Refresh Comments
Anonymous comments allowed.
57 comments displayed.
#3
-
denniswilles (12/07/2015) [-] 
In Germany, if someone breaks into your home and you defend yourself and hurt them in any way, they can sue you and get you arrested. I'm not even joking.
#353 to #3
-
dantemp (12/08/2015) [-] Every time I see German man criticising their crime and financial politics I cringe so ******* hard my stomach might shrink to the point of a singularity. You live in one of the most prosperous and safe countries in the world. The people you are looking up to, have one percent of their population in prison, 6 times more murders per capita, getting sick means you are going to get broke and their economy, seemingly reliant on war to get anywhere, is nevertheless falling behind. If you want these ridiculous laws, maybe you should move to ******* America and clear a space in your country for someone that will appreciate it.
#305 to #3
-
hansdieterli (12/08/2015) [-]
What the **** ? This statement is so horribly wrong. Of course you can hurt someone who is attacking you. Even if he just breaks in and stands there like a fool you can push him out of your home. You just have to be reasonable about it. You are not allowed to bash his ******* skull in but otherwise you should be fine.
You can claim to have acted in self-defense if your rights are in danger. So of course you can do something about it. If they protest and attack you, you can attack back and so on.
Source: Literally 5 minutes of googling. Also I am a law student, going to write my first bar exam next year.
Tl;DR: OP is full of **** . The laws are reasonable.
You can claim to have acted in self-defense if your rights are in danger. So of course you can do something about it. If they protest and attack you, you can attack back and so on.
Source: Literally 5 minutes of googling. Also I am a law student, going to write my first bar exam next year.
Tl;DR: OP is full of **** . The laws are reasonable.
#121 to #3
-
dinozzzo (12/08/2015) [-] i read an article from norway about a guy ho broke in to a house with a bat, and on the second the owner was awake and had an ax by his bed. and when he heard the guy he woke up, grabbed the ax and ran into his daughters room to check on her and when i took her and was about to leave the guy was standing in the staircase, and he told him to **** of or he would swing his ax, and the guy ran up the stairs screaming and swinging his bat, and the homeowner swung his ax ONCE, hit the guy in the rib cage, broke a few bones and made a hell of a cut, then he ran to the neighbors, called the cops and had to go to trial, he lost and had to sit in jail for a few years. for protecting his daughter and himself...
#127 to #121
-
talonhalfstar (12/08/2015) [-] Germany seems to have some problems. Or just terrible laws.
#112 to #3
-
suchusername (12/08/2015) [-] In Germany i dont think someone would enter your home and try to hurt you
#347 to #249
-
suchusername (12/08/2015) [-] I live in Spain and it works differently, burglars study the people who live in a house and the times it is empty, they just go in steal and go out in less than 10 minutes, they dont go in if they know there are people there...
#151 to #112
-
heartlessrobot (12/08/2015) [-] This is people we're talking about here.
Of course they will.
Of course they will.
#69 to #3
-
anon (12/08/2015) [-]
That ******* ******** . Where I live (in the US) We have 2 important statutes (laws). Stand Your Ground and another called The Castle Doctrine. Castle basically means that if anyone were to break into your home or illegally trespass onto my property I have a reasonable suspicion that they mean to cause harm to me. Including but not limited to violent death. All action, lethal or otherwise is protected as self defense. The Stand Your Ground is basically if you feel with reasonable suspicion that another individual means to do you harm, it can be met with equal force. So, if a guy pulls a gun on me, lethal force is not only protected, but encouraged. And then we've got a clause in the Samaritan Law that basically says we can use lethal force to protect our neighbor's property. I'm kinda in some backwoods country, so it's not advised to steal from the surrounding area. Especially since damn near everyone I know has at LEAST 3 firearms, and all know how to use them.
#94 to #69
-
medexplain (12/08/2015) [-] Castle doctrine means you can assume a trespasser within your home intends harm simply by virtue of being there, and justifies any level of self defense (including lethal).
Stand your ground means you have no duty to try to flee before fighting back. You can, as you might guess, stand your ground and fight.
You were right on both of those.
The Samaritan Law however means you can use lethal force to protect your neighbor's LIFE, not property.
Lethal force is not warranted for protection of property, only protection of life. If some guy grabs your/your wife's purse and starts running away, you're not allowed to pull out your gun and shoot them.
This is the key distinction that a lot of people end up getting sued/charged for. They chase someone down and shoot them. Once you start actively chasing someone (not just repositioning, but truly pursuing), you're in the wrong.
Stand your ground means you have no duty to try to flee before fighting back. You can, as you might guess, stand your ground and fight.
You were right on both of those.
The Samaritan Law however means you can use lethal force to protect your neighbor's LIFE, not property.
Lethal force is not warranted for protection of property, only protection of life. If some guy grabs your/your wife's purse and starts running away, you're not allowed to pull out your gun and shoot them.
This is the key distinction that a lot of people end up getting sued/charged for. They chase someone down and shoot them. Once you start actively chasing someone (not just repositioning, but truly pursuing), you're in the wrong.
#229 to #111
-
bestestname ONLINE (12/08/2015) [-] "Move and you're dead"
Well he's a man of his word
Well he's a man of his word
#116 to #111
-
medexplain (12/08/2015) [-] Did not know.
I don't think any other state allows it though.
I don't think any other state allows it though.
#178 to #116
-
tealcanaan (12/08/2015) [-] Entire west Dakotas, Oklahoma, Missouri, Montana, Wyoming allow pursuit of thieves in the same manner. Coincidentally those state are among the ones with the some of the weakest gun laws in the nation,
#118 to #116
-
rattybastard ONLINE (12/08/2015) [-] Honestly, probably not. Texas is kinda obsessive with making sure we are safe where we live.
#87 to #69
-
anon (12/08/2015) [-]
Sounds like either Texas or South Carolina. Where I am, Castle is very easy to do if there is a female in the house. Wife/daughter? "Your honor, I was afraid for my life and the safety of my wife/daughter. I feared that this 'upstanding citizen here' would rape my wife/daughter." No jury in their right mind would convict.
#31 to #3
-
gongwiththewind (12/07/2015) [-]
in Montana its the exact opposite...
if someone attempts to do a crime on your property you can legally blow them away... a few years ago a guy blew away 2 robbers that broke into his next door neighbor's house because they ran across his lawn as they were going to the get away car....
as long as its not pre-meditated and show that you thought that they were trying to cause you harm...
if someone attempts to do a crime on your property you can legally blow them away... a few years ago a guy blew away 2 robbers that broke into his next door neighbor's house because they ran across his lawn as they were going to the get away car....
as long as its not pre-meditated and show that you thought that they were trying to cause you harm...
#29 to #3
-
anon (12/07/2015) [-]
§ 230 Grenzen der Selbsthilfe
§ 230 wird in 1 Vorschrift zitiert
(1) Die Selbsthilfe darf nicht weiter gehen, als zur Abwendung der Gefahr erforderlich ist.
******** it says you are allowed to use reasonable force but not kill or hurt someone if he isn't posing a threat anymore.
If you disarm and or knock out the intruder and then proceed to beat the living **** out of him even if he stopped attacking you or is not fleeing he can sue you.
You can disarm, arrest or even kill intruders given they are threatening do harm to you or peope around you.
§ 230 Grenzen der Selbsthilfe
§ 230 wird in 1 Vorschrift zitiert
(1) Die Selbsthilfe darf nicht weiter gehen, als zur Abwendung der Gefahr erforderlich ist.
******** it says you are allowed to use reasonable force but not kill or hurt someone if he isn't posing a threat anymore.
If you disarm and or knock out the intruder and then proceed to beat the living **** out of him even if he stopped attacking you or is not fleeing he can sue you.
You can disarm, arrest or even kill intruders given they are threatening do harm to you or peope around you.
#39 to #29
-
denniswilles (12/07/2015) [-] That's the thing. An intruder doesn't count as a threat unless he is actually armed and points the gun at you. If he's just in your house, you have no right to defend yourself. Touch him and you're not acting out of self-defense. Even if he has a gun you need to prove he used or intended to use it on you first. If you shoot him because you saw his gun, you're guilty.
Besides, in a scenario like this, how the **** would you have the time to check if the guy has a gun? Do you ask him politely? You're dead before you can check. But if you shoot first, you get arrested. Great ******* system.
Besides, in a scenario like this, how the **** would you have the time to check if the guy has a gun? Do you ask him politely? You're dead before you can check. But if you shoot first, you get arrested. Great ******* system.
#20 to #14
-
denniswilles (12/07/2015) [-] Then you're a murderer, unless you can prove with absolute certainty that he attacked and tried to kill you first. So basically, unless he shoots you critically first, you're guilty.
..probably best to hide the body if that happens
..probably best to hide the body if that happens
#272 to #30
-
suttballion (12/08/2015) [-]
No! You wait until he shoots you in the head to take action.
#50 to #30
-
atomicjojo (12/07/2015) [-]
there is a difference between what SHOULD be, and what is law. Nobody is saying you SHOULDN'T defend yourself, ******* , but in the eyes of the law of the German government, that would be illegal.
#47 to #35
-
anon (12/07/2015) [-]
Oh, yeah. Because everyone has a bunch of spare guns lying around. Or if they have one, they need to explain how they shot the guy and he got their gun. Or if they killed him some other way then planted the gun on him, they'd need to explain how he got the gun and didn't use it.
And so on and so forth and shut up.
And so on and so forth and shut up.
#23 to #20
-
pawnman ONLINE (12/07/2015) [-] I would think it would be easier to deal with a dead body than a person suing you. Is Norway's water cold year round? the body would sink and stay sunk.
I am guessing the guy who tries to rob you doesn't live nearby so no one should come looking in your area. He/She would just go on a missing person list.
I am guessing the guy who tries to rob you doesn't live nearby so no one should come looking in your area. He/She would just go on a missing person list.
#5 to #3
-
frostdrachen (12/07/2015) [-] Same in Finland, if you use more force than the other one, you get sued.
Scenario: Someone breaks into your house to steal, and is unarmed. You cannot confront them in any other way than unarmed, too. If you hit them with a baseball bat, a frying pan or anything longer than your arm, you get sued.
Scenario: The thief has a pistol on his belt, and a bat in his hand. you cannnot shoot him with your shotgun, rifle or whatever, as he hasn't pulled the gun. Neither can you grab a knife, as he has a blunt weapon and a knife would be bladed.
Scenario: Someone breaks into your house to steal, and is unarmed. You cannot confront them in any other way than unarmed, too. If you hit them with a baseball bat, a frying pan or anything longer than your arm, you get sued.
Scenario: The thief has a pistol on his belt, and a bat in his hand. you cannnot shoot him with your shotgun, rifle or whatever, as he hasn't pulled the gun. Neither can you grab a knife, as he has a blunt weapon and a knife would be bladed.
#27 to #5
-
anon (12/07/2015) [-]
In the U.S. it's a lot simpler than that in most places. This describes the self defense laws in 90% of the U.S.:
If you are not in danger of death/great bodily harm you can not take any action against them that might be lethal action.
If you are in danger of death/great bodily harm then you can take action of ANY severity against the transgressor to save yourself. Lopsided force is ENCOURAGED as it leads to better survival rate.
The U.S. philosophy on self defense is basically that if they didn't want to die then they shouldn't have put you in fear for your life.
If you are not in danger of death/great bodily harm you can not take any action against them that might be lethal action.
If you are in danger of death/great bodily harm then you can take action of ANY severity against the transgressor to save yourself. Lopsided force is ENCOURAGED as it leads to better survival rate.
The U.S. philosophy on self defense is basically that if they didn't want to die then they shouldn't have put you in fear for your life.
#220 to #27
-
sephirothpwnz (12/08/2015) [-] however that is used as an overview for self defence, for example if they attempt to accost you when discovered then the use of force would typically be seen as acceptable to most juries, however if discovered they immediately attempted to run away and you chased and shot them for example you would be charged, as they made no signs of aggression towards your person. it is all handled in a case by case basis (most of the time)
#115 to #27
-
rattybastard ONLINE (12/08/2015) [-] Castle law exists in a large chunk of the US. If a stranger is in your home without your consent, the assumption is that he is there to harm, therefore lethal action can be used. Its not quite that simple normally, its something.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castle_doctrine
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castle_doctrine
#32 to #27
-
gongwiththewind (12/07/2015) [-]
most places dont even require you to be in physical harm...
simply thinking you might get harmed is enough to use force (but is harder to prove in court)
simply thinking you might get harmed is enough to use force (but is harder to prove in court)
#19 to #5
-
anon (12/07/2015) [-]
Second hand story I've heard:
Burglar breaks into womans house, slips on the wet floor and breaks his leg.
She got sued, lost in court and had to pay for his treatment.
They basically said her house was not safe for criminals to illegally trespass while attempting to commit a crime.
Burglar breaks into womans house, slips on the wet floor and breaks his leg.
She got sued, lost in court and had to pay for his treatment.
They basically said her house was not safe for criminals to illegally trespass while attempting to commit a crime.
#10 to #5
-
bulwark (12/07/2015) [-] We have the same laws here in Denmark... but you can bet your ass I won't give a **** about that.
In most cases, people have no idea the burglar is there, since I can't imagine him going on Facebook writing "About to burgle this place # ******************* "
So you could safely beat them down and keep them captive or even kill them and dispose of the body, and nobody would know they were even there.
In most cases, people have no idea the burglar is there, since I can't imagine him going on Facebook writing "About to burgle this place # ******************* "
So you could safely beat them down and keep them captive or even kill them and dispose of the body, and nobody would know they were even there.
#6 to #5
-
denniswilles (12/07/2015) [-] You're really just supposed to hide and call the police. Or help him carry your belongings to his car while you're at it.
If someone breaks in somewhere, armed or not, they're a criminal and shouldn't have any rights.
If someone breaks in somewhere, armed or not, they're a criminal and shouldn't have any rights.
#274 to #4
-
pippymcbumlover (12/08/2015) [-] how i think it works here is if the person is just there stealing **** and you dont confront them you're not allowed to use excessive force, but if they start coming to you if you lock yourself in your room, and they break in by all rights you can kill the ****** with the exception of "overdoing it" so like if you say smashed a cunt with a lamp and it killed them, that'd be fine, but if you repeatedly smashed their head in after the initial strike to make sure, then you are in the wrong. i could be wrong, but i THINK thats how it works here in the UK if i remember correctly.
