Karma's a bitch.
Not mine.
i allar
i CANT BUT [HUGH
i CANT BUT [HUGH
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#12
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ihateallofyoualot **User deleted account** (11/01/2013) [+] (53 replies)
Why would someone say vaccines are bad? When have they ever done anything negative to make the assumption in the first place?
#390 to #14
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anonymous (11/02/2013) [-] This probably won't be seen by the majority of FJ users, but it needs to be said, as a lot of people commenting (and reading) are missing the point completely.
Andrew Wakefield, the doctor that performed the study, had produced a patented vaccine of his own which he was struggling to sell, so he conducted "studies" to show his rival's vaccines caused autism, in the hope that they would lose their foothold in the market. If his rival's vaccine was bad and ultimately lose value, he would end up making a financial gain.
Andrew Wakefield, the doctor that performed the study, had produced a patented vaccine of his own which he was struggling to sell, so he conducted "studies" to show his rival's vaccines caused autism, in the hope that they would lose their foothold in the market. If his rival's vaccine was bad and ultimately lose value, he would end up making a financial gain.
#354 to #13
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dwarfman (11/02/2013) [-] To answer some of the questions folks are having:
news.discovery.com/human/health/vaccine-autism-doctor-accused-of-deliberate-fraud.htm
www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLcOz4EKrxg
He was arrested for fraud. Lost his license. He did it as part of a conspiracy with a lawyer who was suing based on his research.
TLDR: He's a lying sack of **** , if you believe him you're a dumb sack of **** , I went so far as to provide sources.
news.discovery.com/human/health/vaccine-autism-doctor-accused-of-deliberate-fraud.htm
www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLcOz4EKrxg
He was arrested for fraud. Lost his license. He did it as part of a conspiracy with a lawyer who was suing based on his research.
TLDR: He's a lying sack of **** , if you believe him you're a dumb sack of **** , I went so far as to provide sources.
#335 to #13
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IamSofaKingdom (11/02/2013) [-] I dunno about Autism but several vaccines do have a chance to cause some damages but I would weigh the diseases they prevent much heavier than the small problems that may occur or the low chances that something serious could come about.
#372 to #370
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IamSofaKingdom (11/02/2013) [-] I don't see why your comment was necessary. I just said that it does have a chance of negative side effects but the positive effects far outweigh the slim possibility of negative ones. You just repeated what I said and thumbed me down for it.
#92 to #13
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anonymous (11/01/2013) [-]
Even better, I think that he was found to have patents for another vaccine (which would of course be seen as the "safe" alternative and make huge amounts of money)
He tried to use his position as a reputable doctor to slander other's hard work and make bank off of it, so they took his medical license. And people STILL BELIEVE HIM.
He tried to use his position as a reputable doctor to slander other's hard work and make bank off of it, so they took his medical license. And people STILL BELIEVE HIM.
#84 to #13
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anonymous (11/01/2013) [-] Those people don't even know what autism is.
In each individual is there a different distribution of brain cells.
Some areas get more, some get less. That is normal.
Autism is when there are higher concentrations of braincells in some areas compared to what is normal, at the cost of less brain cells in other areas.
This creates people who can be really really good at for example math/music/language/programming/drawing, but who are average or below at other areas and have difficulties with learning certain things (like socialization.)
Think of it like stats in a game, focusing most on one or two stats while plus a little here and there can be better than to spend your points evenly.
Poinst spent on usefull stats result in high-functioning atuists (Normally but very smart))
(Whilst points spent on worthless stats result in people who have difficulties with almost everything. Spending points more evenly is what "normal" people's brains do, the more even, the more average a person is)
In each individual is there a different distribution of brain cells.
Some areas get more, some get less. That is normal.
Autism is when there are higher concentrations of braincells in some areas compared to what is normal, at the cost of less brain cells in other areas.
This creates people who can be really really good at for example math/music/language/programming/drawing, but who are average or below at other areas and have difficulties with learning certain things (like socialization.)
Think of it like stats in a game, focusing most on one or two stats while plus a little here and there can be better than to spend your points evenly.
Poinst spent on usefull stats result in high-functioning atuists (Normally but very smart))
(Whilst points spent on worthless stats result in people who have difficulties with almost everything. Spending points more evenly is what "normal" people's brains do, the more even, the more average a person is)
#347 to #13
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redrepeater (11/02/2013) [-] Wrong. The reason I hate vaccines personally is because it made me develop an allergy for anything with aluminum in it. What uses aluminum you say? Mostly things you put on your body like d-sticks or hairsprays.
I always investigate before I take a vaccine. If the virus is not an instant killer then usually eating healthy and training is just fine. Taking a vaccine does not cause autism, but each time you do take a vaccine there is a slight chance of getting some kind of side effect. Just like any type of medicine have.
I always investigate before I take a vaccine. If the virus is not an instant killer then usually eating healthy and training is just fine. Taking a vaccine does not cause autism, but each time you do take a vaccine there is a slight chance of getting some kind of side effect. Just like any type of medicine have.
#426 to #347
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anonymous (11/02/2013) [-]
Oh, that's cute. Training and eating healthy will not save you from the extreme discomfort measels, mumps, pertussis, polio, tetanus, hepatitis B or influenzae. Or if your mother had Rubella while carrying you.
If you ever had the flu you would know to get the vaccine, polio, tetanus and hep B is kind of a no brainer. Measels, well, if you like 40 C fever and risk of encephalitis, be my guest.
If you ever had the flu you would know to get the vaccine, polio, tetanus and hep B is kind of a no brainer. Measels, well, if you like 40 C fever and risk of encephalitis, be my guest.
#16 to #12
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iRetaliate (11/01/2013) [-] Some people believe that vaccines can cause autism.
There's absolutely no CONCLUSIVE evidence to support this though, as vaccines have been mandatory for more years than autism has been on the rise, indicating that something other than vaccines is causing the increase. Most likely, it's the rise of technology, but if you start telling all these ****** parents that they need to take the video games away from their kids and actually spend time with them, suddenly it becomes a huge problem.
#OPENYOUREYESWORLD #NWO
There's absolutely no CONCLUSIVE evidence to support this though, as vaccines have been mandatory for more years than autism has been on the rise, indicating that something other than vaccines is causing the increase. Most likely, it's the rise of technology, but if you start telling all these ****** parents that they need to take the video games away from their kids and actually spend time with them, suddenly it becomes a huge problem.
#OPENYOUREYESWORLD #NWO
#290 to #12
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anonymous (11/02/2013) [-] I'm not sure if it's true but I've heard that in some countries USA, might be more countries too there have been money involved to make people buy vaccine for no reason at all, just scare them about "awful blah blah" and then let them pay for it.
I read about it not long ago but can't provide source. I'm not saying vaccines are bad or good but to be honest, sometimes I just feel like "well, media cry every year about vaccine and still there are like 1 person who gets it". Just the birdflue, it was all over the news, like millions in Sweden has died. The truth was, we had 2 - 3 cases if I'm not wrong and one of them was a cat.
I'll never tell someone "don't take it" but for my personal, I rather skip it. the bird flue for an example, the vaccine made a lot of people sick and tired for no reason at all and if I'm not wrong, pregnant womens who took it might have had some effects on the baby, something I read about later, no source sadly.
I read about it not long ago but can't provide source. I'm not saying vaccines are bad or good but to be honest, sometimes I just feel like "well, media cry every year about vaccine and still there are like 1 person who gets it". Just the birdflue, it was all over the news, like millions in Sweden has died. The truth was, we had 2 - 3 cases if I'm not wrong and one of them was a cat.
I'll never tell someone "don't take it" but for my personal, I rather skip it. the bird flue for an example, the vaccine made a lot of people sick and tired for no reason at all and if I'm not wrong, pregnant womens who took it might have had some effects on the baby, something I read about later, no source sadly.
#127 to #12
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anonymous (11/01/2013) [-]
Actually, there IS a reason as to not get a vaccine: Vaccines weaken your immune system. I know, it sounds silly, but you're weak to other diseases while your white blood cells try to create antibodies to your vaccine, and the vaccine itself can even cause you to get what the vaccine prevents. So basically, you can risk getting sick and not getting a shot, or you can try to not get sick with something and probably get sick with something else. I myself don't usually take vaccines, as I don't give two ***** if I'm sick.
#172 to #127
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anonymous (11/02/2013) [-]
You may not give two ***** if you're sick, but what if you don't get the vaccine and pass on whatever-it-is to someone who can't fight it off, like the elderly or those with pre-existing conditions that weaken them to disease? The main point of vaccines is to break the chain of infection and support herd immunity. Also, most vaccines are dead or weakened strains. You can't get sick from dead bacteria or viruses, so, for instance, if we're talking about the flu vaccine and you're worried about not being able to fight off the weakened disease in the nasal spray, get the shot instead which is already dead. Some people may still get sick even after being vaccinated, but it's likely to be less severe if they've been vaccinated and they're less likely to be exposed if everyone around them was vaccinated, too.
TL;DR: Not getting vaccinated can hurt other people. Vaccines don't make you sick. If you get sick with the disease you were just vaccinated for, it's likely you were already exposed.
TL;DR: Not getting vaccinated can hurt other people. Vaccines don't make you sick. If you get sick with the disease you were just vaccinated for, it's likely you were already exposed.
#63 to #12
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godofcorndog (11/01/2013) [-] The main reason is some dumb **** famous woman said "I'm not getting my kid vaccinated because I don't want him to get Autism." She had no medical evidence of it, nor could provide any support for her claim, but of course stupid people will believe what they are told.
#22 to #12
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zzforrest (11/01/2013) [-] There's of course the autism explanation but if you want a more "reasonable" argument against it, you could look at the supervirus.
The theory is, when you use hand sanitizer it only kills 99.9% of germs in an area. Therefore the .1% of germs are stronger than the other 99.9%. If you keep sanitizing the same area for long enough, you breed germs and bacteria that are too powerful to stop. They reproduce, there is no cure, humanity gets ****** . Now imagine the same thing with a virus like the flu. If the flu keeps getting destroyed in lower forms, the upper form will be stronger. Vaccines, can (even though I don't agree with it), breed super viruses that could wipe out humanity.
I don't agree with that but that's at least more statistically grounded.
The theory is, when you use hand sanitizer it only kills 99.9% of germs in an area. Therefore the .1% of germs are stronger than the other 99.9%. If you keep sanitizing the same area for long enough, you breed germs and bacteria that are too powerful to stop. They reproduce, there is no cure, humanity gets ****** . Now imagine the same thing with a virus like the flu. If the flu keeps getting destroyed in lower forms, the upper form will be stronger. Vaccines, can (even though I don't agree with it), breed super viruses that could wipe out humanity.
I don't agree with that but that's at least more statistically grounded.
#42 to #22
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lodestone (11/01/2013) [-] I think you're mixing up vaccines with something like antibiotics or antivirals. Vaccines are weakened or dead organisms that help your body's immune response against a certain disease later on. So what you are saying is impossible because vaccines don't fight pathogens directly. Your body fights the vaccine which makes your immune system better at fighting the future disease.
#124 to #22
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anonymous (11/01/2013) [-]
Often times the only reason they say it kills 99.9% of germs is due to legal reasons. The product is capable of killing all bacteria that it comes in contact with, but if someone misuses the product and claims to have gotten sick afterwards due to the product being faulty, the company can claim that a 100% success rate was never guaranteed in the first place because on the label it said 99.9%
#35 to #30
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zzforrest (11/01/2013) [-] What I said actually happened once.
Bedbugs are nasty little bastards, and we knew it. Thus, the US used **** tons of the most potent pesticide at the time to kill of thousands of bedbugs. Every single one they could find, they tried to demolish. They failed, though, because the bedbugs desperately evolved. You can no longer use any pesticide against bedbugs. None. No amount of potency will kill them. They are evolved against pesticides. Imagine this happened to the flu. Imagine e-coli became resistant to treating measures. Imagine your bug spray was useless against the average hornet.
Bedbugs are nasty little bastards, and we knew it. Thus, the US used **** tons of the most potent pesticide at the time to kill of thousands of bedbugs. Every single one they could find, they tried to demolish. They failed, though, because the bedbugs desperately evolved. You can no longer use any pesticide against bedbugs. None. No amount of potency will kill them. They are evolved against pesticides. Imagine this happened to the flu. Imagine e-coli became resistant to treating measures. Imagine your bug spray was useless against the average hornet.
#37 to #35
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fgtometer (11/01/2013) [-] (By bugs I meant bacteria.)
I understand what you're saying, what I'm saying is bacteria aren't really able to develop resistance to alcohol. It destroys (dissolves) the cell membrane. That's the surface of bacteria, so it's pretty fundamental; they can't really block it from doing that. That's why they can boast 99% efficiency. If it was any other mechanism that %age would drop incredibly rapidly.
That's very different to a pesticide, most of which act on the nervous system of insects as far as I know.
I understand what you're saying, what I'm saying is bacteria aren't really able to develop resistance to alcohol. It destroys (dissolves) the cell membrane. That's the surface of bacteria, so it's pretty fundamental; they can't really block it from doing that. That's why they can boast 99% efficiency. If it was any other mechanism that %age would drop incredibly rapidly.
That's very different to a pesticide, most of which act on the nervous system of insects as far as I know.
#48 to #44
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fgtometer (11/01/2013) [-] I wouldn't ever deny that. But vaccines don't kill viruses, they allow the body to have antibodies ready when an infection occurs, which prevents the virus infecting many cells in the body. Thus, the virus is not reproduced as much.
So it's not an apt analogy, nor is the hand sanitiser-> bed bugs analogy. Superficially, yes, but on a technical level, no.
So it's not an apt analogy, nor is the hand sanitiser-> bed bugs analogy. Superficially, yes, but on a technical level, no.
#1
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nynewars (11/01/2013) [+] (17 replies)
For those who don't know what Pertussis is:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pertussis
Don't worry I had to look it up too.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pertussis
Don't worry I had to look it up too.
#2 to #1
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iforgotmyothername (11/01/2013) [-] Pertussis — commonly called whooping cough, is a highly contagious bacterial disease [...] In some countries, this disease is called the 100 days' cough or cough of 100 days.
Symptoms are initially mild, and then develop into severe coughing fits, which produce the namesake high-pitched "whoop" sound in infected babies and children when they inhale air after coughing.[2] The coughing stage lasts approximately six weeks before subsiding.
Yep, sucks to be her.
![Pertussis — commonly called whooping cough, is a highly contagious bacterial disease [...] In some countries, this disease is called the 100 days' cough or cough of 100 days.
Symptoms are initially mild, and then develop into severe coughing fits, which produce the namesake high-pitched "whoop" sound in infected babies and children when they inhale air after coughing.[2] The coughing stage lasts approximately six weeks before subsiding.
Yep, sucks to be her.](http://new1.fjcdn.com/comments/Pertussis+commonly+called+whooping+cough+is+a+highly+contagious+_81e5c060f6bdefe5cb6a681190b6f8ac.jpg)
Symptoms are initially mild, and then develop into severe coughing fits, which produce the namesake high-pitched "whoop" sound in infected babies and children when they inhale air after coughing.[2] The coughing stage lasts approximately six weeks before subsiding.
Yep, sucks to be her.
#363 to #2
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alexthebest (11/02/2013) [-] I had whooping cough a few years ago despite getting the vaccine as a kid. By far the worst thing I've had, including chicken pox, mumps, and pneumonia. I'm only able to hold my breath for about a minute, but a coughing fit would last up to two minutes without an opportunity to breathe, followed by gasping desperately for air, making the "whoop" noise.
Feels scary not knowing when a coughing fit will end and your body is gonna give you a chance to inhale.
Feels scary not knowing when a coughing fit will end and your body is gonna give you a chance to inhale.
#33
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newall (11/01/2013) [+] (2 replies)
people not vaccinating their ******* kids is the reason "extinct" diseases are suddenly reappearing. if you want to not vaccinate your children, fine. homeschool your filthy little urchins, keep them away from other people's kids.
#18
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dwarfman (11/01/2013) [+] (7 replies)
This Ladies and Gents is what is known as "Darwinism". It's a great way to weed out the anti vaccine nuts.
#276 to #18
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artistultimatum (11/02/2013) [-] Another problem is that these people can act as mobile, virus storage units. Measles was considered all but extinct in the US around 2000. Now its coming back because people aren't getting their vaccinations for it.
There other diseases that can make a comeback because of these people, and they can spread it to other people.
I know it's their right and all to decide whether or not they get their shots, but they're stupid so **** their collective opinions.
<MFW people tell me they wont get vaccinated.
There other diseases that can make a comeback because of these people, and they can spread it to other people.
I know it's their right and all to decide whether or not they get their shots, but they're stupid so **** their collective opinions.
<MFW people tell me they wont get vaccinated.
#351 to #350
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iridium ONLINE (11/02/2013) [-] Alas, she could just be repeating the words of someone else that were twisted to the point that made sense, and now she has learned her lesson?
As much as I hate stupidity, I don't believe someone should be removed from the genepool on their first strike, and I really would like to believe this person isn't this dumb on a regular basis. Everyone says one dumb thing or another at some point.
As much as I hate stupidity, I don't believe someone should be removed from the genepool on their first strike, and I really would like to believe this person isn't this dumb on a regular basis. Everyone says one dumb thing or another at some point.
#261
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cameforalaugh (11/02/2013) [+] (16 replies)
Ummm... It's true, vaccines are bad for you, they are the leading cause of infant deaths in the world
#283 to #265
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idoliam (11/02/2013) [-] Also, if they're basing a statement like that around opinion than they probably don't know what they're talking about or hey were horribly misinformed. Fact outweighs opinion. I personally have never heard of vaccines being related to SIDS. Every SIDS case I've studied in infant development 1, 2, and 3 (some outside research as well) has either had no definite reason, an unknown toxin in the home, or a result of shaking the infant.
#269 to #267
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noblexfenrir (11/02/2013) [-] That isn't a source sparky, I could easily give you a site that says "His site is ******** ".
I was a study that shows a direct link between vaccinations and it being the leading cause of infant deaths. Your site gave me "Some people believe that vaccination causes SIDS", which basically equates to "We have nothing to prove it but it sounds good to prove our point."
Not to mention the site you gave me is riddled with misinformation on the subject of vaccines, however I'm not hear to call ******** on them, I'm calling it on you.
I was a study that shows a direct link between vaccinations and it being the leading cause of infant deaths. Your site gave me "Some people believe that vaccination causes SIDS", which basically equates to "We have nothing to prove it but it sounds good to prove our point."
Not to mention the site you gave me is riddled with misinformation on the subject of vaccines, however I'm not hear to call ******** on them, I'm calling it on you.
#272 to #269
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noblexfenrir (11/02/2013) [-] Also I should inform people who are reading these comments his site is actually pro-vaccinations, however this is their paragraph on infant death rates:
"Some people believe that vaccination causes SIDS because a proportion of children who die as a result of SIDS have recently been immunised. There is actual no link between the two beyond the fact that, as babies are immunised every two months for the first six months of their life, and children are most vulnerable to SIDS at this age, it should come as no surprise that a certain percentage of babies who died from SIDS were, coincidentally, recently vaccinated."
"Some people believe that vaccination causes SIDS because a proportion of children who die as a result of SIDS have recently been immunised. There is actual no link between the two beyond the fact that, as babies are immunised every two months for the first six months of their life, and children are most vulnerable to SIDS at this age, it should come as no surprise that a certain percentage of babies who died from SIDS were, coincidentally, recently vaccinated."
#275 to #270
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SmilingJackSmyth (11/02/2013) [-] I think he needs to lie down for a bit. You owned him pretty hard back there.
#56
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arandomanon (11/01/2013) [+] (32 replies)
I've never had a vaccine and I've got no intention of doing so.
My physical health is pretty goddamn good, just a flu or two a year.
My uncle is vaccinated against measles and he's sick of it at the moment. And I know more cases.
inb4 people telling me I need to vaccinate and stuff.
inb4 redthumbs because I'm an ignorant.
My physical health is pretty goddamn good, just a flu or two a year.
My uncle is vaccinated against measles and he's sick of it at the moment. And I know more cases.
inb4 people telling me I need to vaccinate and stuff.
inb4 redthumbs because I'm an ignorant.
#331 to #136
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nigeltheoutlaw (11/02/2013) [-] That's because everybody around you is vaccinated, you inbred amoeba. Vaccinations need the whole group to participate to be fully effective; all you are right now is a walking depository of illnesses that nobody in a wealthy nation should have.
#225 to #222
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fgtometer (11/02/2013) [-] It's actually a common misconception amongst English-speakers, too. Flu is generally ******* severe, fever etc. The cold may include similar symptoms but generally isn't as full-on.
Also, well done. Your English is a lot better than any of my foreign languages.
Also, well done. Your English is a lot better than any of my foreign languages.
#229 to #225
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arandomanon (11/02/2013) [-] Why, thank you. And thank you for stating politely your thoughts without being a dick, unlike everyone else.
#235 to #229
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fgtometer (11/02/2013) [-] No worries bru. I wouldn't bother with flu vaccines unless I was dealing with old, young, or sick people (or I was one of those), but the other vaccines are a bit more serious.
Measles, for example, one of my friends caught that from an unvaccinated person and spent a few weeks in the hospital (and she was around 20 at the time).
Having said that, it is your choice. Just make sure it's an educated decision. And by that I mean actual science, not Professor Yewtoob
Measles, for example, one of my friends caught that from an unvaccinated person and spent a few weeks in the hospital (and she was around 20 at the time).
Having said that, it is your choice. Just make sure it's an educated decision. And by that I mean actual science, not Professor Yewtoob
#250 to #235
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arandomanon (11/02/2013) [-] I'm not really going to argue about that because it's no use. There are studies that say vaccines are good, however vaccines are based on mercury (as far as I know) and that's not exactly a thing I'd like to put inside my organism. I distrust everything and just because everyone else says it's good, doesn't mean anything to me. Doctors in ~1920 said tobacco was healthy and they were wrong. And people believe them just because "hey, doctors said that" without really wondering anything.
I've got no evidences to sustain I'm right distrusting vaccines but I also don't have enough evidences that tell me I'm wrong. And again, I don't say people shouldn't vaccinate, I just said that I really don't think I will.
I've got no evidences to sustain I'm right distrusting vaccines but I also don't have enough evidences that tell me I'm wrong. And again, I don't say people shouldn't vaccinate, I just said that I really don't think I will.
#219 to #216
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arandomanon (11/02/2013) [-] You all talk like I'm telling you not to vaccinate. I didn't say that. I just said what I'm not going to do.
I find amusing how butthurt are people here because an opinion, FJ's hive mind never cease to amuse me.
I find amusing how butthurt are people here because an opinion, FJ's hive mind never cease to amuse me.
#234 to #219
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abcdxyz (11/02/2013) [-]
FJ does have a hivemind. But you've made it sound like vaccinating isn't necessary. And maybe you won't get exposed and get sick. And that is great. For you. It is necessary to try and vaccinate everyone, because rarely is anyone so lucky that they won't ever be exposed to the disease.
There is an extremely dangerous myth out there that vaccinating is dangerous. Again, maybe you didn't intend to, but your post has made it sound like the fact that you believe it's not necessary because of what you've experienced, when studies say that you are in the minority.
Lastly I don't think that's the full story about your uncle. Measles was nearly wiped out due to vaccinations preventing people from contracting it. Either your uncle never received the MMR vaccine until after exposure to it, or some part of the story, either as you've heard it, or you've told it, is false
There is an extremely dangerous myth out there that vaccinating is dangerous. Again, maybe you didn't intend to, but your post has made it sound like the fact that you believe it's not necessary because of what you've experienced, when studies say that you are in the minority.
Lastly I don't think that's the full story about your uncle. Measles was nearly wiped out due to vaccinations preventing people from contracting it. Either your uncle never received the MMR vaccine until after exposure to it, or some part of the story, either as you've heard it, or you've told it, is false
#254 to #234
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arandomanon (11/02/2013) [-] It wasn't my intention.
I could argue and tell my uncle's story but I really don't feel like it, I really don't want to persuade anyone to stop using vaccines. So I'm not going to try.
As I've stated below, I don't really trust vaccines. Of course, I've read studies that say vaccines are positive. But yet, I've heard of people vaccinated who've had problems with sickness they apparently were vaccinated against. Vaccines are based in mercury (as far as I know, the ones being used here are at least) and that's not something I'd really want to put inside my organism.
But again, I'm not trying to persuade anyone about anything.
I could argue and tell my uncle's story but I really don't feel like it, I really don't want to persuade anyone to stop using vaccines. So I'm not going to try.
As I've stated below, I don't really trust vaccines. Of course, I've read studies that say vaccines are positive. But yet, I've heard of people vaccinated who've had problems with sickness they apparently were vaccinated against. Vaccines are based in mercury (as far as I know, the ones being used here are at least) and that's not something I'd really want to put inside my organism.
But again, I'm not trying to persuade anyone about anything.
#282 to #56
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anonymous (11/02/2013) [-]
It's fine for a small minority of a population to not get vaccinated because as long as the majority do then you still have 'herd protection.' Basically because everyone else is more resistant to the disease then it's harder for it to spread anyway.
The problem is when there are too many idiots or groups of idiots that allow for an outbreak to take root. For instance a few decades ago we had pretty much beat mumps, as in it was going to be one of those diseases confined only to labs for research, but thanks to that cock-juggling thundercunt Wakefield it's now having a resurgence worldwide.
The problem is when there are too many idiots or groups of idiots that allow for an outbreak to take root. For instance a few decades ago we had pretty much beat mumps, as in it was going to be one of those diseases confined only to labs for research, but thanks to that cock-juggling thundercunt Wakefield it's now having a resurgence worldwide.
#463 to #459
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arandomanon (11/03/2013) [-] Yeah vaccines will grant you eternal life and just because I'm not vaccinated I'm going to die. Really? Are you that stupid?
#99
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howunexpected (11/01/2013) [+] (1 reply)
A girl at my school who avidly preaches no sexual anything, like not even touching the sexual organs unless necessary, is now pregnant
And apparently has syphilis too
And apparently has syphilis too
#221
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jacencaedus (11/02/2013) [+] (3 replies)
I know my neighbor can't enroll her son in school because there's no vaccination record because of her views
#39
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nationalanthem ONLINE (11/01/2013) [+] (52 replies)
then no matter how you view it you're ******* evil!
she's preching because she cares, wheter its right or not (it is by the way) she does it because she believes in it!
bet you poke people in wheelchairs too then?
she's preching because she cares, wheter its right or not (it is by the way) she does it because she believes in it!
bet you poke people in wheelchairs too then?
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nationalanthem ONLINE (11/01/2013) [-]
im just thinking why would you inject yourself with something you have NO idea what is and because a guys who makes money off of it tells you you should do it because it's good for you? and if it truly were entirely good for you why is there in some cases death due to side effects?
btw.. (sic)..?
btw.. (sic)..?
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kanadetenshi ONLINE (11/01/2013) [-] Because if you'd actually bother to read the facts and the scientifically peer reviewed articles you would realize that there is nothing to worry about. You're right about one thing though, the only reason you're not injecting yourself is because you have no idea about vaccinations and are absolutely too ignorant and unqualified to even discuss it.
Vaccines are actually very safe, despite implications to the contrary in many anti-vaccine publications (which sometimes contain the number of reports received by VAERS, and allow the reader to infer that all of them represent genuine vaccine side-effects). Most vaccine adverse events are minor and temporary, such as a sore arm or mild fever. These can often be controlled by taking acetaminophen before or after vaccination.
But go ahead and deny vaccines, it's good for natural selection.
Vaccines are actually very safe, despite implications to the contrary in many anti-vaccine publications (which sometimes contain the number of reports received by VAERS, and allow the reader to infer that all of them represent genuine vaccine side-effects). Most vaccine adverse events are minor and temporary, such as a sore arm or mild fever. These can often be controlled by taking acetaminophen before or after vaccination.
But go ahead and deny vaccines, it's good for natural selection.
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nationalanthem ONLINE (11/01/2013) [-]
lol.. a shill would be someone whos delivering false or misleading information? so what are YOU calling ME a Shill for? do you never stop and wonder why the things that are politically correct is politically correct?
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nationalanthem ONLINE (11/01/2013) [-]
yeah im maybe the least likely here to take that advice knowing that i dont do or believie in things simply because im told to^^ ask some of the others but psst.. call your self a doctor or a psycologist or some fancy **** and they'll be sure to swallow it ;D
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TheBearerOfBadNews (11/01/2013) [-] i would simply like to state that i only just stumbled on to this *********** in the last 5 mins... I was also just trying to compliment your eloquent use of trolling technique and your commitment to character is impressive. That being said.... I will entertain this ridiculous notion that scientists stand to make any money from the sale of vaccines. I am currently a cancer researcher working on new chemotherapies. I am in know way in line to see a single penny of any profits from drugs which make it to the market. It is me and my colleagues that establsih wether drugs are safe for use and ensure that they actually work. If they do not meet certain strict criteria they are banned from use.... by law. If a drug is shown to be effective and safe only then does it make it to market where the drug companies make there money from sales. Drug companies make money from successful drugs and therapies; not by selling false claims and toxic chemicals. If they did do that they would face bankruptcy from the countless fines and lawsuits they would receive. I take it as an insult that you would imply that those like me who work hard to improve peoples lives and better humankind would stoop so low as to attempt to profit from misery and lies. All of those currently working on the development of medicines, better living conditions, cheaper and better ways to gather resources and ultimately bettering our lives deserve a bit of god damn respect. Now I would not wish disease and death on anyone but please at least keep you hate mongering ******** to yourself and leave the rest of us alone.
and once again 11/10 troll you got me
and once again 11/10 troll you got me
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nationalanthem ONLINE (11/01/2013) [-]
i dont belong to any religion, but i wont say im an atheist either.. what i believe in is not necessarily holy nor a man in the skies.. im not trolling.. -.- this is my opinion on the matter and i stand by it proudly cause at least if im wrong (and im not) i had my own thoughts and once i again i call ******** on the whole im a cancer scientist.. cancer scientists don't hang around on FJ.. did you mean you were the IT guy at the laboratory the scientists work? or the castodian or such?
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TheBearerOfBadNews (11/01/2013) [-] Ok so your agnostic that's fine... Opinion doesn't come in to this... its fact... scienific fact that vaccines do more good than harm. If you dont believe the cancer research thing then again thats fine. I would like to point out that people from all ages and backgrounds are on fj.., one of the beauties of the internet. I do hope that you eventually see that the world is not out to get you and that you join us in the realm of sanity and understanding. Until then though do us all a favour and just shut the **** up! you have spent the last 2 or so hours arguing on the internet. worst of all your wrong and nothing you say will make your "opinion" right in the real world. So just stop relax, live your life and most importantly of all..... shut up.
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nationalanthem ONLINE (11/01/2013) [-]
The Matrix is a system, Neo. That system is our enemy. But when you're inside, you look around, what do you see? Businessmen, teachers, lawyers, carpenters. The very minds of the people we are trying to save. But until we do, these people are still a part of that system and that makes them our enemy. You have to understand, most of these people are not ready to be unplugged. And many of them are so inured, so hopelessly dependent on the system, that they will fight to protect it.
FJ comunity^^....... -.-' you're ******* pathetic, but know this anyway! i root for you to find the truth some day and that it wont result in you all shooting yourselves in the face out of shame! but let me ease you into it a bit cuz it's ******* brutal once your bubble pops and theres no way back
FJ comunity^^....... -.-' you're ******* pathetic, but know this anyway! i root for you to find the truth some day and that it wont result in you all shooting yourselves in the face out of shame! but let me ease you into it a bit cuz it's ******* brutal once your bubble pops and theres no way back
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nationalanthem ONLINE (11/01/2013) [-]
what facts!?! the "facts" the merchant is telling you!? "Chome Herehe Verry Godt Prizzzee Fohr u mai frend" it's called marketing! just becase a doctor have given it a little more thought than your average bazaar merchant its still the same thing! natural selection is also a load of crap, but thats another topic.. remember the Swineflu? that vaccine had traces of solid metals in it! but yeeeah aaaaall good ;)
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kanadetenshi ONLINE (11/01/2013) [-] No the facts that i have studied and experimented vaccination myself for years at my university, which means i have seen and studied the evidence myself. Just because you have no education whatsoever doesn't mean everyone who is more intelligent than you is suddenly an evil jewish overlord part of a huge conspiracy.
Mercury was removed from all routine childhood vaccines in Australia in the year 2000 (with the exception of one type of HepB vaccine which contains trace amounts) and it was never in the MMR vaccine. Prior to 2000, thimerosal, an organomercury compound, was used in the manufacturing process of vaccines as a preservative. The process left only trace amounts in the finished product – you ingest more mercury when you eat a can of tuna than you would ever get from a vaccine. Also there are two types of mercury – methyl mercury is the scary environmental toxin that “bioaccumulates” in your body, and ethyl mercury the type found in thimerosal, which does not bioaccumulate.
Please if you do decide to respond. Please take off your tinfoil hat, atleast TRY to type proper sentences and back up your claims with peer reviewed sources. Otherwise i'm not even going to bother responding to a science denialist like you.
Mercury was removed from all routine childhood vaccines in Australia in the year 2000 (with the exception of one type of HepB vaccine which contains trace amounts) and it was never in the MMR vaccine. Prior to 2000, thimerosal, an organomercury compound, was used in the manufacturing process of vaccines as a preservative. The process left only trace amounts in the finished product – you ingest more mercury when you eat a can of tuna than you would ever get from a vaccine. Also there are two types of mercury – methyl mercury is the scary environmental toxin that “bioaccumulates” in your body, and ethyl mercury the type found in thimerosal, which does not bioaccumulate.
Please if you do decide to respond. Please take off your tinfoil hat, atleast TRY to type proper sentences and back up your claims with peer reviewed sources. Otherwise i'm not even going to bother responding to a science denialist like you.
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deviousdanish (11/01/2013) [-] Not the merchant, you ignorant ******* . Actually scientifically documented facts. Natural Selection is not a load of crap, it means the weak and stupid animals die off, leaving the stronger and smarter animals to survive. And, yeah, the Swine Flu vaccine started off with metals in it, considering that certain types of metals had to be used to make it, because metals make up over half of all elements.
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nationalanthem ONLINE (11/01/2013) [-]
what is with the name calling?! seriously do you have tourettes or something? are you unable to treat people with diffrent opinions like human beings? natural selection is ******** because: Scenario: you're a fish you start to develop lungs(which takes couple million years maybe?) so now you're one of the minority of fish who's making ready for life on land and that means you're the weakest link during the development and thus wont survive according to that theory! further more! why are my facts not considered facts? because the majority thinks otherwise? psst! they used to think the world was flat to! again because someone used "science" to tell them so!
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kanadetenshi ONLINE (11/01/2013) [-] That is easily the biggest ******** i have ever heard.
Natural selection works and refines itself in small steps. Say that you're a species of fish that only eats purple food, but one day a fish is born with a genetic mutation to be able to eat yellow food, now imagine that purple food became scarce and only the fish with the genes that allow them to eat yellow food reproduces, here you go natural selection.
Also your lung analogy is flawed because it makes the assumption that a transitional species is a weak link which is false, the fish that gradually started to develop lungs had the advantage over those that didn't.
Your facts are not facts because they aren't based on evidence nor are they based on reality. You can't just make up your own facts like it's an educated guess. Also at the time people thought the world was flat the scientific method wasn't established yet.
Natural selection works and refines itself in small steps. Say that you're a species of fish that only eats purple food, but one day a fish is born with a genetic mutation to be able to eat yellow food, now imagine that purple food became scarce and only the fish with the genes that allow them to eat yellow food reproduces, here you go natural selection.
Also your lung analogy is flawed because it makes the assumption that a transitional species is a weak link which is false, the fish that gradually started to develop lungs had the advantage over those that didn't.
Your facts are not facts because they aren't based on evidence nor are they based on reality. You can't just make up your own facts like it's an educated guess. Also at the time people thought the world was flat the scientific method wasn't established yet.
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nationalanthem ONLINE (11/01/2013) [-]
you do realize the the evolution THEORY(!!!!) is just a theory right?? so it's a good a guess as mine -.- besides have you ever seen evolution take place? or did you just read it in your bible written by your prophe.. i mean science books written by scientists.. the truth is NO ONE know the origins of things.. and as the saying goes.. if you repeat a lie long enough it will be accepted ass common facts and any one to question it will be ridiculed
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kanadetenshi ONLINE (11/01/2013) [-] In science a theory has a completely different meaning. What you're referring to is a hypothesis.
A scientific theory is a well-substantiated explanation of some aspect of the natural world, based on knowledge that has been repeatedly confirmed through observation and experimentation.
Examples include the theory of gravitation, cell theory, plate testonics, theory of general relativity, quantum theory and even existence itself is a theory if you take cartesian philosophy into consideration.
Evolution has actually been observed countless of times and we can see it happen ourselves, antibiotic resistance in viruses, lenski's experiment, ring species, stickleback fish, fruit flies, peppered moth and many more. Hell even in human's it's notable since we evolved mutations like lactose tolerance and blue eyes.
A scientific theory is a well-substantiated explanation of some aspect of the natural world, based on knowledge that has been repeatedly confirmed through observation and experimentation.
Examples include the theory of gravitation, cell theory, plate testonics, theory of general relativity, quantum theory and even existence itself is a theory if you take cartesian philosophy into consideration.
Evolution has actually been observed countless of times and we can see it happen ourselves, antibiotic resistance in viruses, lenski's experiment, ring species, stickleback fish, fruit flies, peppered moth and many more. Hell even in human's it's notable since we evolved mutations like lactose tolerance and blue eyes.
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nationalanthem ONLINE (11/01/2013) [-]
im certain i've red that everyone is lactose tolerant as long as its not pastorized homogenized.. im quitting here.. because you're backing your lies up with other lies in a centuries deep web of lies and i dont have the time or knowledge to properly de-bunk your on every point^^ when it comes to the diffrence between hypothesis and theory the only diffrence really is that hypothesis is a wild guess a friggin shot in the dark and a theory is a guess that has some or much "evidence" in its favour
(i mean "evidence" as it's not required to be evidence just as long as it's a pointer in that direction it counts)
(i mean "evidence" as it's not required to be evidence just as long as it's a pointer in that direction it counts)
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kanadetenshi ONLINE (11/01/2013) [-] Archaelogical and genetic data have proven that the capacity for adult lactose tolerance arose in the last 7,000 years in a subset of human populations. The fitness benefits of adult lactose tolerance were only realized with cattle domestication, which is believed to have arisen in the Middle East and North Africa roughly 7,500 to 9,000 years ago. Genetic data can be used to estimate the age of an allele. The mean estimate for the appearance of East African alleles ranges from 3000 to 6000 years ago depending on the population, while the European allele may be slightly older with a mean estimate at ~9000 years. However, these current techniques for estimating age have a large standard deviation, and the 95% confidence interval for all these populations is like 2,000 to 20,000 years.
And theories are not just guesses with "some" evidence in it's favor. It's based on emperical reality, but hey if theories are just guessed then stop believing in gravity and float the **** away.
You claim that i state lies yet you have not refuted any of my points, showing that you're just being disingenuous and living inside your own delusion rather than accepting reality.
And theories are not just guesses with "some" evidence in it's favor. It's based on emperical reality, but hey if theories are just guessed then stop believing in gravity and float the **** away.
You claim that i state lies yet you have not refuted any of my points, showing that you're just being disingenuous and living inside your own delusion rather than accepting reality.
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nationalanthem ONLINE (11/01/2013) [-]
the only thing that truly, undoubtly has evolved through time is the ability to legitimaze ******** and get people to swallow it as fact if the right person says it with the right title and/or the necessary amount of terminology
if it was completely opposite and i told you what you tell me.. you'd still call me a *********** because its not what you and the rest of the majority believes
if it was completely opposite and i told you what you tell me.. you'd still call me a *********** because its not what you and the rest of the majority believes
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kanadetenshi ONLINE (11/01/2013) [-] Not really, if it was the opposite i'd accept it because it has been verified by the scientific method.
The thing is there is a difference between denialists like you who base their arguments on emotions and ignorance and people who have actually dedicated years of studies to examine the evidence themself.
Do you know about those talent shows where people apply to thinking they can sing really amazing but end up sucking? That's how you're acting right now. You're not qualified to talk about science, you're nothing more than an arrogant little twat who thinks he actually knows things better than the elite scientists that have degree's and awards that you'd never even be able to get in your wet dreams.
The thing is there is a difference between denialists like you who base their arguments on emotions and ignorance and people who have actually dedicated years of studies to examine the evidence themself.
Do you know about those talent shows where people apply to thinking they can sing really amazing but end up sucking? That's how you're acting right now. You're not qualified to talk about science, you're nothing more than an arrogant little twat who thinks he actually knows things better than the elite scientists that have degree's and awards that you'd never even be able to get in your wet dreams.
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nationalanthem ONLINE (11/01/2013) [-]
no you wouldn't you're just to stuck on either
A: the lie and defend it at all costs not even necessarily because you believie it but becaue i call you on it and your subconscience is all like "i'll be damned if im told im not right at everything i belive in!" its common defence mechanism
or
B: you're a narrowminded little man without the capacity to imagine a reverse scenario
im guessing A since you don't strike me as a fool just a mislead knowledge seeker
A: the lie and defend it at all costs not even necessarily because you believie it but becaue i call you on it and your subconscience is all like "i'll be damned if im told im not right at everything i belive in!" its common defence mechanism
or
B: you're a narrowminded little man without the capacity to imagine a reverse scenario
im guessing A since you don't strike me as a fool just a mislead knowledge seeker
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nationalanthem ONLINE (11/01/2013) [-]
again with the name calling.. -.- you "science" people are fiercly high on yourself just because you have a nerd in a white coat backing your claims..even if they're real scientist it's not out of question they've may have been paid to do false studies or to just read a script for an hour and a half
for me this is not really about the vaccines anymore its more of a principal case for me now because you all so blindly follow people with titles and "degree's" do you have no sense of suspicion?
for me this is not really about the vaccines anymore its more of a principal case for me now because you all so blindly follow people with titles and "degree's" do you have no sense of suspicion?
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kanadetenshi ONLINE (11/01/2013) [-] "Ugh you damn academic scientists with your logic and facts"
The thing about science is that it's NOT based on one scientists opinion, it's NOT based on authority.
In order for a scientific breakthrough to be actually considered a theory it needs to go through peer-review meaning that it has to be verified It constitutes a form of self-regulation by qualified members of a profession within the relevant field. Peer review methods are employed to maintain standards of quality, improve performance, and provide credibility. In academia peer review is often used to determine an academic paper's suitability for publication.
So unless the entire scientific community (you know the academic people who rank among the most intelligent people on earth) are all part of some global conspiracy your claims are ******** . And even if you'd be so ******* crazy to assume that there is a global conspiracy you are still wrong because 90% of the scientific papers are usually dismissed in peer-review through falsifiability. Surely a global conspiracy wouldn't do that now would they.
The thing about science is that it's NOT based on one scientists opinion, it's NOT based on authority.
In order for a scientific breakthrough to be actually considered a theory it needs to go through peer-review meaning that it has to be verified It constitutes a form of self-regulation by qualified members of a profession within the relevant field. Peer review methods are employed to maintain standards of quality, improve performance, and provide credibility. In academia peer review is often used to determine an academic paper's suitability for publication.
So unless the entire scientific community (you know the academic people who rank among the most intelligent people on earth) are all part of some global conspiracy your claims are ******** . And even if you'd be so ******* crazy to assume that there is a global conspiracy you are still wrong because 90% of the scientific papers are usually dismissed in peer-review through falsifiability. Surely a global conspiracy wouldn't do that now would they.
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fgtometer (11/01/2013) [-] "I don't accept the currently fashionable assertion that any view is automatically as worthy of respect as any equal and opposite view. My view is that the moon is made of rock. If someone says to me "Well, you haven't been there, have you? You haven't seen it for yourself, so my view that it is made of Norwegian Beaver Cheese is equally valid" - then I can't even be bothered to argue. There is such a thing as the burden of proof, and in the case of god, as in the case of the composition of the moon, this has shifted radically. God used to be the best explanation we'd got, and we've now got vastly better ones. God is no longer an explanation of anything, but has instead become something that would itself need an insurmountable amount of explaining. So I don't think that being convinced that there is no god is as irrational or arrogant a point of view as belief that there is. I don't think the matter calls for even-handedness at all."
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pseudobob **User deleted account** (11/02/2013) [-] It would be extremely time-consuming and frustrating to find out exactly what ingredients are in the version of the vaccine you wish to take, then find out how each of them work, and then test the vaccine given to you to see if it matches up with the data, and THEN contact a medical professional to determine whether or not all of this information you have collected is correct, and to tell you whether or not it is safe to inject.
That same doctor can tell you what you want to know with certainty without any of those middle steps. In fact, they always do, every year, with every new vaccine. Vaccines that have been tested thoroughly and with the scrutiny of a trillion dollar industry (federally supported by your neighbors to the north). Vaccines that will work; and if one of them doesn't, you can be damn sure it'll be fixed within a week if not sooner.
Do you grow your own food? Process your own crude oil? Print your own money? Of course you don't. You don't know what goes into newspaper ink, or into the transistors of a computer chip, or even what the air is made of (down to the trace elements). And yet you're still alive, and no disaster has befallen you despite these things being unsupervised and exposed to you daily, despite you not knowing what's in them.
Vaccines can get a ******* pass.
That same doctor can tell you what you want to know with certainty without any of those middle steps. In fact, they always do, every year, with every new vaccine. Vaccines that have been tested thoroughly and with the scrutiny of a trillion dollar industry (federally supported by your neighbors to the north). Vaccines that will work; and if one of them doesn't, you can be damn sure it'll be fixed within a week if not sooner.
Do you grow your own food? Process your own crude oil? Print your own money? Of course you don't. You don't know what goes into newspaper ink, or into the transistors of a computer chip, or even what the air is made of (down to the trace elements). And yet you're still alive, and no disaster has befallen you despite these things being unsupervised and exposed to you daily, despite you not knowing what's in them.
Vaccines can get a ******* pass.
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fgtometer (11/01/2013) [-] I can't even...
I do know what they are. Just finished a B.Sc hons this May.
Just because someone makes money off something doesn't mean it's bad. I pay for food, too. You still need actual evidence.
There are side-effects to all medicine. That's a sad fact of life. Natural remedies can kill you, too. The important thing is the risk/benefit relationship. If there is enough of a benefit, a bit of risk is acceptable. That's how all medicines are assessed. Thousands, probably millions of lives saved sounds good enough to me, with a small risk of adverse reaction (usually allergies).
Could you explain what, how and why you think is going on?
I do know what they are. Just finished a B.Sc hons this May.
Just because someone makes money off something doesn't mean it's bad. I pay for food, too. You still need actual evidence.
There are side-effects to all medicine. That's a sad fact of life. Natural remedies can kill you, too. The important thing is the risk/benefit relationship. If there is enough of a benefit, a bit of risk is acceptable. That's how all medicines are assessed. Thousands, probably millions of lives saved sounds good enough to me, with a small risk of adverse reaction (usually allergies).
Could you explain what, how and why you think is going on?
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nationalanthem ONLINE (11/01/2013) [-]
this is really spot on about the medicine industry^^ www.youtube.com/watch?v=PUx4ZoiGgps ... also i didden't say its automaticly bad for you if someone profits for it i just mean that ofc people will tell you they're product is awesome no matter the ****** condition it's in because you'd buy a awsm product rather than a ****** one
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nigeltheoutlaw (11/02/2013) [+] (6 replies)
tfw I'm allergic to the tdap vaccine (it has tetanus, pertussis, and diptheria vaccinations)
Also, people who oppose vaccinations and say they have harmful side effects are some of the most inbred, stupid, and ignorant people on this planet. They're the reason that diseases that were once extinct are making a comeback since they can't be bothered to vaccinate their god damned children.
Also, people who oppose vaccinations and say they have harmful side effects are some of the most inbred, stupid, and ignorant people on this planet. They're the reason that diseases that were once extinct are making a comeback since they can't be bothered to vaccinate their god damned children.
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anonymous (11/02/2013) [+] (1 reply)
I hate when people generalize about all vaccines being autism inducing, but if you deny the possibility of people trying to poison you through a syringe then you must be very innocent; there has been cases of people disguised as medics going door to door to ''vaccinate'' you from Malaria, just to paralyse you with the shot and stealing your belongings.
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thesinful (11/02/2013) [+] (7 replies)
I had a coworker who thought that, "it's total ******** that [she] has to get vaccinated every year or she'll get fired." I pointed out that she works in a ******* hospital; not only are the odds of her getting sick higher, the odds of her getting somebody else sick are as well. Besides, how much of a hassle is it to call Employee Health twice a year to schedule your **** ? It took me 32 minutes a year and that's only because the department was a 5 minute walk from mine. Annual TB test requires you come back 2 days later to see if you have a lump basically
< mfw people claim vaccinations are bad for you, especially if they claim vaccinations cause autism.
< mfw people claim vaccinations are bad for you, especially if they claim vaccinations cause autism.
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thasmackdown **User deleted account** (11/02/2013) [-]
I think some vaccines work, I think flu vaccines mass produced for general public was an incredibly bad idea, should have been left for the already sick or the very young or old.
Middle aged or teenage kids, hell anyone that isn't elderly or a toddler should suck it up and deal, because the constant use of the flu vaccines is quickly evolving some pretty serious and nasty flu strains...
Its the same issue created by Antibiotics and MRSA.
Middle aged or teenage kids, hell anyone that isn't elderly or a toddler should suck it up and deal, because the constant use of the flu vaccines is quickly evolving some pretty serious and nasty flu strains...
Its the same issue created by Antibiotics and MRSA.
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fgtometer (11/02/2013) [-] Pretty sure Spanish Flu came around before vaccines.
I'm not 100% sure about this, but...
Viral vaccines mean that the virus spreads less. Which means that it will have less chance to reproduce, and thus less chance to mutate (viruses can only reproduce inside cells). Which actually makes them less prone to evolution, despite the increased selection at work.
I'm not 100% sure about this, but...
Viral vaccines mean that the virus spreads less. Which means that it will have less chance to reproduce, and thus less chance to mutate (viruses can only reproduce inside cells). Which actually makes them less prone to evolution, despite the increased selection at work.
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thasmackdown **User deleted account** (11/02/2013) [-] Viruses evolve rapidly, we produce a new changed vaccine for the flu yearly because we cause it to evolve so fast. What does not die, is more resistant.
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fgtometer (11/02/2013) [-] Not necessarily, because vaccines do not kill viruses. They prevent infection from the strain that the vaccine was based on. Mutation still occurs, of course, because some level of infection will always remain. But the new strain need not be "more resistant" in the same way that bacteria become resistant to antibiotics. Antibiotic-resistant bacteria suck because we can't kill them with antibiotics. In the case of flu, the virus just has to avoid binding to the antibodies our bodies have made against the old strain. So the actual pathology (how the virus affects us when we're infected) isn't necessarily different.
Part of the reason flu viruses arise so often is they also come from animals, and we don't vaccinate them... Yet.
Part of the reason flu viruses arise so often is they also come from animals, and we don't vaccinate them... Yet.
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thesinful (11/02/2013) [-] You should include healthcare workers in that as well. If you're going to be around sick people, you need to make sure that you don't get sick or make them sicker. Hell, that's why the hospital has a policy of calling in if you're sick even if you can still work.
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jalthelas (11/02/2013) [+] (8 replies)
My sister isn't getting her baby vaccination shots.
I personally don't think it's a good idea, and I hope he doesn't get diagnosed with a life-threatening illness.
I personally don't think it's a good idea, and I hope he doesn't get diagnosed with a life-threatening illness.
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jalthelas (11/02/2013) [-] I mean, the whole excuse that vaccines are completely unnecessary, or that the government is using people as test subjects (I've actually heard someone say that), is ******* ridiculous.
The whole reason vaccines were discovered and distributed was to keep people from dying.
The whole reason vaccines were discovered and distributed was to keep people from dying.
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jalthelas (11/02/2013) [-] Yeah, I think I'd rather live during the days where a cut had the chance to spread infection throughout a limb and you'd need to amputate.
Much better than waiting for these "doctors" to eventually inject their test serum into enough people so they can initiate Phase Two and turn over half the world population into mindless slaves.
Much better than waiting for these "doctors" to eventually inject their test serum into enough people so they can initiate Phase Two and turn over half the world population into mindless slaves.
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brisineo (11/02/2013) [+] (6 replies)
I'll be a devil's advocate here, but I'm not vaccinated. For a legitimate reason too.
No, not because muh autism, or any of that scare mongering thing. See, my grandmother was vaccinated, and she got horrible side effects and degrading health as a result, including shingles. My mother was vaccinated, and the same thing happened.
She noticed a lot of similarities at least genetic-wise between me and her so she decided not to have me vaccinated to prevent it, and as I grew older to have the same kind of health problems outside the vaccinations, she had it on the money. It probably wouldn't have helped either. I already have a genetically weakened immune system and grandmother, mother and I have had the same diseases. Vaccinated against them or not.
A common misconception is that medical procedures, such as medication and vaccines, work the same for everyone, when in fact, slight genetic differences can make individual reactions unpredictable at times. They're just tailored for the majority of the population.
And it wasn't like the swine flu was anything special either. Got over it in a couple days.
No, not because muh autism, or any of that scare mongering thing. See, my grandmother was vaccinated, and she got horrible side effects and degrading health as a result, including shingles. My mother was vaccinated, and the same thing happened.
She noticed a lot of similarities at least genetic-wise between me and her so she decided not to have me vaccinated to prevent it, and as I grew older to have the same kind of health problems outside the vaccinations, she had it on the money. It probably wouldn't have helped either. I already have a genetically weakened immune system and grandmother, mother and I have had the same diseases. Vaccinated against them or not.
A common misconception is that medical procedures, such as medication and vaccines, work the same for everyone, when in fact, slight genetic differences can make individual reactions unpredictable at times. They're just tailored for the majority of the population.
And it wasn't like the swine flu was anything special either. Got over it in a couple days.
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anonymous (11/02/2013) [-]
If she got Herpes Zoster from the vaccine, could you imagine what would happen if she actually contracted the real virus? Because that is something you need to thing about, given that you're not vaccinated.
And furthermore, she got Zoster? Well, just skip the varicella vaccine then, if's utterly moronic to go without polio, tetanus, hep B, measels and pertussis vaccine. People used to die from these diseases and as they are caused by viruses/toxins, we have no treatment except of symptomatic treatment.
And furthermore, she got Zoster? Well, just skip the varicella vaccine then, if's utterly moronic to go without polio, tetanus, hep B, measels and pertussis vaccine. People used to die from these diseases and as they are caused by viruses/toxins, we have no treatment except of symptomatic treatment.
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sytheris ONLINE (11/02/2013) [-]
While I see, and understand your point, this does not mean it's wrong to get Vaccinations, nor is it right to deny a young child vaccinations for any other reason besides genuine medical ones like yours.
People who don't give their children Vaccinations for religious or psychotic reasons are potentially causing the illness or death of their own children. There are plenty why are not as informed or logical as your Mother.
People who don't give their children Vaccinations for religious or psychotic reasons are potentially causing the illness or death of their own children. There are plenty why are not as informed or logical as your Mother.
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crzylion (11/02/2013) [-]
the reason for that is what we call herd immunity in biology
in case you dont want to wiki it, and you should
it basicly means that if your kid isnt vaccinated, and gets the virus, the virus can mutate in your baby, become different enough to affect vaccinated people, and could kill/cripple them.
The only reason there is no polio is because at one point over 95% of the people were vaccinated meaning the virus simply couldnt find a place to mutate, and died off.
this is why everyone with any kind of biological education flies into a rage at this anti vaccination propaganda.
in case you dont want to wiki it, and you should
it basicly means that if your kid isnt vaccinated, and gets the virus, the virus can mutate in your baby, become different enough to affect vaccinated people, and could kill/cripple them.
The only reason there is no polio is because at one point over 95% of the people were vaccinated meaning the virus simply couldnt find a place to mutate, and died off.
this is why everyone with any kind of biological education flies into a rage at this anti vaccination propaganda.
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neofirefly (11/02/2013) [-] Dude you are awesome. What people don't understand is that no one is the same, especially genetically speaking. A lot of medicines and vaccines will work differently for everyone due to, literally, their DNA. See when medicines and vaccines are in your body they can turn on and off genes, anyone will remedial knowledge of science knows that just by turning a gene off or on can have dramatic consequences sometimes.
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motherfuckingkenji ONLINE (11/02/2013) [+] (2 replies)
Nobody is going to see this among the sea of comments, but tada.
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jinjo (11/02/2013) [+] (7 replies)
I'm not afraid, I just feel like I want my body to be able to fight things off on its own if I can leave it to that.
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bobbysnobby (11/02/2013) [-]
You give your self the virus but either deactivated by only having the virus be a few of the proteins, or you give your self a tamed version of the virus. The body then builds its own immunity from being poorly assaulted by these strains of viruses. The whole point of Vaccines is not to protect YOU its to protect US. Vaccines work because enough people take them that the virus doesnt have enough hosts to mutate so we build what is called a Herd immunity. If people stop taking the vaccines we lose herd immunity and the whole population becomes susceptible to the new strain of the virus. Part of the reason people get so up in arms about the topic is because parents who dont vaccinate their kids arent just hurting their kid, they are hurting all of us and if enough people fallow suit in their denial of vaccines then we all suffer.
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crzylion (11/02/2013) [-]
this is what a vaccine is: a virus that would normally JUST KILL YOU END OF STORY, and they scramble it rather thoroughly, so you get the virus all in little parts that arent lethal in itself. Your body gets to know these parts, and prepares the right antibodies needed to fight this particular virus.
So what a vaccine is is literally a medicine that allows your body to fight it off.
AND NOW IN METAL: YOU BASICLY SHOW YOUR CREW A CORPSE OF THE MUTANT SPECIES THAT WANTS TO KILL YOU, AND YOU TELL THOSE ******* "LEARN ITS WEAKNESSES, LEARN TO KILL IT".
So what a vaccine is is literally a medicine that allows your body to fight it off.
AND NOW IN METAL: YOU BASICLY SHOW YOUR CREW A CORPSE OF THE MUTANT SPECIES THAT WANTS TO KILL YOU, AND YOU TELL THOSE ******* "LEARN ITS WEAKNESSES, LEARN TO KILL IT".
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chargrilledawesome (11/02/2013) [+] (1 reply)
Good, I hope she dies and is prevented from passing on her stupid to the next generation.
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dominatorxxx (11/01/2013) [+] (42 replies)
For the record vaccines aren't as safe as everyone says for example there's lie in some of the "mandatory" vaccines and Google sodium hydroxide
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ruebezahl (11/01/2013) [-] And this article describes why this is ******** :
www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/toxic-myths-about-vaccines/
You ask people to google stuff, yet you don't take the three minutes to use Google to find out why your argument is nonsense?
Dihydrogen monoxide can also kill you and actually kills thousands of people each year. Yet it is in everything you drink in extremely high concentrations, and miraculously, you are still alive.
www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/toxic-myths-about-vaccines/
You ask people to google stuff, yet you don't take the three minutes to use Google to find out why your argument is nonsense?
Dihydrogen monoxide can also kill you and actually kills thousands of people each year. Yet it is in everything you drink in extremely high concentrations, and miraculously, you are still alive.
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dominatorxxx (11/01/2013) [-] www.fda.gov/BiologicsBloodVaccines/Vaccines/ApprovedProducts/ucm094050.htm look at the PDF and then come up with a better rebuttal
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noblexfenrir (11/01/2013) [-] Yes, they are actually as safe as everyone says. Do some damn research on the subject, and you would know WHY they use sodium hydroxide in it. It's use is for pH balance you imbecile.
They also have mercury and formaldehyde in them as well, now do you know why they use these ingredients or do you just think "Bad thing is bad in one scenario so it's bad in every scenario"?
They also have mercury and formaldehyde in them as well, now do you know why they use these ingredients or do you just think "Bad thing is bad in one scenario so it's bad in every scenario"?
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noblexfenrir (11/01/2013) [-] I justify it by them not being toxins, simple as that.
The three ingredients that I mentioned are dangerous in certain conditions, however, they have advantageous properties when used in the vaccine. The danger is avoided by not complimenting the conditions that allow those toxins to be harmful.
sodium hydroxide in this case, is absolutely harmless because it is simply used to neutralize the pH. Mercury (Methyl not metal) is used as a preservative to stop the bacteria/organism for growing/accumulating, it is also used in such a small amount that it is not harmful. Formaldehyde is used as an inactivating agent to make the process of letting the body adjust and create antibodies much easier, again used in such small amounts that it is not harmful.
Stop this "Muh feelings" crap, it isn't harmful. Curious, do you have a degree, if so in what?
The three ingredients that I mentioned are dangerous in certain conditions, however, they have advantageous properties when used in the vaccine. The danger is avoided by not complimenting the conditions that allow those toxins to be harmful.
sodium hydroxide in this case, is absolutely harmless because it is simply used to neutralize the pH. Mercury (Methyl not metal) is used as a preservative to stop the bacteria/organism for growing/accumulating, it is also used in such a small amount that it is not harmful. Formaldehyde is used as an inactivating agent to make the process of letting the body adjust and create antibodies much easier, again used in such small amounts that it is not harmful.
Stop this "Muh feelings" crap, it isn't harmful. Curious, do you have a degree, if so in what?
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dominatorxxx (11/01/2013) [-] heres some of those adverse affects death, blindness, deafness, mental retardation, brain damage, heart disease and many many more your telling me your perfectly comfortable risking that if your child is already healthy and not to mention when breast feeding the child gains its immune sys from its mother and if shes been vaccinated why do you need to vaccinate your child?
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noblexfenrir (11/01/2013) [-] "heres some of those adverse affects death, blindness, deafness, mental retardation, brain damage, heart disease and many many more"
Stop spouting useless rhetoric, I want cases and sources (Peer reviewed, not some useless speculation article from the dailymail.) citing that vaccines were the cause. Because as far as I know, and trust me I had to study this subject fairly heavily, all of the journals of medicine and diagnosis I've come across, don't seem to agree with you.
"your telling me your perfectly comfortable risking that if your child is already healthy"
I'm making them safer, because yes while they are healthy to a degree, many diseases their bodies (and ours) are not developed to fight as well as others can occur. Considering the risk is very low for even getting a basic infection from a vaccine, I'll take my chances.
" not to mention when breast feeding the child gains its immune sys from its mother"
...Yes, for a little while. Not for life you ******* moron. It needs to develop it's own immune system, the child is protected while it's developing by breastfeeding but it does not inherit the antibodies, nor does the body gain the information it needs to tackle such a disease if it does occur.
"if shes been vaccinated why do you need to vaccinate your child?"
Because it doesn't inherit the ******* antibodies or the information to the levels it would if it was vaccinated.
You vaccinate your child out of their well-being, not doing so is idiotic and danger.
What grade are you in? You can't honestly tell me you took a high school, much less a college level biology course and don't know this **** .
Stop spouting useless rhetoric, I want cases and sources (Peer reviewed, not some useless speculation article from the dailymail.) citing that vaccines were the cause. Because as far as I know, and trust me I had to study this subject fairly heavily, all of the journals of medicine and diagnosis I've come across, don't seem to agree with you.
"your telling me your perfectly comfortable risking that if your child is already healthy"
I'm making them safer, because yes while they are healthy to a degree, many diseases their bodies (and ours) are not developed to fight as well as others can occur. Considering the risk is very low for even getting a basic infection from a vaccine, I'll take my chances.
" not to mention when breast feeding the child gains its immune sys from its mother"
...Yes, for a little while. Not for life you ******* moron. It needs to develop it's own immune system, the child is protected while it's developing by breastfeeding but it does not inherit the antibodies, nor does the body gain the information it needs to tackle such a disease if it does occur.
"if shes been vaccinated why do you need to vaccinate your child?"
Because it doesn't inherit the ******* antibodies or the information to the levels it would if it was vaccinated.
You vaccinate your child out of their well-being, not doing so is idiotic and danger.
What grade are you in? You can't honestly tell me you took a high school, much less a college level biology course and don't know this **** .
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zealotgold (11/01/2013) [-] your body gets dead or dieing virus in the flu shot so your body is better at fighting off the flue or virus when it gets introduced into your system. also any toxins in are gonna be far less then what the child will breath in daily so the child will be fine so do it for the child's sake or go to a 3rd world country where you'll see why they do it.
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dominatorxxx (11/01/2013) [-] actually a lot of people take those and still get it, truth be told there is the possibility of good vaccinations however look at the gov that makes them saying obama care is good we dont spy on americans we dont break the law calling snowden a criminal and also killing legal americans over sea with drone strikes you think they can honestly be trusted?
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noblexfenrir (11/01/2013) [-] Vaccinations validity has nothing to do with the ******* government. It's based on peer reviewed experiments and studies that have refined the process and have been shown to work.
Look around you, how big is polio? If you have a computer I'm going to say it's non-existent where you live. Lucky you sparky, thank vaccines.
Look around you, how big is polio? If you have a computer I'm going to say it's non-existent where you live. Lucky you sparky, thank vaccines.
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dominatorxxx (11/01/2013) [-] ok just be sure to remember how "free" we are and that big pharma makes more money curing something but also the possibility of causing more issues in the process we have the capability to magnetically fire a tungsten rod with enough force that it causes the amount of damage as a mini nuke but we cant make a single drug or vaccine with out side effects does that honestly seem logical to you?
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noblexfenrir (11/02/2013) [-] "we have the capability to magnetically fire a tungsten rod with enough force that it causes the amount of damage as a mini nuke but we cant make a single drug or vaccine with out side effects does that honestly seem logical to you?"
Yes, yes it ******* does. First of all, what lol? How do these two in any way equate? Physics and biology are two completely different fields.
The reason it has side-effects is due to the fact that not everyone has the same biological makeup, we are all generally the same, but we react to things differently. This is why is large cases of testing (Let's say in 20,000 people), if all of them are curing but say some get diarrhea as a result, some get headaches, some get nausea, some get pains in various areas, etc.
However, the one underlying accomplishment is what they are curing or trying to aid is working. Unfortunately, you can't fix every single problem in vaccines or in drugs, biology simply hasn't advanced that far yet to account for every single different in our genetics, medical history, etc.
Again, research the ******* subject before spouting your ignorance, it might help.
Yes, yes it ******* does. First of all, what lol? How do these two in any way equate? Physics and biology are two completely different fields.
The reason it has side-effects is due to the fact that not everyone has the same biological makeup, we are all generally the same, but we react to things differently. This is why is large cases of testing (Let's say in 20,000 people), if all of them are curing but say some get diarrhea as a result, some get headaches, some get nausea, some get pains in various areas, etc.
However, the one underlying accomplishment is what they are curing or trying to aid is working. Unfortunately, you can't fix every single problem in vaccines or in drugs, biology simply hasn't advanced that far yet to account for every single different in our genetics, medical history, etc.
Again, research the ******* subject before spouting your ignorance, it might help.
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noblexfenrir (11/02/2013) [-] To benefit themselves, and to get themselves a profit. However, a better product results in more profit than creating illnesses. Please remember "Big Pharma" isn't one group, it's multiple producers that actually do compete in the market.
It doesn't matter what I think, it matter on what actually occurs. Again, read a ******* journal on the subject, and actually research it instead of spouting useless ignorance.
It doesn't matter what I think, it matter on what actually occurs. Again, read a ******* journal on the subject, and actually research it instead of spouting useless ignorance.
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noblexfenrir (11/02/2013) [-] Please remember, I don't really reply for your benefit. You're an ignorant fool who I could care less about trying to show reality to. It's more to show people who read your ignorant rhetoric that you're wrong and have no basis except useless speculation for what you think is truth.
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dominatorxxx (11/02/2013) [-] yet you insult me but you say your trying to teach me? last i checked when your in the right there is no need to insult some one and i have looked at it im lets see 20 now i've been scientifically and logically based since i was say about 8 when i had to take care of myself because daddy was sick and mommy died i have looked into these things read tons of medical lit mainly from the drug company's because the fact is a journal isnt factual mainly because they cant be sued for omitting information the normal media is controlled just like damn near everything else is in the country now if you really think your right then do as you wish and believe your truthful government when they tell you everything is fine because news flash nothing is fine and never will be but things will never get better untill we get off our lazy asses and do what is right but thats a different subject so believe your right and walk away if you truly feel that
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noblexfenrir (11/02/2013) [-] "yet you insult me but you say your trying to teach me?"
I literally just said I couldn't care less about you. I said I care about people who are reading your comments and even giving the slightest bit of credit to your opinion.
" i have looked at it im lets see 20 now i've been scientifically and logically based since i was say about 8"
Nothing you have said has been logical and nothing you have said is scientific. You were saying that sodium hydroxide is toxin in the vaccine but clearly it isn't, how do you explain that point of view outside of "muh feelings"?
"from the drug company's because the fact is a journal isnt factual"
You're joking right? The journal's have every step, every analysis and conclusion drawn from experimentation, and they can't be sued lol? You've never read a journal or even looked up one have you?
"do as you wish and believe your truthful government"
I don't trust my government, nor do I like what it's currently doing. As I have said though sparky, this isn't a government issue, it's a scientific one.
Stop injecting your useless tin-foil crap into science. Even /pol/ would say you're ******* retarded.
I literally just said I couldn't care less about you. I said I care about people who are reading your comments and even giving the slightest bit of credit to your opinion.
" i have looked at it im lets see 20 now i've been scientifically and logically based since i was say about 8"
Nothing you have said has been logical and nothing you have said is scientific. You were saying that sodium hydroxide is toxin in the vaccine but clearly it isn't, how do you explain that point of view outside of "muh feelings"?
"from the drug company's because the fact is a journal isnt factual"
You're joking right? The journal's have every step, every analysis and conclusion drawn from experimentation, and they can't be sued lol? You've never read a journal or even looked up one have you?
"do as you wish and believe your truthful government"
I don't trust my government, nor do I like what it's currently doing. As I have said though sparky, this isn't a government issue, it's a scientific one.
Stop injecting your useless tin-foil crap into science. Even /pol/ would say you're ******* retarded.
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zealotgold (11/02/2013) [-] because we don't have the technology to do it, it sucks i know but its all we got and people are working on it daily to reduce the symptoms of the virus but we only can do so much with out other things we add in to it doing worse
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dominatorxxx (11/02/2013) [-] no they do but when it comes down to it doctors and pharmacists are payed for the amount they can sell just like for example windows 7 and windows 7 ultimate 7 alone is sold for 100-200 dollars i cant remember which but ultimate is 500-700 now the norm version crashes from a number of different errors but with ultimate the same things that could crash the normal version doesnt crash ultimate and granted you get what you pay for but now a days people can barely afford the basics
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noblexfenrir (11/02/2013) [-] They are sold for that much because most of their sales are to companies, they are so high to combat loss of revenue to piracy.
There are many reasons windows can crash, there is nothing that causes the basic windows to crash but not ultimate. They are the same ******* thing, except one comes with added externalities, there is no change to the base OS.
There are many reasons windows can crash, there is nothing that causes the basic windows to crash but not ultimate. They are the same ******* thing, except one comes with added externalities, there is no change to the base OS.
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noblexfenrir (11/02/2013) [-] If we have the knowledge you claim then you know, as I've said. Basic and ultimate are the same ******* thing minus externalities. I honestly can't make an opinion based off of what you've tried, but you can easily go online and see many people with windows ultimate have crash and BSoD issues.
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zealotgold (11/01/2013) [-] truth be told they do because the vaccine is the virus diluted in it, its a normal side effect of it, but it stops it from doing worse to your system than with out it, also Obama care has nothing to do with and its what make it fair to spy on everyone or it'll be called profiling , and yes its your government if you don't like it let them know and would you rather have good american soldiers die on the ground or send in a drone that has no human causality and can be replaced? so yes i do trust my government they may screw up but they still here and will fight for me.
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dominatorxxx (11/02/2013) [-] im pointing at trusting them at all you cant they have done everything wrong in the book possible against their oath which is high treason automatically and they by law are supposed to be hanged for it and considering they dont mind breaking laws punishable by death what makes you think they care about others any more to honestly help them?
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zealotgold (11/02/2013) [-] but your only looking at the wrong as well, you can post what they have done bad but you do gotta look at both sides of the coin they have done good as well but in a environment of media and the world at our finger tips, whats gonna get more views? the government doing something right? or the government doing something bad/wrong?
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plainarcane **User deleted account** (11/01/2013) [+] (4 replies)
I love it when people's stupidity leads to them being removed from the gene pool.
If only it happened more often...
If only it happened more often...
