Fallout 4’s Character System
Tags: Fallout 4
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#11
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bronywiseman ONLINE (09/25/2015) [-] 
I want to marry Todd Howard.
Fallout 4 is going to be the most amazing thing ever.
I was born to play this game.
Fallout 4 is going to be the most amazing thing ever.
I was born to play this game.
#27 to #26
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cubicalpayload (09/25/2015) [-] Could be, could not be. The game is already done; they're just polishing it up.
#13
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anon (09/25/2015) [-] Not that great to be honest.
First off, what a damn inconvenience. Didn't we learn from Skyrim? Flashy per tree's were cute for a little while, than it became annoying to navigate.
Secondly, New Vegas had about 80 perks. And that didn't not include their "multi rank" which as the video demonstrates can be as little as "more % dmg". Hardly very innovating.
And perks generally didn't require very high SPECIAL-stats(highest iirc was 7), mostly they required level and skill (f.e. lv12 and 70 Explosives).
If perks are now going to be tied into SPECIAL it could greatly diminish the flexibility and choice you had as a player to pick your perks. Putting a lot of perk choices out of reach by their high stat requirements.
First off, what a damn inconvenience. Didn't we learn from Skyrim? Flashy per tree's were cute for a little while, than it became annoying to navigate.
Secondly, New Vegas had about 80 perks. And that didn't not include their "multi rank" which as the video demonstrates can be as little as "more % dmg". Hardly very innovating.
And perks generally didn't require very high SPECIAL-stats(highest iirc was 7), mostly they required level and skill (f.e. lv12 and 70 Explosives).
If perks are now going to be tied into SPECIAL it could greatly diminish the flexibility and choice you had as a player to pick your perks. Putting a lot of perk choices out of reach by their high stat requirements.
#22 to #13
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gloriousthighs (09/25/2015) [-]
I can't be bothered explaining what I've found out so I'll just state it. Apparently there are far more perks total (companion/ quest included I think) and this system leads to more player choice. Quick way to demonstrate this is to think back to 3 or New Vegas, by the time you reach end game you basically always have the same character with max stats. This allows for actually different characters.
#91 to #13
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anon (10/09/2015) [-] I was too lazy to see if someone already said this, but each of those perks are mini perk trees in themselves. I can't remember if it was Todd or one of the other devs who said it but with each perk you raise in level there are other perks in that perk you unlock as you level it. For instance if you leveled let's say intimidation, there are other perks of intimidation that come along with it. If you want a more in depth idea about it you can always watch this video> www.youtube.com/watch?v=rnUdOAGqA1I
I generally don't watch this guy much but this video helped put the leveling system in a better perspective for me.
I generally don't watch this guy much but this video helped put the leveling system in a better perspective for me.
#17 to #13
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gittons (09/25/2015) [-] i like this system for 2 reasons,
1, in fo3 and nv all the points you got from lvling was tied to the int stat so int was the single
most important stat and everybody need a high amount, this is a **** design.
2, while simple this new design is not easy, it forces you to specialize and you can no longer
do everything like a god, remember the bobbleheads and some quests lvl up the special stats
which means a few more perks as you go but planning a character now has to be done with
a lot of thought.
1, in fo3 and nv all the points you got from lvling was tied to the int stat so int was the single
most important stat and everybody need a high amount, this is a **** design.
2, while simple this new design is not easy, it forces you to specialize and you can no longer
do everything like a god, remember the bobbleheads and some quests lvl up the special stats
which means a few more perks as you go but planning a character now has to be done with
a lot of thought.
#18 to #17
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gittons (09/25/2015) [-] oh and the 80 "perks" that nv had was mostly tiny pointless stuff, tons of "+5 to this stat" and
"+10%" this or that.
at least here most of the perks add big changes, like able to smash locks instead of picking,
turn an enemy into a friendly with speech, new skills for the dog, you know, game changing
stuff?
"+10%" this or that.
at least here most of the perks add big changes, like able to smash locks instead of picking,
turn an enemy into a friendly with speech, new skills for the dog, you know, game changing
stuff?
#21 to #18
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anon (09/25/2015) [-]
Really? Cause im looking at the video and seeing a bunch of "do X% more dmg with Y" perks. Better Criticals, Big Leagues, Commando, Rifleman. Toughness is just a flat +10dr, nothing more.
FONV and FO3 had plenty of interesting perks as well as the straigth forward "stat increases" that FO4 clearly also has.
And Scientist and Gun Nut allow you acces to higher level gun mods. Which has me worried as well, does this mean a lot of weapon combinations are flat out inaccesable without perks? Perks that are tied into SPECIALs.
As for your bullet points:
1) This could easily have been fixed without all these changes. By, you know, just not tying skillpoints into Int. Pretty sure there is a mod for it.
2) How is this not easy? You just pick your SPECIALs and have access to all the best perks you might want from the very start.
And you couldnt do everything, you need skillpoints. Which were tied into leveling, and not something you just raked up infinitely at zero effort.
Atleast through gameplay you could work towards perks, even if they were outside of the current scope of your character. Like you want that perk that needs high medicine? Well you can from now on work on improving your Medicine to get that perk. That was the old systen.
The new system, "well, you didnt get X in Int, so you'll never ever be able to get it. Ever."
What if you want a perk that is good at 9 strength, but perks at 8, 7 and 6 are **** ? You're wasting a lot of Stats on strength to get one good perk, leaving you with three ****** ones you don't want. So much for customization, you're now locked into this **** . As you set out on a character you seem to be very statically locked into what you can possible do.
I'll be looking forward to the inevitable mod that will completely overhaul FO4's perk system. Because this is honestly crap.
FONV and FO3 had plenty of interesting perks as well as the straigth forward "stat increases" that FO4 clearly also has.
And Scientist and Gun Nut allow you acces to higher level gun mods. Which has me worried as well, does this mean a lot of weapon combinations are flat out inaccesable without perks? Perks that are tied into SPECIALs.
As for your bullet points:
1) This could easily have been fixed without all these changes. By, you know, just not tying skillpoints into Int. Pretty sure there is a mod for it.
2) How is this not easy? You just pick your SPECIALs and have access to all the best perks you might want from the very start.
And you couldnt do everything, you need skillpoints. Which were tied into leveling, and not something you just raked up infinitely at zero effort.
Atleast through gameplay you could work towards perks, even if they were outside of the current scope of your character. Like you want that perk that needs high medicine? Well you can from now on work on improving your Medicine to get that perk. That was the old systen.
The new system, "well, you didnt get X in Int, so you'll never ever be able to get it. Ever."
What if you want a perk that is good at 9 strength, but perks at 8, 7 and 6 are **** ? You're wasting a lot of Stats on strength to get one good perk, leaving you with three ****** ones you don't want. So much for customization, you're now locked into this **** . As you set out on a character you seem to be very statically locked into what you can possible do.
I'll be looking forward to the inevitable mod that will completely overhaul FO4's perk system. Because this is honestly crap.
#24 to #21
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gittons (09/25/2015) [-] good points but you contradicted yourself at the end,
you said making a character is still easy but then said that people are going to have difficulty
with picking perks, being locked out of stuff and choosing the right **** .
this is not a perfect system but instead of being all raging butthurt before the game comes out
why not wait and see how it goes?
as you said as well, there will be hundreds of mods at the end of month 1, same with every
bethesda game.
you said making a character is still easy but then said that people are going to have difficulty
with picking perks, being locked out of stuff and choosing the right **** .
this is not a perfect system but instead of being all raging butthurt before the game comes out
why not wait and see how it goes?
as you said as well, there will be hundreds of mods at the end of month 1, same with every
bethesda game.
#30 to #24
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anon (09/25/2015) [-]
I didnt say that.
It's easier to access perks. All you need is to pick is the right amount of stat points, no level or skill requirement. So getting perks is much easier.
Picking perks is very restricted. You're a lot more limited now by the hard SPECIAL requirements that are very inflexible.
And at what point am i "raging and butthurt"? You're just throwing around insults because i don't fall to my knees and have actual criticism? Criticism i've substantiated with arguments.
I don't need several hours of hands on gameplay to already see flaws in this systems design.
It's easier to access perks. All you need is to pick is the right amount of stat points, no level or skill requirement. So getting perks is much easier.
Picking perks is very restricted. You're a lot more limited now by the hard SPECIAL requirements that are very inflexible.
And at what point am i "raging and butthurt"? You're just throwing around insults because i don't fall to my knees and have actual criticism? Criticism i've substantiated with arguments.
I don't need several hours of hands on gameplay to already see flaws in this systems design.
#34 to #30
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gittons (09/25/2015) [-] i see flaws too but i am trying to stay positive, something this site is ******* determined to
stop.
also considering perks rank up maybe you get perk points from leveling up and from that maybe
before you can use each perk you need to put the first 1 point into it?
so you start off with the 7 lvl 1 perks and each one you have to unlock and then rank up?
stop.
also considering perks rank up maybe you get perk points from leveling up and from that maybe
before you can use each perk you need to put the first 1 point into it?
so you start off with the 7 lvl 1 perks and each one you have to unlock and then rank up?
#51 to #18
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gittons (09/25/2015) [-] final note since i was rereading my comments,
my point about the perks is that fallout 3 has **** tons of +5 or +10 skills, take them away and
you would have very few skills, when looking at numbers and what the perks do there seems
to be less skills now but they are all much better designed.
i would rather have 40 skills that change **** up then 200 that just add a few stat points.
my point about the perks is that fallout 3 has **** tons of +5 or +10 skills, take them away and
you would have very few skills, when looking at numbers and what the perks do there seems
to be less skills now but they are all much better designed.
i would rather have 40 skills that change **** up then 200 that just add a few stat points.
#47 to #17
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spothot (09/25/2015) [-] I **** you not, I actually made a SPECIAL planner in C++ in order to plan my builds. You basically start with 14 less SPECIAL points since in all other Fallouts you can have 6 in each SPECIAL, while here you're restricted to only 4.
Please note I didn't spoil myself with anything other than the official trailer and the SPECIAL series.
My first run will be a full charisma one because settlements and yolo.
Aside from 10 CHR, I have 6 STR for weapon handling, 6 INT for... well, INT, so probably crafting and checks and whatnot. And lastly, 3 END because a little health for myself.
No VATS, so I don't need any PER or AGL, and LCK is completely optional, always.
I might put something in AGL if the SPECIAL video indicates it as being necessary, probably upon leveling up.
Please note I didn't spoil myself with anything other than the official trailer and the SPECIAL series.
My first run will be a full charisma one because settlements and yolo.
Aside from 10 CHR, I have 6 STR for weapon handling, 6 INT for... well, INT, so probably crafting and checks and whatnot. And lastly, 3 END because a little health for myself.
No VATS, so I don't need any PER or AGL, and LCK is completely optional, always.
I might put something in AGL if the SPECIAL video indicates it as being necessary, probably upon leveling up.
#49 to #47
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gittons (09/25/2015) [-] never go 10 on anything,
there is always bobble heads that give a plus 1 that is wasted on a 10 build and quests that
might give boosts, normally an 8 or 9 is max but without knowing the location of the bobbles
if you pick 9 it might takes ages to finally get the 10 skill.
there is always bobble heads that give a plus 1 that is wasted on a 10 build and quests that
might give boosts, normally an 8 or 9 is max but without knowing the location of the bobbles
if you pick 9 it might takes ages to finally get the 10 skill.
#53 to #49
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spothot (09/25/2015) [-] That's more or less the reason I went with 10: first playthrough, I don't know where anything is, don't expect to find anything either.
But I see your point, so I'll probably turn CHR down to 8 and increase something else, either INT or END. Worst case scenario: I spend 2 level perks to make my CHR 10.
But I see your point, so I'll probably turn CHR down to 8 and increase something else, either INT or END. Worst case scenario: I spend 2 level perks to make my CHR 10.
#54 to #53
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gittons (09/25/2015) [-] it really depends if you want those final CHR ability.
9 is to make animals leave you alone, 10 is to make people leave you alone, powerful for escapes but is it something you want all the time?
well it depends...can you talk to a pacified person and make them come to your base?
trying to come up with a meta strategy in a game that is not out is hard, keep all of this in mind
and when you learn **** improve it you know?
9 is to make animals leave you alone, 10 is to make people leave you alone, powerful for escapes but is it something you want all the time?
well it depends...can you talk to a pacified person and make them come to your base?
trying to come up with a meta strategy in a game that is not out is hard, keep all of this in mind
and when you learn **** improve it you know?
#56 to #54
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spothot (09/25/2015) [-] I didn't spoil myself with the perk tree, like I said, but... those final perks sound pretty bad. I don't think I ever needed to make people leave me alone in FO3 or NV, I could either run away or just reload an earlier save.
I'm just curious about how well I can distribute my SPECIAL points without actually looking at the perks, save for CHR which I just wanted to use for the heck of it... but if those two are the final perks, I'm thinking of giving up on that.
I'm just curious about how well I can distribute my SPECIAL points without actually looking at the perks, save for CHR which I just wanted to use for the heck of it... but if those two are the final perks, I'm thinking of giving up on that.
#89 to #56
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gittons (09/25/2015) [-] well like i said it all depends on what exactly "pacify" means.
maybe they can be your ally for a while, maybe they can join your base or maybe..
well imagine this, super hard boss dude, you pacify him, throw like 20 mines around him as
he sits there like a dick and you blow him to **** ?
maybe they can be your ally for a while, maybe they can join your base or maybe..
well imagine this, super hard boss dude, you pacify him, throw like 20 mines around him as
he sits there like a dick and you blow him to **** ?
#9
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theimmortalbeaver (09/25/2015) [-] I was actually fairly disappointed by this. No skills, linear perk trees and an overriding abundance of lame passive bonuses. I don't mind romantic stuff and dialogue wheels Mass Effect 2 is my favorite game of all time but in Fallout... seems iffy. Sad to say that I'm waiting for community reviews on this one.
#38
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iamkagji ONLINE (09/25/2015) [-] >Skills are gone
I think I'm going to be sick. Dashgamer, I predicted this. I implore you, do not give these faggots your money. You will regret it the same way you did Borderlands: The Pre-Sequel.
I think I'm going to be sick. Dashgamer, I predicted this. I implore you, do not give these faggots your money. You will regret it the same way you did Borderlands: The Pre-Sequel.
#82 to #81
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iamkagji ONLINE (09/25/2015) [-] No. NOW is when I have the time to give you the code. I cannot promise that I will even have access to the internet when your whims lean in the direction of doing something you shouldn't have put off in the first place. It will take literally 60 seconds and then you can just use my account at your leisure. Stop making things difficult.
In order to use my account AT ALL, you will need a verification code, since it is being logged in at a new location. So log in, let me give you that code, and then there's no issue.
In order to use my account AT ALL, you will need a verification code, since it is being logged in at a new location. So log in, let me give you that code, and then there's no issue.
#85 to #84
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dashgamer (09/25/2015) [-] Every night the same guy comes to relieve me at work. He offers me a cigarette and I smoke with him as we talk about stuff.
The other night I bought him a pack to say thanks, but when I pulled it out and offered it to him he said "No, no, no, no, no, no" and refused to accept.
I didn't call him an asshole. I didn't crush the pack of cigarettes to try and make him feel guilty or indebted. I put it back in my pocket and I guess I'm going to smoke it.
You offered access to your account, I don't want it. It has zero effect on me if you change the password because I'm not going to use it in the first place. Calm down. These games sell for fifty cents each with the occasional sale, it's difficult for me to be so frugal that I'd make even a small effort to avoid that fee.
The other night I bought him a pack to say thanks, but when I pulled it out and offered it to him he said "No, no, no, no, no, no" and refused to accept.
I didn't call him an asshole. I didn't crush the pack of cigarettes to try and make him feel guilty or indebted. I put it back in my pocket and I guess I'm going to smoke it.
You offered access to your account, I don't want it. It has zero effect on me if you change the password because I'm not going to use it in the first place. Calm down. These games sell for fifty cents each with the occasional sale, it's difficult for me to be so frugal that I'd make even a small effort to avoid that fee.
#41 to #38
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dashgamer (09/25/2015) [-] I think your attitude towards the game is "change is bad."
I don't like their attitude of "we have three different permutations of one thing, that means it's more than one thing" that they've shown with the weapon combinations and by saying that three stars in one perk makes it three different perks, but the carrot on the stick is still there. If there's any sense at all in the game, extra special points will be as hard to come by as they were in FO3 and NV. If every single perk can be upped to 10 without modifiers, then that's ******* stupid, but if not, it may just mean that characters will need to be more specialized.
And anyway, what's a level? It's an xp threshold at the end of which you got a perk. XP is still in the game, the only thing that's changed is the nomenclature and that they've added stupid little unnecessary animations.
I don't like their attitude of "we have three different permutations of one thing, that means it's more than one thing" that they've shown with the weapon combinations and by saying that three stars in one perk makes it three different perks, but the carrot on the stick is still there. If there's any sense at all in the game, extra special points will be as hard to come by as they were in FO3 and NV. If every single perk can be upped to 10 without modifiers, then that's ******* stupid, but if not, it may just mean that characters will need to be more specialized.
And anyway, what's a level? It's an xp threshold at the end of which you got a perk. XP is still in the game, the only thing that's changed is the nomenclature and that they've added stupid little unnecessary animations.
#46 to #45
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dashgamer (09/25/2015) [-] Eh, the only reason I didn't get them is because I enjoyed the fps aspects of the later Fallouts and may get bored with the first two because of their lack of it. But I haven't played a shooter in nearly a month, so I'm in the attitude for the turn-based rpg style.
I don't know. It's really hard to think with this loud mexican music blasting upstairs.
I don't know. It's really hard to think with this loud mexican music blasting upstairs.
#63 to #62
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dashgamer (09/25/2015) [-] I'm surprised you're so vehemently opposed to getting ********** by scorpions.
#67 to #66
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dashgamer (09/25/2015) [-] Well, I'm not going to start playing until the weekend and we're going hiking and I'm going shooting, so I probably won't begin for a while yet.
/channel/fallout/Fallout+4s+character+system/bLGeLoY/55#55
This brought me to tears.
/channel/fallout/Fallout+4s+character+system/bLGeLoY/55#55
This brought me to tears.
#52 to #29
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dashgamer (09/25/2015) [-] I never played the first two games and number three was the standard I had set for myself. I didn't realize that three wasn't the epitome of the franchise, I didn't know that there could be a game that didn't coddle the player every step of the way and that crammed your decisions into simple options of yes or no, good or bad. I didn't know that there could be a game that offered consequences throughout rather than in sequestered little areas, that there could possibly be more incentive in interactions than "trade, do errands, then kill everyone for ***** 'n' giggles."
Thanks for making this comment. I appreciate it quite a lot, as I was never privy to any of this information.
I'm going to play the first two games rather than Hypeout 4 this November.
Thanks for making this comment. I appreciate it quite a lot, as I was never privy to any of this information.
I'm going to play the first two games rather than Hypeout 4 this November.
#57 to #52
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oxidoferroso (09/25/2015) [-] btw to play F1&2 you need to patch them and install the highly recommended HD textures mod. It's all in Google, but if you need help just tell me
And if you don't have too much exp with those kind of games, you are going to need a little bit of patience! Don't give up at the first random encounter with Deathclaws (and don't be afraid to restart a game if you **** up the skill point allocation)
And if you don't have too much exp with those kind of games, you are going to need a little bit of patience! Don't give up at the first random encounter with Deathclaws (and don't be afraid to restart a game if you **** up the skill point allocation)
#55 to #52
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oxidoferroso (09/25/2015) [-] No problemo, friend. Glad that you got enlightened.
F3 it's a horrid Fallout title, but it works okay on it's own
F3 it's a horrid Fallout title, but it works okay on it's own
#32 to #31
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klina (09/25/2015) [-] how can it not? it's ************* bethesda
i mean, even if it's trash, eventually the mods will make it godlike
i mean, even if it's trash, eventually the mods will make it godlike
#6
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hueduebue (09/24/2015) [-]
So in a sense its uses the basic idea of skyrims perk system albeit you don't need to level a skill to get more points to use in that thing. Instead you just determine perks by what level your special is and most perks are upgradable with new effects/uses per upgrade. And all perks in associated special perk lines can be acquired from the start if you have x special leveled like INT 10 or STR 10 etc. I wonder how it'll work in practice and how it'll feel because i find the multi upgrade effects of each perk(or most) to be interesting so you get benefits for focusing perk upgrades down. And what not
#43
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mrforte (09/25/2015) [-] From what I understand about the changes, Bethesda wanted to wrap up the benefits of the previous skill system into the perk tree, such as now previous skills like sneak and speech are now tiered perks, while also doing away with the useless perks that only raise skills like "+15 to big guns."
#39
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noggs (09/25/2015) [-] This to me looks like a massive improvement over the previous Fallout games (at least 3 and NV). This approach is more likely to allow you to create completely unique characters which have distinct specialities as opposed to skill points in a vaguely defined group of weapons and skills. This should increase the personalisation of the player character making each play through feel more unique
