that the Dark Ages were a result of people using Christianity to control people. What group do you think was doing most of the controlling, the Church. It was the Church and the religious officials that refused to change their doctrines despite being disproven by scientific evidence. Now if the Church and Christianity hadn't existed then you are correct, another religion would have been used. Yes, Christians have had some great minds, but the ones related to science such as Isaac Newton had little choice, since being Atheist back then was so hard. Now however, we understand evolution, a lot of the cosmological structure, and we're finally starting to understand the beginning of the Universe. I assure you that if the scientific minds of Christianity had the ideas we've come to know now, they would have second thoughts, at most, they would be deists like Voltaire and the Founding Fathers.
#560 to #541 - realyboredguy (04/28/2012) [-]
Good, point, and I like the pictures you post with your comments =O.
F*cking love spaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaccccccccccccccccccccccceeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!
#572 to #560 - dovahkiiin (04/28/2012) [-]
Thank you very much, good discussion we had. I'm off to bed, have a great night

User avatar #554 to #541 - dovahkiiin (04/27/2012) [-]
At least instead of at most
User avatar #331 to #184 - jelllofish (04/27/2012) [-]
okay, first off, i didnt read all that. 2nd, both cretionist and evolutionist theories break the laws of science, "energy can not be created or destroyed" so why are we learning it in science class if it breaks the science laws?
User avatar #298 to #184 - BBQpigeon (04/27/2012) [-]
Atheism - ignorance? No. "God" did not design the way cells and organisms function, mutation did. Sure you could say "God" created the big bang but thats all. Everything else happened by itself, without any involvement of a higher power. Everything you see around you was created in interstellar fusion. This has been proven. I also use "god" in quotation marks because assuming that there is only one god is extremely ignorant. What ever happened to the other 2869 that have been recorded in history.

Also, believing in a god is extremely pointless if you are intelligent and mentally sane. You shouldn't need a set of rules telling you that shouldn't kill or steal. Religion has and still is slowing us as a race down. We don't need it at all. Why can't people just enjoy their life and contribute to society rather than praying for **** all to happen. Two hands in work does achieves more that a thousand hands in prayer could ever do.

Calling atheists ignorant because they believe in pure facts and evidence is the most ignorant thing I have ever heard. Just accept life for what it is and deal with it. Our purpose in life is to help the continuity of our race, just like every other living organism.

You can't say there has to be an intelligent designer because then what made the intelligent designer and so on.

I don't dislike religious people because they believe in different things to me, I dislike them because they spend their time arguing about useless **** that doesn't benefit anyone or anything at all when they could be doing something that is remotely useful.

Also "God" didn't give us free will. Being sentient beings gives us free will. Snails have free will for ***** sake.
#414 to #298 - realyboredguy (04/27/2012) [-]
I will response to each paragraph.

1-Yes, you're 100% right on that

2- I)Well, there is no proof that God exist, but there is no proof that God doesn't exist, so you can still be mentally sane and believe in a God. And I know a christian who is an engineer, so yeah I think he is mentally sane.
II)True, not killing or stealing is common sense, but it's not used to inform people of what is right and wrong, murderers know what they do is wrong. It's to make them scared of hell, so that they will think twice before dong something wrong, because they are scared of hell, which maybe doesn't exist, but the belief of the place help us keep order.
III) Now it might slow us down, but before it helped us, like with the creation of hospitals.
IV) Yeah praying most likely doesn't do much.
3- Yes, indeed

4-Good point.

5-Well not all of them do that, but some of them blow themselves up instead of contributing to society, but that's a particular group, but let's not go there, because it would be ''politically incorrect''.

6-True, but snails don't have free will. They are to stupid to make their own choices. They just follow their instinct of eat, sleep, reproduced, and so on.
User avatar #491 to #414 - BBQpigeon (04/27/2012) [-]
We still follow the very same instincts.
#248 to #184 - tobinian **User deleted account** has deleted their comment [-]
#299 to #248 - CIS White Male (04/27/2012) [-]
not knowing how god is created does not mean he does not exist... we just dont know how.. maybe ask him for you go to heaven ;] .
#296 to #248 - iamphoenix (04/27/2012) [-]
The universe needs a creator because it is finite and had a definite beginning, but not necessarily a source. We know that 14 billion years ago, a singularity expanded tremendously in a very short period of time and has been expanding ever since. But we don't know how it even got to that point, or WHY it did.
#317 to #296 - CIS White Male (04/27/2012) [-]
how do you know it's finite? how do you know that this universe hasn't fully expanded and been recontacted into a singularity before? Also, the reason the singularity formed was gravity, that much is mostly agreed upon.
#393 to #317 - iamphoenix (04/27/2012) [-]
We know the universe is finite because we know it has a definite beginning as we know that if there were re-bangs, there can't have been very many. If it did, it would be come more and more chaotic each time it happened.
#242 to #184 - CIS White Male (04/27/2012) [-]
The universe did not come from nothing, it exploded from a singularity of extremely dense mass; the same way that supernovas work, but on an extraordinary level creating the universe.

I am glad you believe that science isn't some thing that we just came up with to hate on or make religious people question their beliefs (I still don't see how anyone thinks that) but, calling Atheists ignorant? That I can't stand to hear.

We have been given absolutely no reason to believe that there is anything after death other than to biodegrade and be used in the cycle of life.

What's worse is that we are always told to prove that god doesn't exist if we believe that he doesn't, when the "weight of proof" lies squarely on the Christians shoulders

But ya, I would only say that you and may each believe whatever we wish, but NEVER call someone ignorant just because they have not been given any proof that something exists
User avatar #266 to #242 - mylittlebrony (04/27/2012) [-]
i am a christian, and i believe that atheist are the least ignorant over any religion
#301 to #266 - CIS White Male (04/27/2012) [-]
thank you, I wasn't even gonna comment until i read that he said atheists were synonymous with ignorant, you could say my jimmies were more than a little rustled
thank you, I wasn't even gonna comment until i read that he said atheists were synonymous with ignorant, you could say my jimmies were more than a little rustled
User avatar #238 to #184 - himynameismike (04/27/2012) [-]
And the innocent children who are born with terrible diseases or die young? The Holocaust? "Everything happens for a reason" ***************** . If your God believes that a 3 year old dying of cancer is all part of his wondrous heavenly plan, then I'd sooner praise Satan.
User avatar #463 to #238 - mylittlebrony (04/27/2012) [-]
christians believe little children go to heaven
#282 to #238 - CIS White Male (04/27/2012) [-]
satan killed millions of people but not directly ..
people who die *young* they didnt just die standing in there place.. there is a reason children got a hit by a car, an accident you cant blame god beacus a drunk driver ran over a 3years old kid...
User avatar #293 to #282 - himynameismike (04/27/2012) [-]
But is it a drunk person's fault that a toddler is diagnosed with cancer? No. That's all your wonderful God. And to the best of my Biblical knowledge, Satan killed very few people, if any. "God" killed many.
#307 to #293 - CIS White Male (04/27/2012) [-]
a kid diagnosed with cancer also have reason maybe the mother is smoking ,his family is smoking ...
User avatar #322 to #307 - himynameismike (04/27/2012) [-]
I have a family friend whose child died of brain cancer. She was 7. Not all cancer is caused by smoking you moron. Her mother never drank or smoked, and neither did anyone in the house. And even if there was a smoker around the house, and that somehow caused it, what is your God's message then? If you smoke, your children deserve to die? You're ******* pathetic, and so is your miserable religion.
#377 to #322 - CIS White Male (04/27/2012) [-]
im sure you can notice the *maybe* in what i said ...
im not sure what you want to say what do you mean *whats your gods message*? someone smoking he got cancer ... what your saying is *why did god gave him cancer when he smoke? ******* god...* what did you expect?
when someone got eaten buy a tiger you dont blame god for him going to the tiger
you dont blame god when someone does not watch his health he get sick ofc he well get sick now your blamming god for geting sick? ok what if there is no god what now? are diseases ok now? now you have nobody to blame.... you have one strange logic.
#558 to #377 - realyboredguy (04/28/2012) [-]
Indeed, he has one strange logic. It's like a murderer (satan) shoot somebody (the person who got cancer at age 7) and the police (God) doesn't do anything. So the persons brother (himynameismike) team up with the murderer so get revenge on the police. Lol wut?
#365 to #322 - realyboredguy (04/27/2012) [-]
Hmmm, why would it need to be God? What says the children's who get cancer get cancer doesn't get it because of Satan? It's maybe Satan, not God.
User avatar #407 to #365 - himynameismike (04/27/2012) [-]
ANON USES IGNORE. ARE YOU STUPID? I said the child was in a house of non smokers. She got brain cancer and died. Smoking doesn't even cause brain cancer you **** .

And to realyboredguy, If your "all powerful God" is letting Satan kill little children, that's one more reason that religion is ********
#555 to #407 - CIS White Male (04/28/2012) [-]
stop playing stupid on me smoking does not cause brain cancer but other things does smoking is an examble for *cancer*... your here to insult not to talk i didnt insult you you shouldnt insult me either.
#424 to #407 - realyboredguy (04/27/2012) [-]
Well that's the thing. He probably isn't all powerful. Nothing proves that if their is a supernatural being that he is all powerful.
#426 to #424 - realyboredguy (04/27/2012) [-]
*there not their
User avatar #235 to #184 - poutinesalad ONLINE (04/27/2012) [-]
ignorance is not knowing, you dont know for sure, you BELIEVE it.

You're an ignorant **** .
User avatar #243 to #235 - himynameismike (04/27/2012) [-]
Christians are the ultimate example of ignorance yet here this one is calling atheists ignorant. It's ridiculous.
#433 to #243 - realyboredguy (04/27/2012) [-]
Well technically, any kind of religion is the result of ignorance, not just Christianity.
User avatar #233 to #184 - nichsell (04/27/2012) [-]
Sorry but calling atheism ignorant is kind of ignorant yourself. Even though it is entirely possible that a deity is the cause of all existence, and everything that works in the universe, you have no proof of this deity. So atheist's don't believe in it, until you can prove there is one. There are ignorant people all over the world that are religious and non-religious, you can't just call one belief ignorant, without calling all beliefs ignorant.
User avatar #237 to #233 - wikit (04/27/2012) [-]
That's exactly what I said. Thank you. :)
User avatar #232 to #184 - itsjulia (04/27/2012) [-]
If there has to be an original being, who created God?
#226 to #184 - CIS White Male (04/27/2012) [-]
User avatar #225 to #184 - volleys (04/27/2012) [-]
I do not believe in a a first cause such as God. It isn't as likely that there was some magical being that created everything; the Big Bang is much more probable.
User avatar #240 to #225 - tangiers (04/27/2012) [-]
His point is that something somewhere had to create it all. If the big bang did happen, what caused it? How did each individual factor get there in the first place? That's what he's saying. No matter what you believe, there has to be something that started it all. In his case, it's God.
#442 to #240 - realyboredguy (04/27/2012) [-]
Who created God? ''Himself, obviously, or he existed for eternity''
Then, the universe itself could of existed forever, right?
#255 to #240 - CIS White Male (04/27/2012) [-]
ya, but he's calling other people ignorant for not believing something that he has no proof of, making him just as ignorant.....
User avatar #268 to #255 - tangiers (04/27/2012) [-]
I agree with you that ignorant was a bad choice of words.
User avatar #245 to #240 - volleys (04/27/2012) [-]
Yes, but you can't explain how God was made. The thing about the Big Bang is that we don't know what happened before it, we just know that is makes our universe ever expand.
User avatar #261 to #245 - tangiers (04/27/2012) [-]
The difference is that, no matter how silly you think it is, Christians have an explanation about how we're all here. Again, you might think it's ridiculous, but nevertheless we have an explanation. We don't have to explain how God was made, because it says He was here in the beginning. Not a thorough explanation, but we aren't supposed to know every inch of information, it's impossible. However, Christianity does have an answer for how humanity came to be, how the earth came to be, and even how good and evil (and our reactions to either ones) came to be. Most of all, they explain how everything came to be, which is something that only religions can do.
#288 to #261 - CIS White Male (04/27/2012) [-]

ok, ok, ******** , THAT, is NOT an explination! That is saying, "We were told this happened, so it happened, just don't think about it".

and this is why people drive themselves crazy trying to debate against some people; they will not even allow themselves to think that anything other than god could have created the universe.

It's just really close-minded and ******* drives us up the wall!
User avatar #562 to #288 - tangiers (04/28/2012) [-]
If our way of mind is close minded, you could say the same behind people that believe in evolution. When it comes down to it, we all believe in what some other person said. We've never done any of the homework ourselves, we just choose to believe what we naturally think makes sense. That's really all any of our beliefs are, so unless we are the actual scientists or disciples, it's kind of ridiculous to argue about it too much. I've read a lot of the bible, and I'm sure you've looked into your beliefs as well, but I'm sure we're both far from being the go to people in our beliefs :-)
#559 to #288 - realyboredguy (04/28/2012) [-]
Slightly rude, but correct. Also *explanation
Not here to provoke anybody, but I personally thank the GN for helping me in spelling/ grammar. Seriously, when I look at my first comments here, it's, it's horrible.
User avatar #222 to #184 - ferrettamer (04/27/2012) [-]
Calls us ignorant for not believing in something that there is no proof of. That right there makes you ignorant.
User avatar #219 to #184 - arearea (04/27/2012) [-]
well, although they have "accepted" science, i find they have not accepted the other things wrong: ie, homosexuality.
Leviticus 15-19/20 bans talking to women who are having their period. Obviously, they do not do that anymore. Their defence may be: "Well, thats the old testament" To which i say: "So were the 10 commandments"
Although the part about gays is in the new testament, i find it disturbing that they only follow certain parts of the bible. Religion's major flaw is the "Creation" of dogma, which drives the lives of the stupid
#418 to #219 - ishotthedeputy (04/27/2012) [-]
So it's bad if Chirstians take the Bible out of context and only use certain passages to prove their point, but it's ok if you do?
User avatar #556 to #418 - arearea (04/28/2012) [-]
well, yes i suppose i did. I... I don't hate religion, i hate religious people. The bible and all other holy texts say love and helping your fellow man. People who "quote" (agian, yes i have done that too) the bible use it to preach hate, and intolerance.
"I like your Christ, But i do not like your christians, your christians are so unlike your Christ"
User avatar #289 to #219 - appleboom (04/27/2012) [-]
I say to your "So were the 10 commandments" that they were reinstated in the new testament
User avatar #309 to #289 - arearea (04/27/2012) [-]
didnt know that,
your username= **** YEA!
User avatar #213 to #184 - seanocaster (04/27/2012) [-]
there is irrefutable evidence of evolution. see microevolution, fossil record, the fact we can see the stars.
#263 to #213 - CIS White Male (04/27/2012) [-]
ummm, that wasn't what he was talking about please reread it, you're making us look bad.....
User avatar #212 to #184 - burnyafacein (04/27/2012) [-]
Did you know athiests are the ones that study different religions the most in the world.
I still think that's still correct.
User avatar #374 to #212 - dovahkiiin (04/27/2012) [-]
That's correct, in a poll, Atheists/Agnostics knew the most about world religions
User avatar #211 to #184 - wikit (04/27/2012) [-]
Don't call "Athiests" ignorant.
Calling something ignorant and having to make that long of a comment about it is only making you ignorant.
User avatar #199 to #184 - naadrebel (04/27/2012) [-]
too long, didnt read

User avatar #196 to #184 - dubsteprevolution (04/27/2012) [-]
You sir, should be a priest. <3 I'm Roman Catholic and have never heard it as well explained as that right there.
#192 to #184 - pineapplepeople (04/27/2012) [-]
Not sure how to thumb this. I like your opinion about God creating how science works, but don't appreciate you calling atheism ignorance.
#202 to #192 - chiefrunnyjeans has deleted their comment [-]
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