But I got all A's. .. This is the reason why extracurriculars are so heavily stressed upon in college applications and look the best on resumes. Blaming employers for your own lack o But I got all A's This is the reason why extracurriculars are so heavily stressed upon in college applications and look best on resumes Blaming employers for your own lack o
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> hey anon, wanna give your opinion?
asd
#1 - dashgamer
Reply +84 123456789123345869
(11/12/2013) [-]
This is the reason why extracurriculars are so heavily stressed upon in college applications and look the best on resumes.   
Blaming employers for your own lack of initiative isn't going to make you any more qualified.
This is the reason why extracurriculars are so heavily stressed upon in college applications and look the best on resumes.
Blaming employers for your own lack of initiative isn't going to make you any more qualified.
#23 to #1 - Sampsy
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(11/13/2013) [-]
No. Universities genuinely don't care about extracurricular activities. All they want to know is if you can handle the work and have a real interest in the subject.
#47 to #1 - hellsjester
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(11/13/2013) [-]
not everyone can take those extracurricular activities, because they are working to pay off school early. Not to mention your family can not afford to help you on this endeavor, because they are poor, but make too much to get any type of assistance because government logic (don't help those actually in need and working full time plus other jobs and pay lazy ***** that aren't disabled and perfectly capable of working money for jerking off). so you work 8 hours almost every day on top of 8-10 hours a day at work leaving just enough time for homework and sleep.
#59 to #47 - anon id: 650f37de
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(11/13/2013) [-]
Agreed. Also, the whole reason societies spend so much money in these institutions is so that they will train you to be useful or at least guide you into learning the right stuff, and they're not doing that. It makes no sense to put that burden on the student.
User avatar #73 to #1 - mistafishy
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(11/13/2013) [-]
The biggest problem I see is the fact that everyone is more concerned with just getting into college.

Good grades are the best thing you can have for college. Unless you plan to play very seriously in college any kind of sport or want a scholarship for it, very few if any colleges give a rat's ass what you do outside of school with the exception of seeing that you don't just sit on your hands all day.

Personally, I've worked two jobs and have done 3 extracurricular activities and I assume that that should be sufficient if not rather good for an average applicant for college and also reasonable enough for a job after college- with the degree they want of course.
#3 to #1 - guu
Reply +1 123456789123345869
(11/12/2013) [-]
Comment Picture
User avatar #34 to #1 - nigeltheoutlaw
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(11/13/2013) [-]
I don't know, in my my experience colleges only really gave a **** about good grades and test scores. At the end of the day they want a student that will graduate with a good GPA, not a well rounded human being.
User avatar #2 to #1 - orkanoidz
Reply +14 123456789123345869
(11/12/2013) [-]
Still doesn't change the fact that the government(s) in question still have their heads in their asses.
User avatar #13 to #2 - sketchE
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(11/13/2013) [-]
the plan of encouraging schools to teach better was good the way it played out not so good
User avatar #4 - acidreign
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(11/13/2013) [-]
If anyone wants to have a discussion about the public school system and how its failing, I wouldn't mind chatting.
User avatar #24 to #4 - ydosac
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(11/13/2013) [-]
Just finishing my primary school prep- 6 Teaching degree in Australia and there are a lot of things that have probably changed since you have been in primary school. Being in Australia I'm guessing there also a lot of things different. If you want to watch a video that I think you'll find interesting look up TED talks by Ken Robinson. It's about how Schools are too focused on getting results of English and Maths and not looking at the Arts based subjects such as art, dance, music and drama.

I feel like that school isn't for everyone and even myself growing up didn't find it that interesting and now I'm a fully qualified primary school teacher, It wasn't until I found an interest in teaching that I took my education seriously and now I love it. Going to through high school I never did the best but now In University I get HDs for pretty much everything.

This brings me onto my final point that is reinforced by the previous paragraph and is something that is all the rage in schools in Australia. It's called enquiry based learning, giving the students ownership of their education and making sure that relates to real life learning and instead of being the person at the front of the room telling the students what to learn we are given the job of teaching the students on how to learn and we work in partnership to find the answers that are put forward by them and myself.

Also if you want to see an education system that is really working that's Finland, they don't have standardised Tests until they are into year 7 and they register some of the highest test results in the world.
User avatar #29 to #4 - tenthousandmarbles **User deleted account**
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(11/13/2013) [-]
I liked my public school. I don't know how to explain it, but there wasn't a hateful teacher in my school. We were all encouraged to do sports, extra activities and help the community. My principal never really was super "tough" on the scumbags who just wanted to fight. The man would try to get to know them and understand what they wanted to do. I saw that man give up once my entire high school career, and it was on a kid who brought brass knuckles to school and tried to fight the wrestling coach (who happened to be a collegiate champion). My school put you in the drivers seat after freshman year. If you wanted to take shop classes you could. Like science? There hundreds of oppertunities. I know i hated english so i took the required three years, and my Junior and senior year were loaded with math and science, i even took two college courses at the local community college. I can say with confidence 99% of my school were in classes they enjoyed and tried it. My best friend i played football wasn't very intelligent but really great with his hands, so he took a lot of shop courses and wound up going to trade schools. I feel like more highschool needs to be tailored like this, catering to what the kids want to do and enjoy, that way they can plan their future on that, not get to senior year thinking "i guess ill go to here" and fail out.
User avatar #64 to #4 - TexMex
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(11/13/2013) [-]
It's not good. And don't get me wrong, I support education with all my heart but the way they educate is ******* idiotic.
User avatar #5 to #4 - tomahawkit **User deleted account**
Reply +15 123456789123345869
(11/13/2013) [-]
I believe public school should be optional, but whenever I say that I get red thumbed to ****
User avatar #35 to #5 - nigeltheoutlaw
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(11/13/2013) [-]
It is optional, isn't it? You can be home schooled or go to a private school.
User avatar #78 to #35 - tomahawkit **User deleted account**
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(11/13/2013) [-]
only accredited schools, and homeschooling varies per state.
its not like you can just take classes off the internet and learn what actually applies to you.
User avatar #79 to #78 - nigeltheoutlaw
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(11/13/2013) [-]
I can't say I disagree with only allowing accredited schools. You need to have some semblance of quality in schooling.

Who would choose what courses apply to the child? The parents? The child themselves? Would they only be from accredited schools, or could any yahoo with some money and a website start offering courses? How would those courses translate into credits for higher education? The current system isn't perfect, but getting rid of compulsory education is not the answer in the slightest.
User avatar #80 to #79 - tomahawkit **User deleted account**
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(11/13/2013) [-]
well the student would pick the class. because the student would know what it wants, usually. when it comes to quality of education, its pretty easy to read reviews of schools online by former students; you can do that now. how the courses could translate to credits is taking standardized tests to see how much the kid knows.

also employers can give tests of their own, instead of trusting that the kid learned because he got a degree.
User avatar #81 to #80 - nigeltheoutlaw
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(11/13/2013) [-]
Standardized tests are a huge reason why public schools are failing, so your solution is to remove the schools and keep the tests? I don't see how that could give work. Letting kids choose their own courses isn't the best idea either, since most children under the age of 18 are stupid and would either A) pick the smallest amount of the easiest courses, or B) not take any courses since they have zero obligation to. To the students who did want to succeed, they would still have to take the same math, English, history, and science courses that they do now in compulsory education in order to pass the standardized tests, so what purpose would getting rid of the schools serve in the end?

Who's going to write these tests for the employers? What will the tests cover? How will there be any sort of quality control in the tests that are written if its done by each employer? There's a lot more to a technical career than just knowing the material; you need to have promptness, teamwork skills, dedication, etc. which are all things that can't be tested for.
User avatar #82 to #81 - tomahawkit **User deleted account**
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(11/13/2013) [-]
the reason why standardized tests are a problem in schools is because they decide if the school gets funding or not, with no school, there is no funding regardless of the grade on it. and if a kid really would rather do nothing instead of get a skilled job, then let him get a manual labor job. if he doesn't want to work, than maybe Charles Darwin was right about the whole natural selection thing

when I meant standardized test, I may have miscommunicated my point, the test would only test you on your marketable skill and nothing else like a test on C++ or some ****

the employer test really could be optional too, and whoever is in charge of hiring people would write it. what you said -> you need to have promptness, teamwork skills, dedication, etc. which are all things that can't be tested for. cant really be taught in schools either.
User avatar #83 to #82 - nigeltheoutlaw
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(11/13/2013) [-]
Darwinism doesn't apply to social situations, only to evolution. Using it here is inappropriate for your argument. Kids can already get manual labor jobs if they have no interest in schooling, so that's not really supporting your idea that compulsory education should be gotten rid of.

So, there would be a specific test for each specific degree that test nothing beyond it? That wouldn't work. Colleges assume a solid educational foundation in a wide variety of fields, so a kid who knows nothing outside of their particular degree, let's say programming in this case, would fail miserably their first semester.

These skills can and are taught in schools. Why do you think schools punish tardiness heavily, force group projects, have classrooms, and reward good grades? It's not for ***** and giggles, it's to instill good ethics into students so they can, in theory, be productive members of society once they finish their basic schooling and move on. I only said that they're difficult to gauge in a written test, but they can be and are taught.
User avatar #84 to #83 - tomahawkit **User deleted account**
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(11/13/2013) [-]
its perfectly possible to evolve socially, kind of like how its very uncommon to see a witch burning. but a while ago it was not.

its perfectly possible to have multiple degrees, its just up to the consumer at that point to find what is necessary for them. **** college

what you said -> Why do you think schools punish tardiness heavily, force group projects, have classrooms, and reward good grades? there is no grading system for that at all, and if there was I would have failed that class. im late to school almost every day, incomprehensibly anti-social, have ****** grades, and yet somehow im one of the only people I know with morals left. almost everyone I know steals, does drugs, cheats, or would beat someone up for an opinion they don't like. if anything school teaches you that cheating get you ahead in life because all they care about is grades an not how much you learn.
User avatar #85 to #84 - nigeltheoutlaw
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(11/13/2013) [-]
It's possible for social evolution, but it doesn't follow the rules of Darwinism in the slightest since there is no natural selection. It's not comparable.

It seems like you have a vendetta against any sort of educational institution in general.

Anecdotal evidence doesn't really make for a good argument. I'm sorry you had a poor schooling experience, but the majority of people did not and did learn how to be a productive members of society, even if you personally didn't. Besides, grading something isn't a prerequisite for learning it; schools teach social standards just as much as they teach educational standards.
User avatar #86 to #85 - tomahawkit **User deleted account**
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(11/13/2013) [-]
k
User avatar #87 to #86 - nigeltheoutlaw
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(11/13/2013) [-]
I know you're disillusioned because you didn't/don't like your schooling experience, but you're not making a strong case against compulsory education in the slightest. I can see you ran out of things to say so that's why you're truncating the discussion, but if you want to convince anybody that you're right and not just a bitter, anti-social brat then you should probably work on your argument.
User avatar #88 to #87 - tomahawkit **User deleted account**
Reply 0 123456789123345869
(11/13/2013) [-]
special k
#89 to #88 - nigeltheoutlaw
Reply 0 123456789123345869
(11/13/2013) [-]
Well, that was a bad end to what began as a rather interesting discussion. Enjoy high school, kid.
User avatar #90 to #89 - tomahawkit **User deleted account**
Reply 0 123456789123345869
(11/13/2013) [-]
double k
User avatar #6 to #5 - acidreign
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(11/13/2013) [-]
What do you mean by that?
User avatar #7 to #6 - tomahawkit **User deleted account**
Reply +5 123456789123345869
(11/13/2013) [-]
people who don't try in school fail out, so maybe it should be legal to drop out before you are 18, so your not wasting everyone's time
User avatar #8 to #7 - acidreign
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(11/13/2013) [-]
Well, the legal dropout age is 16 I believe, although with parents consent you can dropout after 8th grade. I think some students don't realize the importance of an education, so I personally support the dropout age restriction.
User avatar #9 to #8 - tomahawkit **User deleted account**
Reply +2 123456789123345869
(11/13/2013) [-]
in Illinois its a bit different, you have no choice, unless you have a lawyer.

personally though I don't think there should be a standardized system at all, and employers just tested new people. that way you can learn from the internet things you like that wouldn't normally be accredited by the state.


inb4 that wont work, I learned html5 and javascript in one summer, compared no nothing in 4 years of highscool
User avatar #17 to #9 - asleepyplatypus
Reply +1 123456789123345869
(11/13/2013) [-]
This is a response to both you and acidreign.
What is your opinion on classes such as independent studies?
(In case you don't know, an independent study is basically a class that is designed by the student to study a subject that the school does not offer in a class, within reason. Of course the school's administration much approve of the course work and such (at my school you pretty much have to write a syllabus and submit it to the administration.))
For example: My independent study is actually an internship at an aquarium where I get experience handling animals that I would like to study. And job experience on top of that.
Others can include anything from Japanese to photography.


User avatar #18 to #17 - acidreign
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(11/13/2013) [-]
Honestly, if you're passionate and determined about self studying, you're going to get way more out of it than you would a normal course. I'm a CS major, and most of what I've learned thus far has been self taught.
User avatar #10 to #9 - acidreign
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(11/13/2013) [-]
Oh, I didn't realize it was different in each state. Yeah, public schools seem to be more concerned with high test scores and successful classrooms than successful students who actually understand material. I taught myself Python over one summer, and took my first computer science class the next year, and barely learned anything new.
User avatar #11 to #10 - tomahawkit **User deleted account**
Reply +1 123456789123345869
(11/13/2013) [-]
im in c++ now and I have no idea what the **** im doing, the only things I know about it are the things that can more or less transfer over from javascript
User avatar #12 to #11 - acidreign
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(11/13/2013) [-]
I took a C++ class as well, and since I already knew Java, it was an easy transition. I plan to stick with java, and do mobile development. C++ is very useful though, stick with it.
User avatar #14 to #12 - tomahawkit **User deleted account**
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(11/13/2013) [-]
I don't have much of a choice if I plan on passing highschool. what Ill probably end up doing is learn it threw the internet, go to a community college for a degree on it, then use it in harmony with javascript in the unity engine. and as a fallback become an alpha tester or something
User avatar #15 to #14 - acidreign
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(11/13/2013) [-]
Sounds good. If I don't end up in mobile dev, I'll probably do programming for games.
#62 - valiantaura
Reply +8 123456789123345869
(11/13/2013) [-]
Look on the bright side, he can always get a job at Aperture Science.
#70 - yetiyitties
Reply +3 123456789123345869
(11/13/2013) [-]
I will learn things that have nothing to do with my job, I will have art as my major, have no refferals, use the time I should be spending to strengthen my resume to complain on the interenet, then I will complain even more when nobody hires me.
I will learn things that have nothing to do with my job, I will have art as my major, have no refferals, use the time I should be spending to strengthen my resume to complain on the interenet, then I will complain even more when nobody hires me.
#56 - smartwon
Reply +3 123456789123345869
(11/13/2013) [-]
Hello There
User avatar #58 - SubjectThree
Reply +2 123456789123345869
(11/13/2013) [-]
One word :Internships.
User avatar #69 to #58 - exceeding
Reply -1 123456789123345869
(11/13/2013) [-]
and if you got 2 interns and the manager is into manga then he will make intershipping
User avatar #76 to #69 - SubjectThree
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Let me guess: english isn't your first language.


Is punctuation exclusive to the english language or something?
User avatar #77 to #76 - exceeding
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(11/13/2013) [-]
i dont know what you are talking about i try lots of stuff and learn all day eveery day but thing dont always work so i try and make them work so family in oerusgang can be proud very of sun learning beatiful english languge
User avatar #32 - thradrenaa
Reply +2 123456789123345869
(11/13/2013) [-]
I personally believe that kids today shouldn't aim for collage as a goal. They should aim for a career that will support them/their family. If that so happens to be through collage go for it. Maybe you can go to a trade school for electrical work or welding and have a career that way. That's art degree your parents are helping you foot the bill for isn't getting you a job.
User avatar #42 to #32 - spacestalin
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(11/13/2013) [-]
>That's art degree your parents are helping you foot the bill for isn't getting you a job.

See, this type of thinking really bothers me.

I completely agree with you that college is not for everybody, is not an automatic way to get a job (not anymore anyway) and shouldn't be seen as just another thing that you have to do because your parents whant you to.

That said, the idea that Art/Humanities degrees are of lesser value than any other is complete bollocks. You can totally get a job with a History degree or an English degree or a Liberal Arts degree, in everything from translation and education to work in a museum or as a researcher. And beyond that if you're also good at managing people or you're good at Math.

Really, having a Humanities degree is not synonym with not having real-world skills or starving anymore than blowing through an Engineering degree with only C's and not learning **** is.
User avatar #48 to #42 - thradrenaa
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(11/13/2013) [-]
It's not really that you won't have a job. Just that you're limited to a lot less places with open positions where you can get hired. Most of the higher degrees like a Masters and a Ph.D should get you a really nice job in your field. Except for the fact that a lot of people in the Humanities don't retire at 55 or so and keep working because they have tenure as a professor, are the curator of a museum, or many other well to do jobs. It's not that they have a lesser value, i adore history and study it actively even though i'm going for an aerospace engineering degree. The issue i see is too much supply of people with a degree and not enough demand for that degree. Too many people are getting degrees in fields that aren't in demand and are frustrated when they can't get their dream job.
User avatar #55 to #48 - spacestalin
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(11/13/2013) [-]
Well, that I can agree with.

It's true that a lot of degrees (specially in the Humanities) are overdemanded. But I blame the fact that most degrees are overdemanded (brought by the insistence of people in getting any degree for the sake of having it) combined with the fact that degrees in the Humanities are seen as easier or less demanding.

So you have thousands of people going for the "easiest" degrees they can think of just because of their parents, thinking they will magically get a job just because they have a piece of paper saying "I graduated", and being dumbfounded when they end up as a Barista at Starbucks.

And then you have people thinking: Humanities = Barista at Starbucks. Instead of: Being a twat who never bothered in getting any skill = Barista at Starbucks.
User avatar #36 to #32 - nigeltheoutlaw
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(11/13/2013) [-]
>collage
>collage
>collage
I do agree with your point though, college isn't and shouldn't be for everyone, and it's a shame that it's just about impossible to get a decent job with just a high school degree nowadays.
User avatar #50 to #36 - thradrenaa
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(11/13/2013) [-]
Too many people see trade schools as a place flunkies go. It's look down upon to be in the trades. If you go and get certified as a welder you can make some serious cash. Same with plumbers and electricians.
User avatar #54 to #50 - nigeltheoutlaw
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(11/13/2013) [-]
It's dumb. Trades are an excellent way to make a good living and learn a useful skill.
#40 - xentacle
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(11/13/2013) [-]
Unless you want a *********job this post is accurate, but none of you have the right to complain...   
   
Employers aren't going to employ someone who has just done well in their tests because some people are just smart and can do minimal work and get decent grades. Some people just sit at home doing nothing and then take their tests and pass with flying colours. Employers want proof that you're a motivated person, capable of sorting things out for yourself and that you're good at co-operating/working in a team.   
Interviewers ask questions like these to filter out the lazy people who never went out and got experience for  themselves, school is not a place to get these life skills, school helps you academically, and whilst academia is important, so are life skills. You can bet that if someone who has a lot of life-skills but lacking the grades on most terms won't be granted the job because they are looking for the all round best candidate.   
   
You can't expect to just go to school, browse the internet everyday,  get your grades, then land in some comfortable job (although some lucky people can -.- ).  Because the REAL WORLD just isn't like that.
Unless you want a *********job this post is accurate, but none of you have the right to complain...

Employers aren't going to employ someone who has just done well in their tests because some people are just smart and can do minimal work and get decent grades. Some people just sit at home doing nothing and then take their tests and pass with flying colours. Employers want proof that you're a motivated person, capable of sorting things out for yourself and that you're good at co-operating/working in a team.
Interviewers ask questions like these to filter out the lazy people who never went out and got experience for themselves, school is not a place to get these life skills, school helps you academically, and whilst academia is important, so are life skills. You can bet that if someone who has a lot of life-skills but lacking the grades on most terms won't be granted the job because they are looking for the all round best candidate.

You can't expect to just go to school, browse the internet everyday, get your grades, then land in some comfortable job (although some lucky people can -.- ). Because the REAL WORLD just isn't like that.


User avatar #43 to #40 - sodaberg
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(11/13/2013) [-]
I think your definition of the 'REAL WORLD' is pretty narrow and uninspired. If you work hard in school you can expect to go on to get a good degree at a good university, which should really involve you studying something you enjoy, which is a form of training in itself to do the job you want to do. Social attitudes that emphasise preparing for a dull 9-5 grind for the rest of your instead of working hard at school to move onto further quality training/education for a topic that interests you are detrimental to social mobility.
User avatar #49 to #43 - xentacle
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(11/13/2013) [-]
My definition of the real world is legit. What Im trying to say is, you can't get everything handed to you on a plate and if you think that's illegitimate you're crazy.

I know someone who got 9 A*'s at gcse, and AAB at A level, and got barely any offers due to his personal statement being ****. Uni is the same, they want individual flare from every candidate especially now because its becoming more and more competitive to get into.

and the 9-5 job you're hinting at is what I'd call a ********* job. So if you read what I've said properly you'd realize that your comment is irrelevant
#61 to #49 - anon id: 650f37de
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(11/13/2013) [-]
The problem is your perception of what the school should be doing. If ppl are graduating without the proper skills, that means the school isn't doing ****. The whole reason we have them is to train professionals, not to just give u a nice piece of paper with your name on it. If that means that evaluation methods need to change, or fewer ppl graduate, then so be it; but u can't reasonably expect ppl with no knowledge of what awaits them after college to simply find that out, and to learn the right skills all on their own.
User avatar #67 to #61 - xentacle
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(11/13/2013) [-]
I don't really understand what you're saying here, nor do I understand you're backtracking this to the education system as its just completely irrelevant. What I think you've done is managed to misunderstand the difference between a life-skill (e.g conversation skills, teamwork, character building) and a skill which can be obtained by an education (like a PHD.)
As I have said before, the school is obliged to help you ACADEMICALLY, but its up to YOU AND ONLY YOU to develop life skills
Example..the school can give people the necessary skills to properly identify a type of flower, and learn properly how to dissect it and conduct tests on it, form here you could get a certificate to work in a lab.
however this lab has many values and seeks individuals who are capable of working together (TEAMWORK IS A LIFE SKILL), and people who have spent a lot of time outdoors working with flowers (INDEPENDENT RESEARCH IS A LIFE SKILL)

The school is not expected to get you off the ******* computer and get outside OUT OF SCHOOL HOURS to go and learn about THE REAL ****** WORLD

yes you most definitely can expect people to develop skills on their own, you can do charity work, volunteer, Be a part of something bigger like a band or a cadet organization, get work experience, go on expeditions, run a club, learn a new skill. Those are to name a few.
Also, log-in , faggot.
#74 to #67 - anon id: 650f37de
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(11/13/2013) [-]
Teamwork can be learned in courses, independent research can be made mandatory, internships can be made mandatory and guided, and certificates can be offered by the school itself. I.e.: Some colleges in other countries require you to do an internship in order to graduate. My high school required me to do social work in order to graduate.

The original post is about how students come out of college with very few to none applicable skills. The education system is largely responsible for that.
User avatar #75 to #74 - xentacle
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(11/13/2013) [-]
The students coming out of college with no applicable skills are the ones I spoke of , who don't take courses and things like that, the ones who did absolutely **** all, just read their textbooks and take the test. SOME schools CAN do the things you have said. But they also have very good reasons not to, whatever they may be.

I suggest next time you respond to a point, you actually read what the person had said. Otherwise you come across as an idiot.

User avatar #31 - randomserb
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(11/13/2013) [-]
With the situation as it is now, initiative is the key. Do some extracurricular **** or get a job.
#26 - LtMcG
Reply 0 123456789123345869
(11/13/2013) [-]
Tests provide a measure to certify that you are knowledgeable in the field of such study. Real world applications is up to you. The school/university/college has no obligation to provide you that experience because it is about your motivations. Furthermore, if the education system were to provide that experience, they would be highly dismissed as something "simulated" and "surreal."
User avatar #39 to #26 - nefarian
Reply +1 123456789123345869
(11/13/2013) [-]
Spoilers: I'm pretty sure we all know that