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User avatar #16 - Vandeekree (02/23/2013) [-]
She calls them dumb and suddenly all the atheists on funnyjunk are just like "ooooooh burn, she got them so good!"
And faith isn't believing in something there's no evidence for, it's believing in something you can't definitively prove to someone else.
User avatar #21 to #16 - smittywrbmnjnsn (05/26/2013) [-]
Let's think about this, something that "you cannot definitively prove to someone else" is something...without evidence.
Anything without evidence, is something you can't prove to someone.
User avatar #23 to #21 - Vandeekree (05/28/2013) [-]
Man this was like three months ago!

But to address your comment. I agree with that. Evidence is required to convince someone that something is true or false. In that way, the bible is evidence because it can be used to convince someone that it was written by who it claims and tells of factual events. That makes it evidence. Now it is up to the individual to look at that evidence and decide if it's good enough to trust or not.
We cannot definitively prove evolution without either studying it for long enough to observe it. But there is evidence for it, so much evidence that many will take it as fact.

Your statement is true, no evidence means you can't prove it. But having evidence doesn't necessarily mean you can prove it either.
User avatar #24 to #23 - smittywrbmnjnsn (05/28/2013) [-]
No.
Now you're saying all quadrilaterals are squares.
Faith is believing in something that has no evidence. If you cannot prove something to someone else, there is no evidence.
But, being able to PERSUADE someone, is not evidence either.
You can trick someone into just about anything, and that does not mean you are using evidence.
The bible is not evidence, because the bible could easily be fallible.
User avatar #25 to #24 - Vandeekree (05/29/2013) [-]
Faith is believing in something of which you are not sure. You do not know that you will survive your drive to work this morning, but you had faith that, based on the evidence that car crashes are relatively rare, you will make it to work alive.

And persuasion does not mean tricking. And it does require evidence. Evidence is not always right either. There can be evidence that a man committed a murder when he is actually innocent. There can be evidence we never went to the moon even though there are Armstrong footprints on the moon right now. Evidence is only a piece of an argument. A thing you can point too to help prove truth to someone.

Thus the bible is in fact evidence. We cannot prove that the big bang theory is right but there is a ton of evidence for it. That means it cannot be proven but HAS evidence.

And yes, the bible could be fallible, but so could everything we currently know about the world. And I do mean everything. We think we evolved from pre-humans which evolved from early mammals which evolved from so on and so forth. But it's possible that we were actually brought here by a space fairing species of aliens and the first human was created and placed on Earth. This means evolution could be fallible. Would you then say evolution has no evidence because it could be fallible? I hope not, because that's simply wrong.
User avatar #26 to #25 - smittywrbmnjnsn (05/29/2013) [-]
You just went off the deep end.

Faith-N- Complete trust or confidence in someone or something.
It's not "something of which you are not sure". You have complete belief that it is true.

Evidence-N- The available body of facts or information indicating whether a belief or proposition is true or valid.
In order for something to be called evidence, it must be factually correct. Evidence that only POINTS to a possibility, is circumstantial, and requires more to prove its validity (like your bible).

Sure, everything could be fallible. But religion is FAR more fallible than anything else, being that it has no evidence to support it. The rest of that stuff that you could dismiss as imagination (but not for the stupid reason you presented), but it at least has evidence.

Your alien theory is stupid, because the theory of evolution has fossil records.
If we were aliens, we would still have to have evolved and left the fossil remains.

Before you go "No, this word means...", understand that these are dictionary definitions, and are unwavering.
User avatar #27 to #26 - Vandeekree (05/30/2013) [-]
Well dictionary definitions are rather made up. Words mean what you want them too. But I have no qualms with those definitions. They seem correct to me.

I especially agree with the evidence one. Evidence is a factual thing that points to a truth we can't be completely sure of. And there is evidence for Christianity. Mainly the bible. It is fact that there is a book that has been around for a long time and claims to be written by men who witnessed miraculous things and were contacted by God. All that is a fact. It's also a fact that book has not been shown to be fabricated, not saying it couldn't be, only that it hasn't. Also, all of the contents that can be verified have been shown to be true and the rest has not been dis-proven as of yet. All of this is fact and points to God's existence. It is evidence. Ergo, there is evidence for Christianity.

And my alien "theory" was an example that I mostly made up off the top of my head. Don't read to far into it or I will simply fill the holes with other stuff off the top of my head. It was made to show that there can be a conceivable alternative to all "facts" simply because we can't really know such things for sure.
User avatar #17 to #16 - scio ONLINE (02/23/2013) [-]
Faith is believing in something there is no evidence for. Wether or not it can be proven doesn't come into count, although many use that as a counter-argument (which is just stupid, really, when you think about it).

I could believe there is a prophet on a foreign planet 500 lightyears away from us and start a religion based on that, however as soon (maybe?) as we may the entire universe - or atleast in that radius - my religion will be disproven. But until then people who "believe" it's there is still gonna believe that on no evidence except for me saying it's there.
User avatar #18 to #17 - scio ONLINE (02/23/2013) [-]
Wether or not it can be disproven (as of now) doesn't come into count

sry
User avatar #19 to #18 - scio ONLINE (02/23/2013) [-]
On another note (sorry for my ranting) the Norse believed that the god Thor, with his hammer, caused thunder. The Arse-belief was a faith and religion. It didn't stop us from discovering how lightning was made, though.

QED
User avatar #20 to #19 - Vandeekree (02/23/2013) [-]
Evidence has little to do wit whether a fact is indeed a fact or not. evidence is for someone who doesn't know. We do not know if there are Bigfoot living in the wild, but we do have evidence of them. People saying they saw them is evidence, blurry photos are evidence, and the fact that there are primates of that size that once lived is all evidence for Bigfoot. Does that mean there is a Bigfoot? No.
So there is evidence for God in the bible sense people claim to have been contacted and even the modern day claims of divine encounters can be offered as evidence. Once you accept it then it turns to proof because the evidence was pushing enough in one direction to make you take it as fact. This still doesn't necessarily make it absolute truth, only an accepted truth.
There is evidence, there is even proof, but it's up to you to choose what you believe about his world. So perhaps you do make up something about a planet 500 light years away, you have no proof, but the fact you said it is evidence in an argument for it.
To summarize, there is evidence for religions and faith is based on that evidence, just as you take it on faith that the things a scientist is says, things you've neither experienced nor fully understand, are true.
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